Re: [AFMUG] OT: The Silence is deafening..

Fri, 13 Nov 2020 10:09:24 -0800

Part of the problem with discussing socialism is inconsistent definitions.  There are people saying they are "socialist" who think that just means the government providing public welfare services.  The original definition is government controlling the economy.
Welfare is only socialist in the same way that any other government spending is "socialist" in that some money is taken out of one sector the economy (tax) and redirected to another one (spend).  If that's socialism then all governments have always been socialist ever since the dawn of time.  And if having a formal system in place to help people is socialist then the Mongol Horde was socialist and so were Caribbean pirates and Powhatan Indians.  Oh and Otto Von Bismark too.  (Hint: none of those are socialist) 


There's also commonly assumed to be an equivalency between socialism and 
communism.  Communism is marked by rigid authoritarianism, statism, and 
nationalism.  They figure their socialist dreams will not be realized 
without rigidly applied force.  All communists are socialist, but not 
all socialists are communist.


Here are some simple guidelines:


If they're seizing control of private companies and taking direct 
control of them, then they're socialist.



If they're doing the above while also sending dissenters to be 
re-educated in the gulag then they're communist.



If they're not doing the above and you're calling them Communist then 
you are incorrect.


-Adam


On 11/13/2020 12:47 PM, Robert wrote:

Where the frick do people start throwing Communism around in regards 
to the US.   Sorry but this weird paranoid outlook is just getting to 
me.   Growing up in the 50's and 60's we knew what communism is/was 
and the US has never ever _ever_ been close to supporting communism.   
We have been closer to having islamic fundamentalism than communism.   
Radicals exist on BOTH sides of the divide.   Anyone out and the edges 
of the bell curve is a "Radical".   And there are plenty on both sides 
to go around.   One side tends to have more guns than the other. 
Socialism is the idea that society pulls together when it's good for 
everyone, and we have plenty of that.   Fire departments, water 
departments, Social Security where the companies have to contribute 
1/2 of the payment. (not applicable to self-employed ).   Medicare, 
Medicaid, these are all examples of a society that cares for the less 
fortunate and decides that we care about our fellow individuals.  
When, basically, the whole rest of the world says that these are good 
things and that they should do even more, why don't we and both sides 
of the isle decide that this would be good for us too?   Because the 
rich are running the show and taxes on the wealthy should be less than 
taxes on the poor.   And that they can keep shoving propaganda down 
our throats that make us feel like that is the way it should be. OMG 
if you aren't one of the 1% you are just getting screwed in so many 
ways.   If you aren't sitting on a mountain of PPE on your yacht in 
the warmer waters of the world getting richer from your stock 
investments you are just bending over wanting more. The last tax 
changes had so many screw-you-later clauses in it for those making 
less than $5MM/year it was laughable.  Yeah there were a couple of 
things to make it so that you didn't notice your pain for a year or 
two, but it's all there hidden in a 5" stack of FU...



As far as State and Federal laws being followed.  EVERY DARN ONE of 
the states election boards is screaming that they are doing to the 
best it's ever been done.     Propping up people who say they cheated 
and then recant doesn't look good to anyone. Chasing down military 
families that are voting the way they have been told to for 50 years 
looks worse.  Saying that the democrats cheated on the Presidential 
election but couldn't on the Senate, yeah that sounds like a good plan..


Oh btw what you wrote as "

Anyone here know what 'communism' looks like before it fully shows 
up?   NOT the Trump side ...

"

Says that the tRump side doesn't know what communism looks like before 
it shows up.  Which I agree with.  tRump supporters seem to be missing 
all the clues of a leadership running around with their hair on fire...


Robert <-   Because Lent seems to be seriously broken today...



On 11/13/20 9:17 AM, justsumname wrote:

Insisting that State and Federal laws be followed in the election is 
NOT 'undermining' the country.   Just the opposite.
Firing people who are sympathetic to the radicals is NOT 
'undermining' the country.   Just the opposite.
Polar-opposite worlds.   I just don't get it.   Anyone here know what 
'communism' looks like before it fully shows up?   NOT the Trump side ...



Ya know... it was BIDEN in the first debate who said he would accept 
the election after all states were certified......



If Biden wins -- legally and properly -- then so be it.  Everyone 
should desire transparency and legality, 100% of the way.  
 Especially nowadays.


--



On Wed, Nov 11, 2020 at 11:26 PM Steve Jones 
<[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote:


    Morons can say what they will, because that's what they do, like
    trained monkeys. "Orange man bad", good little trainee.
    I can tell you this, they gave my dad his first dose of
    remdesivere tonite, you can rest assured, podunk Illinois wouldnt
    be giving podunk 78 year old man a medication like that as a
    first line med if the scamdemic hadn't been handled like a boss.
    See pandemic is pandemic, there is no such thing as "handling it
    right" l anybody who says there is is a part of the above
    mentioned group of morons.

    50 50 if the old man comes home. But my orange "buffoon" opened a
    door that got his odds up from the original 80 percent coffin rate.

    That's what I laugh at "orange man bad" idiots that spout their
    hypocrisy, bigotry and generally retarded tripe.

    Rotflmao, however some more cliches... the change my mind

    On Wed, Nov 11, 2020, 8:27 PM Chuck Macenski <[email protected]
    <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote:

        If Trump were trying to undermine the United States, what
        would he be doing differently?

        On Wed, Nov 11, 2020 at 8:14 PM Robert
        <[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote:

            Having the DOJ chase down military people who vote out of
            state for years because of normal military transfers ( 3K
            so far in NV ) which has been the normal state of affairs
            for over 70 years and characterize that as voter fraud is
            going a little bit too far in my book. I still am hoping
            that he is going after that more about raising money than
            actually thinking he can corrupt the belief in the voting
            system.


            On 11/11/20 7:38 AM, [email protected]
            <mailto:[email protected]> wrote:

            I don’t agree at all.  Trump got elected because more
            than half the country really really really disliked Hillary.
            Really really really disliked Hillary.
            I don’t know of anyone that voted for Trump because they
            liked him.  Everyone I know thought he was an ass hat
            from the get go.
            Second, you all have seen, first hand, for 4 years how
            little a president can actually do to harm a country. 
            Not much. He didn’t start any wars so that is about the
            most damaging thing he can do.  He didn’t act on the
            virus properly but lots of countries fall into the same
            category. He embarrassed us on the world stage. That is
            about it.  Congress can affect us.  Presidents not so much.
            We have always had nationalists here. It is part of the
            culture.  Some call it patriotism. I don’t think it is
            bad.  I am not a globalist.  I support our country and
            our national interests above other nations.  Part of
            rooting for the home team.  Being a patriot is a far
            stretch from dictatorship.
            *From:* Jaime Solorza
            *Sent:* Wednesday, November 11, 2020 8:01 AM
            *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
            *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] OT: The Silence is deafening..
            The scariest part is how many actually voted for an
            inept nationalist xenophobic clown ...it portends of bad
            things ahead. Study history and you will see how this
            nationalism fervor led to Nazi growth in Europe...
            The proof is overwhelming...
            Prove me wrong.
            On Tue, Nov 10, 2020, 9:41 PM Steve Jones
            <[email protected]> wrote:

                I cant take credit on that one
                Heres some crazy stuff, I'm pretty sure offering up
                campaign funds for anything other than a campaign is
                illegal.
                I told you guys, this is gonna get hilarious. By the
                time it's all said and done, theyll find 100 percent
                evidence biden cheated and there will be no
                republicans left not in prison for the RNC to put in
                the big seat.
                
https://www.thedailybeast.com/texas-lt-gov-dan-patrick-offers-dollar1-million-in-campaign-funds-for-voter-fraud-evidence
                
<https://www.thedailybeast.com/texas-lt-gov-dan-patrick-offers-dollar1-million-in-campaign-funds-for-voter-fraud-evidence>
                Was reading another article from one of the
                mainstreams about what happens if there is no
                certification and the congress has to vote in a new
                potus, apparently it's not limited to the two
                candidates, it's got to do with aggregate votes and
                would potentially leave bernie sanders in a position
                to be president. Its was MSM and they're full of
                shit all the time but it sounded good. Can you
                imagine that, the dnc fucked this guy over twice in
                a concerted effort, particularly in 2016 when he had
                a real good chance of beating the republican., and
                then he pulls that feat off. I'd love it. I hate his
                policies, and hed have zero chance of implementing
                95 percent of them, but I'd pay to watch that happen.
                On Tue, Nov 10, 2020, 9:37 PM Adam Moffett
                <[email protected]> wrote:

                    I might have to write that one down.

                    On 11/10/2020 10:32 PM, Steve Jones wrote:
                    > Hard times breed strong men, string men breed
                    good times, good times
                    > breed weak men, weak men breed hard times.


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