I agree, but more of a problem for the humanities than engineering I would
think.
-----Original Message-----
From: Robert Andrews
Sent: Monday, October 12, 2020 11:40 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT good to be a boomer
I think Universities without student to student connections are going to
be a big problem. I still think they are about building personal bonds.
It's pretty tough to do that on video chat at the same level as a
kegger. ( not that I did keggers ). But knowing someone out of the
classroom is important to know and develop bonds with. It will be a
different society without those bonds.
On 10/12/2020 10:24 AM, [email protected] wrote:
It will be interesting to see how education changes post covid. I would
think that we have proven brick and mortar universities are not needed.
Perhaps for some labs and other special things. But online works. Should
drive the cost down I would hope.
*From:* Cameron Crum
*Sent:* Monday, October 12, 2020 10:52 AM
*To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] OT good to be a boomer
Universities know the government will give big loans to kids and they all
want to be on that gravy train. They raise tuition and just put it on the
kids to go get more money in the form of debt. Kids would be hard pressed
to pay tuition working their way through right now. Tuition costs have
doubled inflation and outpaced wages by 8x. My daughter just entered
college and through sheer luck, she ended up in Community College. She got
into every big school she applied to but after visiting them all, decided
none of them were for her. She really wanted to go to UT( Texas), but did
not apply because her teachers all told her she had to be top 7% to get
accepted and she was only top 10%. I told her to apply, but she did not.
So, as a result she decided in March she would just move to Austin and go
to ACC who has a transfer track program into UT if you can keep a 3.7 GPA.
She is taking the same classes as her friends at UT (all online) but
paying 1/5 the tuition. She is living in a private dormitory across the
street from UT campus with mostly UT kids, so basically has the same
"college" experience without the huge tuition bill, for now. I couldn't be
happier. She had a decent 529 for college but not enough for all 4 years
even at a state school. Now it might just last, especially if she decides
to stay at ACC for another year before transferring to UT. I'm hoping she
can get out without debt, but I'm guessing she'll have a little. I'm with
Mike Rowe on a lot of this. I never thought college was for everyone, and
trade schools are cheap in comparison, and you can be earning a good
paycheck in a lot less time.
On Sun, Oct 11, 2020 at 9:00 PM Ken Hohhof <[email protected]> wrote:
I started at $1.80 at the pizza joint. After a month or two I got a
raise to $2. I think all new employees got a quick performance
review at which they either got a 10% raise or got fired.____
____
I had a summer job as a shipping clerk, I don’t remember what it
paid.____
____
First job after graduation in 1972 paid $10,920/year.____
____
*From:* AF <[email protected]> *On Behalf Of *Chuck McCown
*Sent:* Sunday, October 11, 2020 6:53 PM
*To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group <[email protected]>
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] OT good to be a boomer____
____
Still , a fortune. I was making $2.50/hr in those years.____
Sent from my iPhone____
____
On Oct 11, 2020, at 4:53 PM, Robert <[email protected]>
wrote:____
I forgot to take all the taxes out of that for each summer. I
netted more like 4K for the summer..____
On 10/11/20 3:49 PM, Robert wrote:____
When I went to UCSC one quarter all up cost about $1.7K in
1975 This year, just the tuition, room and board and
mandatory health insurance is going to cost you $36K
_california resident_ I was able to work for $9.40/hour at
a gas station as a jr manager, opening and closing during
the summer. 60 hours weeks for 12 weeks. That was almost
$7K for the summer, minus gas and some small expenses while
staying at my parents. Yes I was overpaid, pays to know
someone, I also opened, closed and did the books. But I
don't care who you know but joe blow isn't going to get a
summer job that is going to come anywhere close to $100K for
summer or even year round work when you are in college now.
What's the difference? UC California turns students away
by the bushel. Instead of a system that focused on
California High School graduates, it's a system that focuses
on attracting donors that can put names on buildings. Slots
are full from outside the state at huge financial cash
flow. Everyone else can go to a Jr College.____
On 10/11/20 2:27 PM, Ken Hohhof wrote:____
Here’s one I don’t understand. Not pointing a finger, I
genuinely don’t understand. Student loan debt. Is that
the huge issue that people say? And if so, is that a
new phenomenon? Why?____
____
I assume my dad went to college on the GI Bill after
WWII. I worked 20 hours a week all through college
making pizzas and burgers, and had a coop job every
third quarter or so until the coop jobs disappeared due
to a recession.____
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Recession_of_1969%E2%80%931970____
____
Plus my parents helped out. I don’t remember my friends
in college talking about student debt, but maybe they
had it and it just wasn’t talked about.____
____
I can speculate some possible reasons for a student debt
crisis now:____
____
- Tuition has gone up____
- Part time jobs and coop jobs unavailable or don’t pay
enough____
- Less financial assistance available____
- Predatory for-profit schools____
- Lots of kids who couldn’t find jobs in the Great
Recession went to school or pursued advanced degrees
instead____
____
None of these seem like adequate explanations. College
is too expensive, not sure how much it has gone up
adjusted for inflation. You’d think with online
instruction and extensive use of low paid adjunct
professors they could keep costs down. Certainly dorms,
food and other amenities are a lot fancier than when I
was in college, maybe those costs have gotten out of
hand. You’d also think state schools and especially
community colleges would be affordable options, Harvard
and Yale aren’t the only places to get a good
education.____
____
But if there’s genuinely a huge student debt crisis,
what is causing it, and how do we fix it? Is “free
college for all” really the only solution?____
____
I understand with the pandemic, people out of work can’t
pay their student debts, but supposedly this problem
predates the pandemic.____
____
*From:* AF mailto:[email protected] *On Behalf Of
*Bill Prince
*Sent:* Sunday, October 11, 2020 3:54 PM
*To:* [email protected]
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] OT good to be a boomer____
____
Yah. Even though I'm a boomer, I think attributing the
current state of the economy entirely on boomers is
missing the mark somewhat. There are a whole raft of
issues that are squeezing millenials like globalization
and extreme automation. You keep adding barriers, and
getting or creating a good paying job just gets more
difficult. If all you can do is flip burgers at Micky
D's or pour coffee at Starbucks, maybe you need to think
a bit more creatively.____
____
bp____
<part15sbs{at}gmail{dot}com>____
On 10/11/2020 11:52 AM, Ken Hohhof wrote:____
Obviously I’m prejudiced, but I don’t think this whole
trope about all the problems young people today face
being the fault of the baby boomers (and wishing they
would die and stop hogging all the good jobs) is quite
accurate.____
____
Yes we had a long recession starting in 2008 (but of
course there were recessions back in the 1970’s as
well), but I saw a lot of parents dipping into their
401K savings and taking out loans on their paid-off
houses so their adult children could live with them, or
to pay for their kids to go to college instead of being
unemployed.____
____
Baby boomer 401K plans were a big cushion for
millennials and the economy in general during the “Great
Recession”. I think what will actually hit the
millennials is when the boomers do die, they won’t be
inheriting as much money because those retirement funds
got drained. Also, don’t kid yourself that 70 year old
boomer greeting people at Walmart or bagging groceries
at Kroger is just continuing to work for the fun of it,
or that a millennial wanted that job anyway. As far as
the “good” jobs, age discrimination kicks in around age
50. I don’t think Google and Facebook have a lot of
boomers writing code. How many boomers does Elon Musk
have designing Teslas and SpaceX rockets?____
____
Still a funny skit, but I run into millennials who
totally blame all their woes on boomers screwing their
generation over. And the “why don’t they die already”
viewpoint spills over into Covid discussions. Lots of
anti-maskers say things like “if they don’t feel safe
going out, they are free to not go out”. Or there
aren’t that many deaths if you ignore the old people who
were going to die anyway. People at least didn’t used
to say stuff like that out loud.____
____
____
*From:* AF mailto:[email protected] *On Behalf Of
*Robert
*Sent:* Sunday, October 11, 2020 12:25 PM
*To:* [email protected]
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] OT good to be a boomer____
____
very apropos...____
On 10/11/20 10:04 AM, [email protected] wrote:____
https://www.nbc.com/saturday-night-live/video/millennial-millions/3867395____
____
____
____
____
____
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