Jim, The book you're using sounds good but I wasn't able to find it on Amazon.com. Could you post either the author or (preferably) the ISBN number?
Thanks John ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jim MacDiarmid" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "ActiveServerPages" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Monday, August 05, 2002 1:20 PM Subject: RE: ECommerce Web site - Getting started advice > Diane, > > I like your estimates much better... :) The lady I'm doing the research on > this for, ( who also owns the craft store), I think would have a corinary if > I told her $5K per year. :) Ack! > > As for the book.. I just ordered "Beginning Ecommerce: With VB, ASP, ADO and > MTS" from Barnes and Noble. It sounded pretty good and was rated 4 to 5 > stars. :) > > I'm not discouraged... I know there is lots involved, and I really would > like to have the experience. I'm also looking at it as a way to help my mom > make more money too since she does crafts and has them on consignment at the > store. :) > > Thanks again, you give good advice! :) > Jim > > > |-----Original Message----- > |From: Diane Schips [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] > |Sent: Sunday, August 04, 2002 10:45 AM > |To: ActiveServerPages > |Subject: RE: ECommerce Web site - Getting started advice > | > | > |Sorry, Kuminda, it doesn't have to be as complicated as you say. > | > |First, you can get a good host account for about $45.00/month that includes > |SQL, and secure transactions (using the web host's certificate). That's > |$540/year. I assume that the customer already has a merchant account, and > |would need to talk to her (his?) bank about adding Internet transactions. > |If the internet host account has monthly costs that are too high, someone > |like WorldPay is an option (though they are high - you can get a better > |deal). Your minimum estimate of $5000 per year is way out of line. > | > |Building the site in ASP, insuring complete transactions is easily handled. > | > |I'm not going to go over this point by point. Each of the points you make > |does need to be considered, but they are all easily handled. Put them all > |together and you have a complex programming job, but a do-able one. I > |believe this is intended to be a learn-as-you-go website in a number of > |ways. That's fine. The request was to help him get started, and my answer > |was geared to that request. > | > |As you say., and arts and crafts site doesn't need to be too complicated. > |If scalability becomes an issue, then the customer will be able to afford a > |more robust solution. > | > |You are right in that the business end needs to be addressed. > | > |Jim, don't get discouraged. You can do this. A book was > |suggested, reading > |it or something like it would be valuable to insure that all the business > |considerations are considered. These considerations should be resolved > |before you write a single line of code. So get thee to a bookstore! Then > |break the job down into pieces, and work on each piece (keeping the overall > |picture in mind). If the client can't pay much, then you'll have > |to balance > |what the cost should be with what you're getting out of it in terms of > |learning and experience. > | > |Off to finish my own current ecommerce project! > | > |Good Luck > |Diane > | > | > | > |-----Original Message----- > |From: Kuminda Chandimith [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] > |Sent: Sunday, August 04, 2002 4:53 AM > |To: ActiveServerPages > |Subject: RE: ECommerce Web site - Getting started advice > | > | > | > |As Tore Would have said, "One of my Pet Peeves". And this post has very > |little to do with ASP and generally talking about implementing an > |e-commerce > |business. > | > |I will forget that you are a programmer who want to do some programming :). > |Let me give you some basics details. > | > |The first thing you have to look in to is that how much that your customer > |is willing to or could pay, and what is his/her requirements in broader > |perspective. If the customer has no money to pay, I would not even consider > |writing a single source code. Not just because that I am not getting Paid, > |but also considering that to maintain an e-commerce site there is > |substantial cost. If customer cannot afforded the same the whole exercise > |will be a white elephant. (Believe me I have seen this happening) > | > |If you are considering a self programmed (custom developed) web site > |hosting. with fully functional credit card Payment systems etc, . > |You would > |be looking at minimum 5,000 USD a year hosting and related cost. > |If you are > |planning to have your own SSL certificates etc, this cost would go much > |higher. > | > |When consider this in the business perspective I would consider something > |like following. > | > |Since your commodity is Arts and Crafts, Consider developing a simple good > |looking HTML based web site. Find one of those ready to use online shopping > |cart. (I've used "Click and Build" from WorldPay UK and that has a lot of > |features that You could use for your customer, but there may be > |better ones > |out there.) Then place the web site in and see how it Perform for few > |months. > | > |But above is just what my opinion. Should you decide that you > |need to build > |a custom solution for the customer you may have to consider following. > | > |1. Hosting : where you want to host the solution, In-house or at a shared > |hosting location. > | > |2. Security: How you going to secure the transactions: In-terms of > | a. Communications : SSL, Server certifications etc, > | b. Database : You need to have A secure database. Some countries > |forbid you to store Credit Card, Customer information in your location > |unless proper security is assured. > | C. Application : Use of methodologies that would implement proper > |transactions, (no halfway transactions etc,) > | > |3. Site Management: How the merchant could manage the product catalogues, > |Ordering details etc,. > | > |4. Application scalability and architecture. > | > |5. Credit card Payments and Merchant Accounts: The customer may > |need to have > |merchant account and connectivity to a payment gateway. In some countries > |you will not have proper Payment gateways, which would make you to have > |merchant account in a different country. and there is lot formalities > |involved in getting a merchant account from 2nd country. if so you may > |decide to go ahead with a virtual merchant Accounts Like PayPal or > |worldpay. > | > | > |6. Credit card fraud protection. How your CC gateway provider protect you > |from fraud. What are the facilities available for you to assess > |risk of each > |credit card transaction. (let me add some from my experience: We started an > |e-commerce site about 3 years a go and we ware so overjoyed when > |we received > |our first few orders, which included few Lap-tops. We ware in haste to > |fulfil the Order and managed to deliver the products with in the Promised > |delivery days. After 3 months we received notice for credit card disputes > |from the Bank and we lost about 3 Laptops due to fraudulent transactions. > |We ware not given instructions from our payment gateway provider how to > |evaluate risks for credit card transaction. After few such transactions the > |management made a decision that we have to remove the Credit card payment > |facility from our web site. ) > | > |The DB Structure and implementation of Shopping cart etc, will be the least > |important thing when you consider the Above aspects. the post from Diane > |describes a typical Shopping site implementation. Of-course you may need to > |customise According to your needs. I have to mention there are > |issues in the > |Payment aspects specially regarding storing the credit Card numbers in your > |Database. > | > |Also remember there is few more concepts that in implementing shopping > |sites. Things such as > | > |1. SKU's Or Stock Keeping Units. (This is when you have the same commodity > |in different configurations EX. Same shirt may be available in different > |colours.) > | > |2. Shipping Cost calculations. > | > |3. Taxation > | > |4. Promotions managements (Buy one get one free Or buy One Of X and Get Y > |for xx.xx Price ) etc, > | > |So remember the Programming part of an e-commerce site is plays a > |very small > |role in implementing a e-commerce business. There is much larger and > |Business level needs that you need to consider. > | > | > |HTH > | > |cheers > | > | > |Kuminda Chandimith > |Sr. Technical Consultant > |Ducont.com FZ-LLC > |Tel: + 971-4-3913000 Ext 237 > |Fax: +971-4-3913001 > |http://www.ducont.com > | > | > | > |-----Original Message----- > |From: Falls, Travis D (CASD, IT) [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] > |Sent: 04 August 2002 00:10 > |To: ActiveServerPages > |Subject: RE: ECommerce Web site - Getting started advice > | > | > |Diane, that was a great description on the basics of an ecommerce site. I > |especially like the way you broke out the tables. I have a quick question > |on this matter, how is a merch. account different from verisign? > |Is it that > |verisign validates the credit card, and merch does the bank transaction? > | > | > |Regards, > | > |Travis D. Falls > |Software Engineer > |The Hartford (CASD) > |860.547.4070 > |[EMAIL PROTECTED] <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > |http://www.thehartford.com > | > | > |-----Original Message----- > |From: Diane Schips [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] > |Sent: Saturday, August 03, 2002 3:54 PM > |To: ActiveServerPages > |Subject: RE: ECommerce Web site - Getting started advice > | > | > |OK. My advice? Write a clear, functional spec. Put together some page to > |show what the site will look like. Then run it by the customer. NOW is > |when you want to find out that your ideas and hers (his?) don't match. > | > |With your clear spec, design a data base, then code around it. > | > |The hardest thing you'll have to deal with is moving from a state machine > |(VB) to a stateless machine (the web). All the server knows is that its > |sending a page to a browser. It has no idea of what page was last sent to > |the browser, if any. So you need to write into your code a way to keep > |track of who is doing what. A person selects a product, then clicks some > |kind of select button and goes to another page. OK, now you have whatever > |product info was sent from the last page's form, and whatever you can look > |up from the database based on info you have from the last form. Does that > |info include a customer number? That could be in a cookie (people can and > |do disable cookies), a session variable (can also be disabled, and not > |supported in all browsers), a hidden variable (subject to hacking) or > |something else? I won't go into this discussion here, its a discussion all > |unto itself, and something we all struggle with. > | > |Some other things to keep in mind: > |I recommend the following tables: customer, product, payment info, header, > |detail, login. The customer table holds customer info, the product table > |holds product info, the payment table includes the customer ID, and holds > |payment info (someone might want to keep on record more than one credit > |card), The header table includes order information, the detail > |table include > |information regarding item order, and the login table includes passwords, > |usernames, and customer IDs. > | > |The header table might include order number, customer number, order date, > |shipping info (if different form billing info), payment info, if > |credit card > |was accepted or declined, if order was shipped, etc. The detail > |table might > |include info on the order number this record belongs to, the item ordered, > |the quantity, the price (always get your price from a lookup, never pass it > |along on forms. It's too easy for someone to hack when passing through > |forms) and other info related to the item. > | > |Customers need to edit their own info (address, phone, etc), and their > |payment info (if you choose to store it). You need to link ordered product > |with order info, and to a customer. You need to be able to get rid of > |records created by orders that were initiated, but not complete. You need > |to give your customer a way to update product info, and to check on order, > |customers, declined credit cards, orders that need to be shipped, etc. > | > |Your customer needs an internet merchant account, which you will have to > |integrate with (easy). > | > |it sounds like a lot, but then most programs are. Break it down into it's > |pieces, then work on each piece. But it is imperative that you have an > |overall picture in your mind! > | > |Good luck > |Diane > | > |-----Original Message----- > |From: Jim MacDiarmid [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] > |Sent: Friday, August 02, 2002 5:02 PM > |To: ActiveServerPages > |Subject: RE: ECommerce Web site - Getting started advice > | > | > |No real clear spec.. > | > |As for the other questions.. I've been doing VB programming for the last 5 > |years developing custom security applications, COM Objects, ActiveX > |Controls, applications that interact with a database, advanced WIN32 API > |programming, as well as some web applications in both Cold Fusion using > |Fusebox and some ASP, but no ecommerce stuff, just intranet. > | > ||-----Original Message----- > ||From: Diane Schips [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] > ||Sent: Friday, August 02, 2002 4:22 PM > ||To: ActiveServerPages > ||Subject: RE: ECommerce Web site - Getting started advice > || > || > ||Ecommerce probably isn't a good starter program. And it's a bit difficult > ||to know where to tell you to start. So I'll begin by asking you some > ||questions. How experienced are you as a programmer? How much > ||experience do > ||you have with database programming? Programming for the web? Do > ||you have a > ||clear spec in what is wanted? > || > ||Diane > || > ||-----Original Message----- > ||From: Jim MacDiarmid [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] > ||Sent: Friday, August 02, 2002 3:55 PM > ||To: ActiveServerPages > ||Subject: ECommerce Web site - Getting started advice > || > || > ||I'm in the process of gathering information on doing a web site for the > ||owner of a arts and crafts store in my area. My mom sells her > |crafts in the > ||owners store on consignment so I wanted to cut her a special deal > ||since this > ||is my first "customer" and first project. > ||I was wondering if anyone here would be able to give me tips on how to get > ||started on this. Also if there are any good books I should look at that > ||would give me ideas and/or step by step advice on putting together a > ||shopping cart,etc. > || > ||Thanks in advance!, > || > ||Jim MacDiarmid > ||Manassas, Virginia > ||Yahoo & AIM: Jim6763NVA > || > || > || > ||--- > ||You are currently subscribed to activeserverpages as: > ||[EMAIL PROTECTED] > ||To unsubscribe send a blank email to > ||%%email.unsub%% > || > || > ||--- > ||You are currently subscribed to activeserverpages as: > ||[EMAIL PROTECTED] > ||To unsubscribe send a blank email to > ||%%email.unsub%% > || > | > | > | > |--- > |You are currently subscribed to activeserverpages as: > |[EMAIL PROTECTED] > |To unsubscribe send a blank email to > |%%email.unsub%% > | > | > |--- > |You are currently subscribed to activeserverpages as: > |[EMAIL PROTECTED] > |To unsubscribe send a blank email to > |%%email.unsub%% > | > | > |This communication, including attachments, is for the exclusive use of > |addressee and may contain proprietary, confidential or privileged > |information. 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