I just remember something about Python... When you were all thinking only about Tcl/Tk, my father already used Python (I studied it a little too) and it was a hell to have a good graphic interface... And guess what ? What was the only GUI binding for Python ? TK !! Yes you have well read... And what I thought the first time I saw that it's ugly :p... After that there was tix based on TK to add others widgets and the last thing my father tried for GUI was PyQT... I remember he had many difficulties to install all of that... And I remember I wasn't able to understand why there was so much things to do to have only a little window to display... Maybe it has changed, I don't know... Another point is Doc... I never managed to find easily something in Python docs : their organization is so bloated... Who can find for me (without using Google) how you access files with the built-in functions ? Phil PS I don't put all these points in the wiki because I am not sure they are actual and enough objective...
Le Sunday 20 August 2006 11:46, Sander Hoentjen a écrit : > http://amsn.sourceforge.net/wiki/tiki-index.php?page=Programming > +Language+Pros+And+Cons > > Go on and change to your liking, but try to be fair. > This means if you put in the wiki: Python is faster to develop, then > give a link to a study that says so. Don't put it there if you just > think it is faster. Also if somebody else replies with a link to a study > that shows TCL or something else is faster, that pro can be removed. > (stuff like that is hard to measure anyway, so in my opinion we best > leave it out) > > On Sun, 2006-08-20 at 03:06 -0400, Youness Alaoui wrote: > > Pros and Cons from burger seem to be pretty biased, but that's not > > important, your idea of wiki-ing it is good and I suggest we go this way. > > This whole 'which language to choose' thing is getting on my nerves, and > > I'm willing to approve anything that gets accepted by the majority. As > > burger suggested, a poll should be set up and we can vote. I would also > > suggest it to be put on the forums... even if the users opinion won't > > change much (because they are users, not devels), if the poll's questions > > are well chosen and clear, it would allow us to know how many users can > > become devels and contribute (if many users say, like Madd Matt that > > they'll help out if it's python, then the 'pros' for python will grow). > > Also, why choose between python vs. tcl ? isn't there any other language > > ? for example perl... I wouldn't vote for that one because of its > > unmaintainbility once the code is bigger than a few lines, but if we are > > to 'finally' take the time to study which language to use for the core, > > then we should at least see all the possibilities. > > It would be interesting to also wiki the language to use for the other > > modules... I mean, if we have 10 modules, all in C, then why have the > > core in a different language while it could be in C also... > > And finally, I would like to say that the only way this is going to work > > is to stay close to the facts, we all have brains and we're all logical > > people, if the pros vs. cons give logicals reasons for choosing a > > specific language, then we should CHOOSE LOGICALLY, NOT EMOTIONALY. I > > know I wouldn't want to use python for an emotional reason (I don't like > > it) more than for a logical reason. Trying to see the logic in this, I > > would say that for now, python vs. Tcl is a 50%-50% thing, or maybe a bit > > more than 50% for python (but please note, even if you already know it.. > > that I HATE its syntax :P) > > that being said.. let the discussion (that I delayed for so long) BEGIN! > > and let the language choosing research/poll begin! > > > > KaKaRoTo > > > > On Sat, Aug 19, 2006 at 11:30:46PM -0400, Madd Matt wrote: > > > You mean python cons where you say TCL cons at one point. > > > > > > Having learned python, you get used to the indentation very fast. I > > > wouldn't list it as a big con. You get very readable code as a result > > > as well. Its debatable. > > > > > > Another Pro is I can do more than sit on the sidelines and listen to > > > this mailing list with python. I was about to start writing my own > > > python msn client, but I'll help this one instead if that language is > > > picked. > > > > > > On 8/19/06, Philippe Khalaf <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > Hi, > > > > > > > > I reread all posts about this, and here is what I got : > > > > > > > > Quick summary of what was said until now. > > > > > > > > ------ TCL PROS in aMSN2 ---------- > > > > - No need for anyone to learn any new language (good & bad reason) > > > > - If people learn a new language, the intial code will probably be > > > > crap (good reason, but it might also bring in new experienced devs to > > > > help out) > > > > - We *might* be able to reuse code (good reason, but not sure how > > > > much code we really can reuse in new design) > > > > - cross-platform > > > > > > > > ------ TCL CONS in aMSN2 ---------- > > > > - Bindings hell (this might just be a complete project killer btw) > > > > - old, outdated, unpopular language (this means it's harder to > > > > capture young and bright hackers who are interested in better and > > > > more popular languages) > > > > - In aMSN2, the main advantage of using TCL/TK (cross platform, no > > > > compilation), is long gone. > > > > > > > > ------ PYTHON PROS in aMSN2 ---------- > > > > - new popular and active language (this means many more hackers will > > > > probably join the project) > > > > - opportunity to expand our skills and learn something new and better > > > > - all required bindings are available, maintained and distributed > > > > - faster development than TCL or most any other languages > > > > - object oriented language > > > > - cross-platform > > > > > > > > ------ TCL CONS in aMSN2 ---------- > > > > - Wierd indentation (very bad reason) > > > > - Must learn new language (not necessarily a bad thing) > > > > - what else? > > > > > > > > If someone would please put this up on the wiki and then anyone who > > > > has any new PROs and CONS can add it. Once we feel it is complete we > > > > can vote. Anyone has any objections to this methodology? > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > Philippe > > > > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > >---- Using Tomcat but need to do more? Need to support web services, > > > > security? Get stuff done quickly with pre-integrated technology to > > > > make your job easier Download IBM WebSphere Application Server > > > > v.1.0.1 based on Apache Geronimo > > > > http://sel.as-us.falkag.net/sel?cmd=lnk&kid=120709&bid=263057&dat=121 > > > >642 _______________________________________________ > > > > Amsn-devel mailing list > > > > Amsn-devel@lists.sourceforge.net > > > > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/amsn-devel > > > > > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- > > >-- Using Tomcat but need to do more? Need to support web services, > > > security? Get stuff done quickly with pre-integrated technology to make > > > your job easier Download IBM WebSphere Application Server v.1.0.1 based > > > on Apache Geronimo > > > http://sel.as-us.falkag.net/sel?cmd=lnk&kid=120709&bid=263057&dat=12164 > > >2 _______________________________________________ > > > Amsn-devel mailing list > > > Amsn-devel@lists.sourceforge.net > > > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/amsn-devel > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Using Tomcat but need to do more? Need to support web services, security? > > Get stuff done quickly with pre-integrated technology to make your job > > easier Download IBM WebSphere Application Server v.1.0.1 based on Apache > > Geronimo > > http://sel.as-us.falkag.net/sel?cmd=lnk&kid=120709&bid=263057&dat=121642 > > _______________________________________________ > > Amsn-devel mailing list > > Amsn-devel@lists.sourceforge.net > > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/amsn-devel > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > Using Tomcat but need to do more? Need to support web services, security? > Get stuff done quickly with pre-integrated technology to make your job > easier Download IBM WebSphere Application Server v.1.0.1 based on Apache > Geronimo > http://sel.as-us.falkag.net/sel?cmd=lnk&kid=120709&bid=263057&dat=121642 > _______________________________________________ > Amsn-devel mailing list > Amsn-devel@lists.sourceforge.net > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/amsn-devel ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Using Tomcat but need to do more? Need to support web services, security? Get stuff done quickly with pre-integrated technology to make your job easier Download IBM WebSphere Application Server v.1.0.1 based on Apache Geronimo http://sel.as-us.falkag.net/sel?cmd=lnk&kid=120709&bid=263057&dat=121642 _______________________________________________ Amsn-devel mailing list Amsn-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/amsn-devel
