When you do a setup with the industrial Meanwell, Traco, etc stuff one
thing to keep in mind is monitoring. With that class of equipment
you'll have dry contacts and you'll need something to monitor those for
alarms. You'll probably want a current shunt and then either a set of
Packetflux modules or something like a Tycon TPDIN-Monitor-WEB2.
Then think about remote control and power distribution. If you don't
want/need to reboot individual devices then distribution can just be a
set of terminal blocks. If you DO want/need to reboot individual
devices then you need some kind of PDU with either relay contacts or an
ethernet connection.
So I'm going to point in a completely different direction now:
http://www.ict-power.com/products/modular-power-series/
or
https://www.vertiv.com/globalassets/products/critical-power/dc-power-systems/netsure-2100-a31-s1--ds-en-asia.pdf
Either the Vertiv or ICT device linked above is a single 1RU device with
rectifier, battery controller, network interface, and PDU with remotely
flippable circuit breakers. I have one of the ICT MPS units and the
system is dead simple. I think it's around $1500-1800 for that. That's
probably double what you'd spend for an equivalent set of features with
Traco or Meanwell combined with Packetflux modules. However, you gain
space efficiency, simpler design, simpler to set up, and simpler to use
for you and your technicians. And I'm pretty sure the ICT and Vertiv
units both have relay contacts if you do need to monitor things like
door sensors and such.
The Alpha Cordex that Josh Baird linked to earlier does some of that,
but doesn't include a PDU and it's 2RU. I'd looked real hard at Alpha,
but it's a little more complicated to use, and by the time you add some
kind of PDU you're using way more space than you would with ICT MPS or
Vertiv NS2100.
Don't take my word for it. Try doing Site Monitors and industrial power
supplies first. If you're happy with that method then you will save
money doing it. I didn't go this other direction until I had to explain
to a new technician how to use the Site Monitor and realized that
there's no way to make it simple enough for a low level goon.
Oh...and if remote monitoring and control aren't important for your
case, then definitely do Meanwell or Traco. Way cheaper, smaller, and
simpler. It's when you start adding features that you encounter the
complexity and size issue I'm talking about.
-Adam
On 6/20/2019 3:58 PM, Josh Baird wrote:
Our typical setup medium sized sites is:
Traco TSP-360-148 (360W @ 48V)
Traco TSP-BCM48A (we usually put a string of 4 12-33ah 12V batteries
on these)
For very small sites, where we only need (or can fit) 1 12V battery,
but still require 48VDC, we do:
Meanwell SDR-240-48
Traco TSP-BCMU (good for ~220W, can output either 24VDC or 48VDC with
a single 12VDC battery.. we usually put a single 18-33ah battery on these)
Voltage drop obviously depends on length of the run, but you should be
able to easily calculate that. We usually adjust our PSU's (at the
bottom) to ~54VDC and we typically see ~49-51VDC at the top. Yes, you
can tweak the output of both the Meanwell and the Traco to compensate
for voltage drop if needed.
We use a Shireen hybrid fiber cable which has a 12AWG pair for DC. We
use these up to 200ft or so.
On Thu, Jun 20, 2019 at 3:47 PM Sterling Jacobson
<[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote:
So what’s the Traco parts list for that?
I don’t do this stuff normally, so excited to get started and try
it out.
If I’m pushing 48v up top to a roof, what’s the voltage drop?
I assume these DC units can somehow be tweaked so that output can
accommodate for voltage drop.
What size wire is everyone using typically for this, usually
30-100 ft max length?
I’m assuming it’s something like 10 AWG? At 48v and 5A and 50’ is
maybe 47.5v at the end?
So I would push 49 or 50v just to be safe?
*From:* AF <[email protected]
<mailto:[email protected]>> *On Behalf Of * Josh Baird
*Sent:* Wednesday, June 19, 2019 8:19 AM
*To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group <[email protected]
<mailto:[email protected]>>
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] UPS and DC to DC conversion
FWIW - we have lots of EdgePoint S16's that are powered by Traco
BCM/TSP combos @ ~54V with no issues.
I agree with others - your battery plant should be 48VDC.
On Wed, Jun 19, 2019 at 10:15 AM Sterling Jacobson
<[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote:
Yeah, I’ll probably just use 48v battery array in series and
float higher.
That particular device can do 48v, it just may shut down POE
if it gets lower than 48v.
*From:* AF <[email protected]
<mailto:[email protected]>> *On Behalf Of
*[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>
*Sent:* Wednesday, June 19, 2019 8:11 AM
*To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group <[email protected]
<mailto:[email protected]>>
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] UPS and DC to DC conversion
Why not run your system at 54 volts? If the radio freaks out
above 54, just set it at 54 and you should be fine. Battery
strings don’t exceed the float voltage of the rectifier. If
you are worried about it float at 53.75 volts.
*From:*Sterling Jacobson
*Sent:*Tuesday, June 18, 2019 11:19 PM
*To:*AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
*Subject:*Re: [AFMUG] UPS and DC to DC conversion
Having a hard time figuring out the exact part/price for
something like this.
Which Meanwell part would take 48v and make it 50v or 54v 5A?
*From:* AF <[email protected]
<mailto:[email protected]>> *On Behalf Of *Adam Moffett
*Sent:* Tuesday, June 18, 2019 10:21 PM
*To:* [email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] UPS and DC to DC conversion
That's weird to me. Any telecom equipment made for 48v I
would have assumed they intended it to be used with a
rectifier, and consequently I would assume it'd be ok up to at
least 56v continuous; and maybe more like 60-70v for a short
duration. But yeah, DC-DC converter is the fix.
On 6/18/2019 11:36 PM, Sean Heskett wrote:
You need to use a DC-DC converter for sensitive equipment
like that. Meanwell has a good selection.
On Tue, Jun 18, 2019 at 8:12 PM Sterling Jacobson
<[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote:
Apparently the UBNT EP-S16 freaks out if it goes above
54v.
Is there any way to assure it doesn’t float/charge
above 54v, or maybe even just 50v?
*From:* AF <[email protected]
<mailto:[email protected]>> *On Behalf Of *TJ Trout
*Sent:* Tuesday, June 18, 2019 7:26 PM
*To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
<[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>>
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] UPS and DC to DC conversion
contact talley or tessco for a price, don't trust what
you see on google, it's like 50% less
On Tue, Jun 18, 2019 at 6:25 PM TJ Trout
<[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote:
all 48v systems for battery power will float at
54v, it's also adjustable via the battery chemistry
On Tue, Jun 18, 2019 at 3:33 PM Sterling Jacobson
<[email protected]
<mailto:[email protected]>> wrote:
Ok, cool.
So can the 7bc2 be adjusted slightly to output
50v instead of just 48v?
There will be some loss going 100’ or so, right?
*From:* AF <[email protected]
<mailto:[email protected]>> *On Behalf
Of *TJ Trout
*Sent:* Tuesday, June 18, 2019 4:23 PM
*To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
<[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>>
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] UPS and DC to DC conversion
12-54v is inefficient, if you want 200ah of
battery use 4x50ah batteries for a 48v string
ICT24048-7BC2 360W 54v AC-DC + LVD + Charger
ICT-TMP - Temp sensor for charge compensation
if batt's outside
ICT-WMB - Wall mount bracket
SITE Monitor - Voltage monitoring
Or
Alternativly;
48v din mount PSU
48v 'dc ups' to charge batt's and provide LVD
OR
48v din 'dc ups' with integrated psu + lvd +
charger (i.e. DIN-UPS 48-5 cheaper options
available)
On Tue, Jun 18, 2019 at 2:50 PM Sterling
Jacobson <[email protected]
<mailto:[email protected]>> wrote:
I’m trying to put a “box” system together
for our house POP sites and need help with
the DIN stuff and UPS.
Can you guys give me an idea or example of
the following?
I want to take standard AC 15A in from a
breaker outside the box.
And using maybe one or two 12v 105AH AGM
batteries, supply 50v 6A up the side of
the house.
I have never ordered DIN parts like this,
guess I don’t have to use DIN, but would
be nice.
Having a problem finding a DC to DC
converter that takes 12v and upconverts to
50v 5-6A.
Is this the cost effective method?
Something like this:
Monitoring Sitemonitor Base Unit II SMON
Base II 1.00 $100.00 $100.00
UPS Monitor Sitemonitor Int MorningStar
MeterBus SMON MorningStar
1.00 $60.00 $60.00
UPS Charge MorningStar Sunsaver Dual 1.00
$165.00 $165.00
Battery AGM Deep Cycle 105AH NPP
FT12-105AH 2.00 $225.00 $450.00
DIN Parts like DC fuse/breakers and trunk
stuff 1.00 $100.00 $100.00
DC 12v to 50v 5A 1.00 $150.00 $150.00
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