On Mon, Feb 06, 2006 at 12:32:43PM -0500, Youness Alaoui wrote: > Hi there.. > for once, I'm forwarding an email, and I'm forwarding it to this list too, > and that's because I think it's important! > The attached text is in french, so let me explain it... I guess some of > you know, there were 12 caricatures, representing the muslim's prophet, > Mahomet, that were published in Danemark at the end of last September. Look, I refuse to belive that all of the commotion is caused by those images, and here's why: 1) Mohammed has been depicted on hundreds of occasions before, both in serious and satirical contexts. Assuming muslims would have reacted differently if the context had been serious, let's only speak of the satirical ones, most notably as he appeared in South Park, and a spike tv bit, where he gets his head cut off by moses - no reaction from muslims. 2) if it was really that much of insult, the reaction would not have waited almost 5 months - it would have come swiftly. 3) the whole situation was handled just fine by the local muslim community, untill danish and other leading muslims started lying to the muslims counties about what had actually happened - they have been caught lying on television on several occasions, among other things displaying pictures on cnn that has never been published in denmark, claiming that they came from the newpaper - and saying that 'every day since the drawings were published, we have brought much worse stories about muslims', and that's simply not true. > They actually opened a contest (for no specific reason) asking people to > send caricatures of the muslims prophet, and they published 12 of them > (the 'best' ones), either representing the prophet in a humiliating image > or describing him as a terrorist (our prophet with a lit bomb on his head, > or whatever...). Untrue - the entire controversy started when Danish author Kåre Bluitgen complained that he could not find an artist brave enought to illustrate his upcoming book about Mohammed. The newspaper Jyllands-Posten issued a call for submissions from any artists willing to take up the challenge.
> This is a huge insult to all muslims, and for many reasons, not only > because they are associating our beloved prophet with terrorism, but also Untill I saw the violent reactions, I would never have dreamt of associating Mohammed with terrorism, guess what, now it's pretty hard not to - even when I know that far from all muslims reacted as inapropriatly. > because no image/drawing representing the prophet is allowed in Islam (to > avoid iconography.. having an icon as an idol, the prophet being simply a > messenger shouldn't be represented).. so not only did they violate this > law, but also they are implicitly telling the whole world that muslims are 1) there is no law in denmark against depicting Mohammed 2) if you can honestly say that publishing a satirical reprensenation of Mohammed is equal to 'telling'(?) the entire world that all muslims are terrorists, then - well.. then no good can ever come from this discussion 3) as mentioned earlier, he is even depicted in mosques around the world - if you want, here's a list of older depictions of the profet: http://info2us.dk/muhammed/ (note: this is a mirror located in denmark, but the original site is not danish) > terrorists! if people beleive it's not true, don't worry, children who > will see these pictures will grow up with that idea (brainwashing the > people, as always.. same as what happened with wearing the hijab (the > veil), now everyone thinks a woman with the hijab is a woman who is beaten > and has no human rights, etc... while it is the total opposite, and noone > ever thought of it as the exact same of christan nuns...) Trust me, if theer had been litte or no reaction, no dane would have even remembered the drawings by now - if anything will make children in the rest of the world think muslims are terrorists, its their reaction to those drawings - nothing else. > Anyways, I won't debate on all this. The thing is that those caricatures > were out, official mulsim associations requested them to be removed and > excuses be sent to the islamic people.. the president of danemark refused > to give us excuses, the newspaper that published those images also refused > to remove them, and alot of other public companies supported the 1) the danish prime minister has no say in the matter - he did not print them, he cannot do anything about other people printing them - it is perfectly legal. 2) how exactly should the newspaper 'remove' them? - it's a printed medium that has been distributed 3) the newspaper has appologised on several occasions, and the danish prime minister has also said that he himself do not find the images 'in good taste', but the simple fact is that he cannot appologise for something he didn't do, and has no control over. > newspaper!! This has no sense, especially when you hear a politician say > "bush is stupid for doing it this way" and he gives his excuses to the USA > and leaves all political activities because he wasn't 'politically > correct'.. but for muslims, no way they give excuses.. The most shocking > part of all this for me was when I heard that France, Norway and Germany > published those same images in protest AGAINST muslims!!! they protest, This is not in protest against muslims, it is in protest against the violent reactions, burning the danish embassy is an act of war (if the government organized it) or just goverment supported terrorism if they wittingly allowed it to happen - the army was there, yet nothing was done to stop it, so it's one of the above. > saying that it's 'freedom of speech' and they should be allowed to publish > those images if they want.. I was really shoked to think people would say > things like this!! because I though freedom of speech is to have the > freedom to say the truth without anyone forcing us to keep things quiet... > now it became freedom of speech meaning you can lie and disrespect a > religion!!! Where is our freedom in this ??? Satirical drawings has nothing to do with lying - your freedom is to ignoer us - odds are you would probably never have heard of the images, unless other muslims had distributed them > Anyways, it's been a huge hit to the muslim community, a lot of trouble is > taking place everywhere especially in Palestine I think because they just > can't handle any more humiliations... > By the way, did you ever hear muslims say something against other > religions ? We respect christians and jews.. there was never soemthing you meen like calling christians 'godless animals' and the likes? - yes I have - at least people who claim to be muslims. > humiliating for you that we ever released... wars were never done on > churches... When you see that some countries are happy to launch missiles > on mosques at the hour where everyone is praying in the mosquee in order > to kill the maximum number of muslims, but muslims never attacked a church > during war.. even terrorists (who are NOT muslims) never bombed a church > or anything like that... so why do other religions always have to attack > our religion ? Anyways.. just imagine if we released in the arabic world This is not a case of one religion attacking another - it's images printed by a privatly owned newspaper. > images of Jesus/Mary in humiliating postitions and I don't want to give > any examples of such images that could be released.. what would the other Exept for maybe a few 'extremist' groups in USA, I can assure you that no one else would have cared - especially danes, that's for sure - jesus is often depicted in satirical contexts, and we're a protestant christian country > countries say ? I don't think they'll ever say anything, they'll just send > some missiles to the headquarters of the newspaper who released these > images... now imagine countries taking position and doing the same > claiming it's "freedom of speech"... > Anyways, I'm not a religious guy, I am indeed muslim, but I'd say muslim > of education and beliefs but not of actions.. I mean, I never prayed, I > never follow any of the rules or anything.. but one thing I can't stand, > is when people disrespect one of God's religions (no matter which one)... This is one of the fundamental differences between muslims (at least many of them) and most of the rest of the world - we couldn't give a rats ass about who thinks what about our beliefs or way of life - what they think about it is their choice, and we would never dream about forcing them to keep quite about it. On that note, I'd like to say that of course I have no problem with muslims who were insulted, they are allowed to be - they are allowed to try the case in court, and to use any non-violent means they can think of to try to influence the way people think and act - that's all fine. What is not acceptable, is responding with violence - especially against ordinary danes, who had nothing to do with the drawrings and their publication. Finally, I would like to add that I consider none of what I have said 'flaming' - I believe my post to be mostly factual, but if anyone should dissagree, please note which subjects are not substanciated thouroughly enough, and I will try to provide further documentation/background. > This email/forward is intended to ask from you to go vote on this website : > http://www.lemonde.fr/web/sondage/0,25-0,15-737075,0.html > it seems the 'Le monde' newspaper is having a poll to know if people > approve and understand the reaction of muslims (burning Danemark's embassy > for example) or not... > I don't approve it, as it is against Islam to act this violently, but I do > understand their reaction... > I don't want to start a flamewar, especially not on this subject, so I > don't want people to start answering this mail and flaming other's > opinions.. I would just want to have everyone's opinion on this, but I > don't want people to comment on other's opinion.. If I see someone say > something untrue or with whom I disagree, I will control myself and not > answer to avoid the flaming... (which means if I don't answer, it doesn't > mean I agree with you :P). In any case, no matter what your choice is and > what you think, it's the same for me as long as you say it in a respectful > manner!! > Could everyone go vote on the website, it's important to everyone I think! > > The poll is : > Devant la polémique suscitée par la publication de caricatures > représentant Mahomet et l'associant parfois au terrorisme, quelle est > votre réaction ? > 'In front of' the polemic that was brought by the publication of the > caricatures representing Mahomet and sometimes associating it with > terrorism, what is your reaction ? > > The choices are : > Vous comprenez l'indignation qu'elles suscitent parmi les musulmans . == > > You understand the indignation that they brought amongst muslims > Vous la jugez abusive : il s'agit de simples caricatures == > You judge > them (muslims reactions) abusive : they're just simple caricatures anyways. > Sans opinion == > Without opinion. > > > Thank you all and sorry for the off topic, but I really think it's > important! > > KaKaRoTo > Objet: c'est tr?s important !! > > Salam alaykoum wa rahmat Allah wa Barakatouhou > >>>>>> > Je vous transmets un message que je viens de recevoir : > > Le journal LE MONDE vient de publier un sondage sur le > jugement de la publication des caricatures repr?sentant le > Proph?te Mohamed salla ALLAH alih wa sallam en l'associant au > terrorisme. > > Participez vite pour basculer le sondage au bon choix, et > faites passer le mot au plus grand nombre de personnes. > > *http://www.lemonde.fr/web/sondage/0,25-0,15-737075,0.html* > > Si le lien ne fonctionne pas, faites un copier du lien et > coller le dans votre navigateur, je vous en remercie. Votre > voix compte ! > Faites tourner ce message ? tous vos contacts, s'il vous plait > > Devant la pol?mique suscit?e par la publication de caricatures > repr?sentant Mahomet et l'associant parfois au terrorisme, > quelle est votre r?action ? > *Vous comprenez l'indignation qu'elles suscitent parmi les > musulmans . 41.8 % > Vous la jugez abusive : il s'agit de simples caricatures . > 56.6 % > Sans opinion . 1.6 % > > > Nombre de votants : 30763* > > > > Que Dieu te r?compense par le paradis, Inch'Allah > > > > > > > > > > R?cemment, au Danemark, un journal a lanc? > un concours sur lA meilleur caricature de NOTRE CHER PROPHETE Muhammed (Paix > Et Benediction Soit Sur Lui). > > En effet, 12 caricatures ont ?t? publi?es montrant le personnage du proph?te > v?tu d'un chapeau pleins d'armes et d'explosifs, ou en train de faire la > priere d'une fa?on humiliante et pire encore !!! > > Sachez mes freres et soeurs, que toutes les institutions publiques de la > soci?t? danoise ont soutenu ce journal suite ? l'appel lanc? par la > communaut? musulmane au Denmark pour arreter cette compagne contre l'ISLAM. > > Donc nous lan?ons un appel ? tout musulman jaloux pour sa religion, de > diffuser ce message et d'inciter son entourage au *BOYCOTT des produits > danois (laits assech?s :Nido, Anchor, beurre LaPark,....).* > N'oubliez pas que > nous allons rencontrer Le Prophete (Paix et Benediction Soit Sur Lui) sur la > rivi?re de Al KAWTAR et pensez ? la r?ponse que nous allons donner. > > Imaginez ?galement que votre m?re, ou votre soeur vient d'?tre insult?, > quelle sera votre r?action akhi./okhti? et Qu'aimes-tu le plus akhi/okhti? > > prefere-tu ta famille ? ton noble proph?te? > > Que faire ?? > Best regards -- Christian Sonne Stud. IT at Technical University of Denmark -----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK----- Version: 3.12 GM/S/CS/O d? s: a--->? C++ UL++>$ P+ L++ E--- W++ N o@ K? w !O M-- V? PS++(+) PE@ Y-- PGP-@ t+ 5? X++ R@ tv++ b+(++) DI+>++ D G@ e>+++++ h! r-(--) y? ------END GEEK CODE BLOCK------ http://geeksbynature.dk ------------------------------------------------------- This SF.net email is sponsored by: Splunk Inc. Do you grep through log files for problems? Stop! Download the new AJAX search engine that makes searching your log files as easy as surfing the web. DOWNLOAD SPLUNK! http://sel.as-us.falkag.net/sel?cmd=lnk&kid3432&bid#0486&dat1642 _______________________________________________ Amsn-devel mailing list [email protected] https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/amsn-devel
