I am in complete agreement with Cheerskep here.  Note that a fine writer, Simon 
Shama, has been bashed for the same crime as Bell in his brand new book on 
America wherein he gives plain folk examples to illustrate huge, complex, 
social webs that defy such simplistic summaries -- suited, perhaps, for pop tv 
but not for serious social history.

Incidentally, when I mentioned U.S. Grant's observation re the madness of John 
Brown, I used the word sober as a paradoxical term, to suggest both the terse 
clarity of Grant's  observation and the fact that he was much criticized for 
his excessive drinking.  How I love the paradox that condemns the speaker as 
much as the speakee, not excluding myself often enough.  On this list we 
practice that paradox every time we try for a universal definition of art or 
the aesthetic experience.
wc




________________________________
From: "[email protected]" <[email protected]>
To: [email protected]
Sent: Monday, June 1, 2009 10:25:52 AM
Subject: Re: "...In the nineteenth and early twentieth centuries[,]...for...the 
 artists and the educated social classes...the exploration of all impulses  
became an aesthetic norm."

William writes:

"In any age, in every farm, village,   and city there are those who exceed  
all taboos and   trash all standards. To use that as a basis for any 
conclusion about a generation or era is silly."

I agree with William's basic point here. (I don't consider "basic" his 
too-extreme assertion that every farm has "those who exceed   all taboos and  
trash all standards.")

I summoned up John Brown, but I hope William doesn't think I was using 
Brown as a basis for any conclusion about a generation or era. In effect I was 
doing just the opposite.

Daniel Bell's hollow statement was: "...In the nineteenth and early 
twentieth centuries[,]...for...the artists and the educated social 
classes...the 
exploration of all impulses became an aesthetic norm."

I protested that Bell's statement had too many undefined terms: e.g. 
'exploration', 'impulses', 'aesthetic', 'norms', 'class', 'all'. There was 
nothing 
in Bell's lines to exclude the embracing of armed insurrection as an 
"impulse" (Bell says "ALL" impulses), or to exclude Brown and his followers as 
a 
"class".   I agree with William's sense of silliness in the air here, and I 
specifically sniffed it in the notion that there was anything of the "norm" 
or "aesthetic" about Brown and his impulses either when he pursued them or 
after he was gone.  

The stirring gripe behind my protest was a dislike of sociologists' 
inclination to wield grandiloquent abstractions that are catchy, so generalized 
as 
to be faux-universals, and consequentially vacuous. Recall that Bell is the 
author of THE END OF IDEOLOGY (1960), and THE COMING OF POST-INDUSTRIAL 
SOCIETY (1973).



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