Hi Ben, On 23 Dec you said: > I would say that if the universe remains configured roughly as it is now, > then your statement (that long-term persistence requires goal-directed > effort) is true. > > However, the universe could in the future find itself in a configuration > in which your statement was FALSE, either > > -- via self-organization, or > > -- via the goal-directed activity of an intelligent system, which then > stopped being goal-directed after it had set the universe in a > configuration where its persistence could continue without goal-directed > effort >
Taking the last first...... wouldn't option 2 require the intelligent system to end the evolution of the universe to achieve this result......ie. bring on the heat death of the universe! I can't see why 'self-organisation' would lead to a universe where persistence through deep time of apects of the universe that an intelligence favours did not require goal directed effort/expenditure of energy. How could you see this happening? Even if the intelligence actually absorbed the whole of the universe into itself I think my theorum would still hold - because a whole-universe intelligence would find it's internal sub-systems still evolving in surprising ways. It seems to me that the only way to 'model' the universe is to use the real whole-universe - so a whole-universe intelligence would not have enough computing power to model itself in complete detail therefore the future would still hold surprises that the whole-universe intelligence would need to expend energy on to manage - while its internal low entropy lasted. Cheers, Philip ------- To unsubscribe, change your address, or temporarily deactivate your subscription, please go to http://v2.listbox.com/member/[EMAIL PROTECTED]
