I get RF from Cisco.
> On Nov 21, 2019, at 7:54 AM, Adam Moffett <[email protected]> wrote: > > Are those pre-owned / refurb? > > On 11/21/2019 12:57 AM, Cassidy B. Larson wrote: >> I’m able to get 10 Cisco ASR920s for under 10k from Cisco. Just depends on >> who your account team is, and how much business you do. Just like >> Streakwave, Winncom, etc. >> >> >>> On Nov 20, 2019, at 8:10 PM, Sterling Jacobson <[email protected] >>> <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: >>> >>> Uh, yeah. >>> >>> $10k doesn’t buy me enough functionality. >>> Would need 10 of those. >>> >>> From: AF <[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>> On >>> Behalf Of Josh Baird >>> Sent: Wednesday, November 20, 2019 6:54 PM >>> To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group <[email protected] >>> <mailto:[email protected]>> >>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] MPLS >>> >>> Why? Price? >>> >>> On Wed, Nov 20, 2019 at 7:53 PM Sterling Jacobson <[email protected] >>> <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: >>> No thanks. >>> >>> From: AF <[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>> On >>> Behalf Of Gino A. Villarini >>> Sent: Wednesday, November 20, 2019 5:12 PM >>> To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group <[email protected] >>> <mailto:[email protected]>> >>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] MPLS >>> >>> Time to grow up… Juniper ACX or Cisco ASR920 >>> >>> From: AF <[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>> on >>> behalf of Sterling Jacobson <[email protected] >>> <mailto:[email protected]>> >>> Reply-To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group <[email protected] >>> <mailto:[email protected]>> >>> Date: Wednesday, November 20, 2019 at 4:10 PM >>> To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group <[email protected] >>> <mailto:[email protected]>> >>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] MPLS >>> >>> Well put. >>> >>> Capacity/speed is an issue with me, so I think I introduced some possible >>> bottlenecks above 4.5Gbps using MPLS/VPLS in my own network which is >>> Mikrotik. >>> VPLS endpoints I don’t think were/are hardware offloaded, so required some >>> great CPU capacity at the edge and core for large transport. >>> I also think I had MTU issues with so many layers of “layer2” stuff going >>> on inside and outside of MPLS tunnels, native interfaces, VPLS endpoints, >>> bridges and VRRP interfaces along with VLAN at some endpoints. >>> >>> However, with the right equipment (not Mikrotik) MPLS is fully capable and >>> large networks use them to diversely traverse redundant paths back to a >>> central core. >>> >>> My problem also was geo-diverse BGP cores to different providers as stated >>> below. >>> I was running EVERYTHING on a Mikrotik 1072 CCR, lol! >>> It still drives me crazy hunting down issues where I still have >>> MPLS/OSPF/BGP/VRRP/VLAN on one device across multiple interfaces, lol! >>> >>> From: AF <[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>> On >>> Behalf Of Dennis Burgess via AF >>> Sent: Wednesday, November 20, 2019 12:56 PM >>> To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group <[email protected] >>> <mailto:[email protected]>> >>> Cc: Dennis Burgess <[email protected] >>> <mailto:[email protected]>> >>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] MPLS >>> >>> You can, its up to you. >>> >>> Is routing faster on MikroTik by using MPLS/VPLS? No >>> Do you gain extra capacity by reducing the router load per packet by using >>> MPLS? Yes, think looking at 4-bytes of data vs 40. Is it 10 fold >>> increase, no but you get the point. >>> What is the big deal about MPLS without VPLS? Just that it does get you a >>> bit of extra capacity. Bout it. >>> Why does everyone want to run VPLS? VPLS gets you the IP and subnet >>> savings. You do need to design your core network correctly to handle this. >>> If you have a single core router and all of your tunnels go to that, then >>> yes if it goes down yes your tunnels are down, but may of our customers >>> have to have redundancy, so multiple edges, connected to multiple cores, >>> connected to multiple VPLS termination boxes, connected to multiple PPPoE >>> servers. Etc. The core is VERY robust, but the general network is not. >>> This also does not work very well if your have multiple geographically >>> diverse BGP feeds, i.e. everything goes back to the datacenter and that’s >>> where it is, great, but otherwise, it gets to the point that it not worth >>> the effort. >>> L2VPNs? Weill there are a few customers that prefer them, but in all >>> honestly there is better, more secure, and faster protocols out there. >>> Keep in mind that L2VPNs are fine if all of the customers are on your >>> network, but they seldom are, so you will need a plan for those guys as >>> well. My questions is why do you build your network to deliver something >>> that people don’t want, a layer 2 network connection. If you are >>> delivering Pipes then sure, but you have to have the capacity and >>> availability to do so. Most Wisps, not all, don’t have this figured out. >>> 99% of the time, they can make more money by providing a managed L3 >>> solution than L2 anyways. >>> >>> >>> >>> <image001.png> >>> Dennis Burgess, Mikrotik Certified Trainer >>> MTCNA, MTCRE, MTCWE, MTCTCE, MTCINE, MTCSE, HE IPv6 Sage, Cambium ePMP >>> Certified >>> Author of "Learn RouterOS- Second Edition” >>> Link Technologies, Inc -- Mikrotik & WISP Support Services >>> Office: 314-735-0270 Website: http://www.linktechs.net >>> <http://www.linktechs.net/> >>> Create Wireless Coverage’s with www.towercoverage.com >>> <http://www.towercoverage.com/> >>> >>> From: AF <[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>> On >>> Behalf Of Adam Moffett >>> Sent: Wednesday, November 20, 2019 1:17 PM >>> To: [email protected] <mailto:[email protected]> >>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] MPLS >>> >>> So do you tunnel everything back to the core and then do "router on a >>> stick" ? >>> >>> On 11/20/2019 2:14 PM, Gino A. Villarini wrote: >>> Yeap VPLS is where is at… >>> >>> VPLS tunnels to the towers, CORE routing + L2VPN to customers( Enterprise, >>> Wholesale) >>> >>> >>> >>> Gino Villarini >>> Founder/President >>> @gvillarini >>> t: 787.273.4143 Ext. 204 >>> m: >>> >>> <http://www.aeronetpr.com/> >>> <http://www.aeronetpr.com/> >>> <http://www.aeronetpr.com/> >>> <http://www.aeronetpr.com/> >>> <http://www.aeronetpr.com/> >>> <http://www.aeronetpr.com/> >>> <http://www.aeronetpr.com/> >>> www.aeronetpr.com | Metro Office Park #18 Suite 304 Guaynabo, PR 00968 >>> <http://www.aeronetpr.com/> >>> From: AF <[email protected]> on behalf of Josh Baird >>> <[email protected]> >>> Reply-To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group <[email protected]> >>> Date: Wednesday, November 20, 2019 at 3:09 PM >>> To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group <[email protected]> >>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] MPLS <http://www.aeronetpr.com/> >>> <http://www.aeronetpr.com/> >>> It seems like lots of people in the WISP-world are running MPLS just to use >>> VPLS. Reasons for doing this are typically to achieve better IPv4 >>> utilization (not having to route a block of IP's to each POP and maybe >>> wasting IPv4, etc). <http://www.aeronetpr.com/> >>> <http://www.aeronetpr.com/> >>> Another common use-case is providing L2VPN services for customers >>> (connecting multiple locations together, etc). <http://www.aeronetpr.com/> >>> <http://www.aeronetpr.com/> >>> On Wed, Nov 20, 2019 at 2:03 PM Adam Moffett <[email protected]> wrote: >>> <http://www.aeronetpr.com/> >>> I think I don't fully understand what the advantages are of MPLS. >>> <http://www.aeronetpr.com/> >>> <http://www.aeronetpr.com/> >>> I mean I've been reading the white-papers and such, and I see it brings >>> some features to the table, but when are we going to use them? >>> <http://www.aeronetpr.com/> >>> <http://www.aeronetpr.com/> >>> Routing speed: <http://www.aeronetpr.com/> >>> MPLS can make forwarding decisions faster. When they made this in the >>> 1990's I'm sure that was a big deal, but I'm doubting whether there is >>> really measurably better latency on modern hardware. Is there? >>> <http://www.aeronetpr.com/> >>> <http://www.aeronetpr.com/> >>> Traffic Engineering: <http://www.aeronetpr.com/> >>> It can do redundancy, but it seems to rely on the routing protocol (eg >>> OSPF) to know which paths are up. I don't understand what that buys us. >>> <http://www.aeronetpr.com/> >>> It can do load sharing on unequal paths. Admittedly that's very hard to do >>> with L3 routing protocols, and that would have been extremely useful at one >>> point in time. But how often does that happen now that we're in a world of >>> gigabit and 10gigabit connections? <http://www.aeronetpr.com/> >>> L2 tunneling <http://www.aeronetpr.com/> >>> It can transport L2 traffic over an L3 network. It does it with less >>> overhead (8 bytes) than any other method I can think of. I don't really >>> see a downside to this. <http://www.aeronetpr.com/> >>> So are people running MPLS just to get VPLS tunnels, or do you find that >>> the other tools in the MPLS toolbox matter in today's world? >>> <http://www.aeronetpr.com/> >>> -- >>> AF mailing list >>> [email protected] >>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com >>> <http://www.aeronetpr.com/> >>> <http://www.aeronetpr.com/> >>> -- >>> AF mailing list >>> [email protected] >>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com >>> <http://www.aeronetpr.com/>-- >>> AF mailing list >>> [email protected] <mailto:[email protected]> >>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com >>> <http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com> >> > -- > AF mailing list > [email protected] > http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
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