Absolutely, I think I made pretty clear that it wasn't intended as a solution. (E.g., my many previous posts agreeing with you and admitting it was a numbers game.)
But that being said, if it's a numbers game, the idea gets you a lot closer to it than testing on the n devices you own. To be fair, in the case of maps you have slightly more to test because you have a bunch of graphics firmware code, etc... I know that you can also find more mundane examples giving evidence of this phenomenon with the "regular" Android SDK, however. Kris On Sun, Jul 28, 2013 at 6:19 PM, Kostya Vasilyev <[email protected]> wrote: > A testing service still -- focuses only on specific device models, assuming > deterministic failures, ignoring "weird shit" that can happen on seemingly > any of them, even the "good ones". > > Going back to my Youtube video of Google Maps causing a device reboot: > > Is the Galaxy Nexus a "bad" device? No. > > Wasn't Google Maps tested on it? I'm sure it was. > > And yet, there it was. > > PS - I'm not saying a testing service (commercial or co-op, test driven or > manual) is useless (it's probably very good, I've just never used one), or > that limited distribution is not *a* solution (I can see it being *a* > solution). Just wanted to point out that even if you do all that, there is > still weird stuff that can happen, and will. > > -- K > > > 2013/7/29 Kristopher Micinski <[email protected]> >> >> So in this case, how does a subscription based test service not help >> you? I'm not saying that a concrete one exists, but I think this kind >> of debugging service (or coop, essentially) would be a good tool. You >> include a time metric, do some tasks to help other developers', and >> they do some work of doing yours. One of the problems here is the >> heterogenous distribution of devices, but I don't think that's an >> inherent limitation. >> >> I've thought about starting up one of these services for a while, but >> don't really have the resources to do so. >> >> (I think in my previous posts you thought I was advocating a >> pushbutton testing service: I wasn't. But the point still stands: if >> you want to test on greater devices, do it with a service and possibly >> humans in the loop. Big testing services should integrate this work >> cycle too, for when pushbutton tests don't work...) >> >> Kris >> >> >> On Sun, Jul 28, 2013 at 5:29 PM, Omer Gilad <[email protected]> wrote: >> > What you wrote is the obvious part of what I do - test with beta users. >> > I >> > agree that this is a must. >> > >> > The problem is, sometimes it's impossible to debug what you find. >> > When the issue is not a simple crash stack trace - but rather some >> > behavior, >> > or display issue, you can't just keep ping-ponging versions with a user >> > without wasting whole days on that... You need the device in your hand. >> > And as an indie developer, it's practically impossible to get a hold of >> > many >> > different devices. >> > >> > >> > On Sunday, July 28, 2013 12:47:30 PM UTC+3, Piren wrote: >> >> >> >> Wrote a lengthy response but my browser decided not to post it, so >> >> here's >> >> the short version: >> >> >> >> - That's a known problem with android development, it was obvious about >> >> a >> >> couple of months after it came out. when the premise of the system is >> >> to be >> >> open and as varied as possible, this kind of issues are a given. >> >> - Under your limitations, the best approach is to release the app only >> >> to >> >> a small subset of devices it was tested on and expand that subset as >> >> time >> >> goes on. Use an open beta group for devices you do not have access to. >> >> Even >> >> Netflix was released on only 5 devices. >> >> - iOS development might not have this issue (it has fragmentation, but >> >> it >> >> isn't the same as android's), but over all i believe android has a more >> >> developer friendly ecosystem... instead of being frustrated with this, >> >> you'll find more than enough other iOS specific issues that will >> >> frustrate >> >> you.. especially since you're used to how Android is. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> On Friday, July 26, 2013 1:39:14 AM UTC+3, Omer Gilad wrote: >> >>> >> >>> .I am wondering how developers here are dealing with the fact that >> >>> there >> >>> are 1000's of devices out there, some of them running your >> >>> applications in >> >>> very broken ways >> >>> .I keep running into these kind of issues again and again for the past >> >>> 3 >> >>> years, and to be honest, I'm fed up with it >> >>> .I've decided to move to iOS development, and the only way to convince >> >>> me >> >>> otherwise is to give me a decent, reliable way of dealing with >> >>> fragmentation >> >>> >> >>> So what do you do when you develop a game, for example, and try to >> >>> create >> >>> a high-quality user experience on Google Play? >> >>> Do you do your QA on 50 different devices? 100? 1000? >> >>> Or do you just shoot blindly and hope that it works, or wait for users >> >>> to >> >>> send you bug reports? >> >>> >> >>> To make it clear, I'm not talking about "official" fragmentation. >> >>> I don't talk about different screen sizes, densities, features, OS >> >>> versions and so on. >> >>> I talk about the "unofficial" fragmentation. The fact that most >> >>> devices, >> >>> even the popular ones from the big companies like Samsung, HTC, >> >>> Motorola, LG >> >>> and so on, contain tons of implementation bugs that prevent apps from >> >>> working correctly. >> >>> I'm talking about the fact that you can call a certain simple API, >> >>> test >> >>> it on a stock Android ROM (like on Nexus 4), and then have your >> >>> application >> >>> crash on some Samsung, that decided to break the implementation >> >>> because of >> >>> some customization. >> >>> >> >>> How can people stand that? >> >>> How is it possible to write code, when the machine that executes it is >> >>> completely broken in unexpected ways? >> >>> >> >>> I'm really fed up with it. >> >>> About 50% of my Android development time is wasted on babysitting >> >>> broken >> >>> devices. >> >>> I'm waiting for an official Google response about this, and what have >> >>> you >> >>> been doing in all those years to fix that. >> >>> I've heard about things like "conformance tests" for devices and so >> >>> on, >> >>> but the reality is far from acceptable in this area. >> >>> >> >>> ,Looking forward for helpful responses >> >>> Omer >> > >> > -- >> > -- >> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >> > Groups "Android Developers" group. >> > To post to this group, send email to [email protected] >> > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >> > [email protected] >> > For more options, visit this group at >> > http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers?hl=en >> > --- >> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >> > Groups >> > "Android Developers" group. >> > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send >> > an >> > email to [email protected]. >> > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. >> > >> > >> >> -- >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >> Groups "Android Developers" group. >> To post to this group, send email to [email protected] >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >> [email protected] >> For more options, visit this group at >> http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers?hl=en >> --- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "Android Developers" group. >> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >> email to [email protected]. >> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. >> >> > > -- > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google > Groups "Android Developers" group. > To post to this group, send email to [email protected] > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > [email protected] > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers?hl=en > --- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Android Developers" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to [email protected]. > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. > > -- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Android Developers" group. 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