It's good that I misunderstood you re the discobolus. Re symmetry I mean that the greeks measured their sculptural proportions in units that were to be the same for left and right when seeing the figure standing at rest frontally or posterially. Thus one of the measurements of the face would divide in in half vertically;then each half in half, etc.; other horizonal lines divide the face horizontally in thirds, then those in thirds, etc. The size and placement of the features would be the same measurements for left and right sides. In today's super models, etc. we see the same preference for symmetrical facial features, a lucky accident of nature, and the art of makeup and digital corrections. In real life, almost everyone, however, has assymetrical variations in facial features, and even some minor differences in left-right body anatomy.
Another feature of the greek classic sculpture of figures in action was to show the body at the most extreme moment of contained energy. Thus the discobolus is represented at the split moment before the wound-up body energy is released in throwing the discus (closed form).Later in the hellenistic era, the rteverse is true. then the body is usually shown just after the release of energy (open form). The greeks were highly sophisticated in the design of positive and negative spaces in sculpture, too. In the classic, the negative space (openings and areas around the figure) tend to be simple shapes, perceived flatly, and the figure itself (positive space) is also simple and perceived as if one one plane. (Discobolus) In later Hellenisitc work the negative space is very active, complexly shaped, and appears radically different from a changing viewpoint. So too with the positive space, the figure itself. Here the boundary of the figure cannot be seen except in parts and one must move around the figure to imagine it continuing, thus experiencing the figure differently as almost kinetic or moving. Often, limbs are extended and twisted (Laocoon). Generally art that is closed form is frontal, planar and such that one sees the whole before the parts is classic; art that is open form, not planar, and such that one sees the parts before the whole is baroque. Early 20C modernism tends to be classic; later 20C art tends to be baroque. Currently, the art pendulum seems to be in a late baroque phase, analogous to the roccoco. WC --- On Mon, 2/23/09, [email protected] <[email protected]> wrote: > From: [email protected] <[email protected]> > Subject: Re: Definable and measurable truths > To: [email protected] > Date: Monday, February 23, 2009, 11:28 AM > William writes: > > "I'm glad you liked the post re Greek sculpture. > But your post suggests that > you don't agree with one word of what I said." > > No, don't think that. I did believe what you wrote. In > remarking that > Rodriguez has a body like that of, say, the discobolus, I > meant to convey that an > ordinary viewer like me fails in the same way as the > Greeks: We don't observe > that this statue is wrong, and I mean anatomically wrong, > not just a faulty > picture of the stresses of the particular position of a man > throwing a discus. > > What the layman -- this layman, anyway -- observes is > largely proportions, > plus gross anatomy. Rodriguez, the discobolus, and, as I > recall, some of the > Nazi statuary, all have long legs, well muscled but not > "heavy"; slender waist; > and a strong upper body, again well-muscled, but > supple-looking, capable of > both power and quickness. Other baseball players at the > plate tend to look > bulky, or, at best, "compact". I have no > personal regard for Rodriguez, for many > reasons (including that I'm a Red Sox fan and he's > a Yankee!), but there's no > question he is unmatched in baseball for his "Greek > God" physique, and the > appearance is compounded by his physical adroitness. I > don't question what you > say about the abdominus oblique, but since Rodriguez always > has a uniform on, > we can't submit a picture of him to belie the > discobolus representation. > > You yourself say the proportions of the Greek figures are > not wrong in their > idealizations. When you say, "What people respond to > in preferring the Greek > proportions in real people is not the actual details of > measurement but the > general rule of symmetry," I don't follow you. A > gauntly skinny guy or grossly > obese person can be symmetrical. What do you have in mind? > > > > ************** > You're invited to Hollywood's biggest party: Get > Oscars > updates, red carpet pics and more at Moviefone. > (http://movies.aol.com/oscars-academy-awards?ncid=emlcntusmovi00000001)
