arachne-digest Friday, June 8 2001 Volume 01 : Number 1546 ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 06 Jun 2001 14:19:22 -0500 From: "Sam Ewalt" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: Re: Arachne dying, lynx in good health? On Tue, 5 Jun 2001 15:40:10 -0900 (PDT), Howard Schwartz wrote: > Do others have the feeling that arachne is starting its death stroll > these days, because of the frustration of one or 2 authors trying to > keep up with all the rapidly increasing amount of nutty web page > designs, languages, tools, and big-company specific do-dads? Does anybody *know* what's happening with Michael? He did announce that Javascript support was "expected in the next release", but that was around six months ago. Nothing since then. Is he concentrating on his other ventures? > Strangely, the old Unix standby lynx still seems to be able to give > a decent rendering to most of the crazy new types of pages. Perhaps > this is because there are a lot more people maintaining lynx, it > is such a traditional part of all types of Unix, etc. It's much easier to ignore than to render. And there are lots of people involved in ongoing Lynx development. Sam Ewalt Croswell, Michigan, USA - -- Arachne V1.70;rev.3, NON-COMMERCIAL copy, http://arachne.cz/ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 06 Jun 2001 21:13:26 +0300 From: Cristian Burneci <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: Re: something wrong at the roots? Let's see now... hda1 =C:\ - primary Windows partition hda2 = the extended partition with hda5=/, hda6=swap hda7= /home, all logical partitions hda3 =D:\ - another primary Windows partition Now, I wonder why Windows fdisk doesn't allow creating more than *one* primary partition on a given hard drive. There must be a rock solid reason for this. At least try and unset the bootable flag of the second primary partition. Mesajul original a fost trimis de Joerg Bartels <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> la data de Tue, 05 Jun 2001 12:23:46 EDT > Hello! > I made the big step from my P60 to a AMD-monster 850MHz with 20GB HD. > With parts from the trash in my compstore it was only about 300 euro. First I > was booting with a Mandrake CD-ROM 8.0 and formating the HD with ext2. > All works fine but then I saw I need windows. I made a partition for win98, > tryed to install it -and failed. Next try and windows formated the HD! Ok > must be my mistake. I made the windowsinstall, windows works Linux was > blowing in the wind. I put the Linux-CD back and with DiskDrake I made a > Linux partition all works fine. After a time I made a drive d: with DiskDrake > and formated it under Linux with FAT32. Under windows there was the > drive but windows could not read it only after formating under windows. > Ok long talking- now my question. With some disktools windows crash on the d: > drive (eg. SequoiaView) and sometimes windows says there are errors in the > bootsektor of d: ? -It can fix it with scandisk- Under Linux the disk looks > like: /mnt/windows hda1 DOS c: /mnt/disk2 hda3 DOS d: / hda5 /swap hda6 > /home hda7 Is there something wrong with that Partitontab ? > > Thanks for reading! > > regards Joerg -fare from installing his good old DRDOS- - -- Cristian Burneci DHP Technology SRL Bucharest, Romania ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 7 Jun 2001 05:15:31 -0400 (EDT) From: "Thomas Mueller" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: Re: Linux Question? OS/2 Warp 4 bombed out on me at a time of idleness, at an OS/2 command prompt, with Trap 000e. After that, the hard disks were inaccessible, but mysteriously became accessible again while in DR-DOS 7.03. Then I booted Linux but couldn't mount the HPFS partition because it had the "dirty" flag, from OS/2 terminating abnormally. So I tried booting OS/2 Warp 4 again, got Trap 000d when CHKDSKing the HPFS partition on second hard disk, was never able to access hard disks again, but intend to try and see if I can rejumper and access the hard disks with one at a time installed. When I tried subsequently to boot OS/2 Warp 4 updated boot diskettes, I got trap 000d. However, I can boot Linux N_5380.S kernel and root diskette, either by diskettes or by LOADLIN, and access the Iomega external SCSI Zip 250, but when I try to mount the internal SCSI CD-ROM, the system hangs. Did you ever try running Arachne in OS/2 Warp Server for e-business VDM? When I ran Arachne in OS/2 Warp 4 VDM, it was much slower than under DR-DOS 7.03. Downloading with DOS Lynx386 was also much slower in OS/2 Warp 4 VDM than under DR-DOS 7.03. I found OS/2 Warp 4 Workplace Shell much more user-friendly than Windows. I was able to run some Windows programs, even some 32-bit programs with Win32s. I see they are running more Win32 programs with Project Odin, and this will be part of eComStation by Serenity Systems, which is client successor to OS/2 Warp 4. Most people in the computer business never heard of eComStation. Indelible Blue, sole reseller of eComStation in the U.S.A., went out of business May 31, 2001, passing the eComStation baton to Prism Data Works (http://www.prismdataworks.com/ecs) eComStation has a Web site http://www.ecomstation.com I would like to see how NetBSD compares to Linux. (Free, Net, Open)BSD users keep saying how their OS is sturdier than Linux. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 7 Jun 2001 05:15:33 -0400 (EDT) From: "Thomas Mueller" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: Re: Arachne dying, lynx in good health? from Howard Schwartz <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: I got a lot of responses to the following when I sent it to the survpc list, so it seemed reasonable to send it to the original as well: ------------------------ Do others have the feeling that arachne is starting its death stroll these days, because of the frustration of one or 2 authors trying to keep up with all the rapidly increasing amount of nutty web page designs, languages, tools, and big-company specific do-dads? The result is that, while arachne is great at what it does, it is increasingly ineffective at dealing with more and more sites, filled with real audio streaming something or other, graphic hot spots, etc. etc. Probably modern, highlevel html source editors make html authors not even know how to write simple, text-based coded. Instead, necessary text is all put in GIFs, basic parts of the page are automatically rendered, unnecessarily in XMP, TCL, dynamic cgi-scripts etc. etc. etc. Strangely, the old Unix standby lynx still seems to be able to give a decent rendering to most of the crazy new types of pages. Perhaps this is because there are a lot more people maintaining lynx, it is such a traditional part of all types of Unix, etc. Really too bad, if true. - --------------------- (end of quote) Was Arachne ever really going strong? Is its death stroll anything new? But now, RAM is so cheap, there is no sense buying a new computer with less than 256 MB, computer users move on to bigger things. Why put up with Arachne's clumsy scrolling and other comical flaws? Lynx has the advantage of being open-source, ported to many Unixes and some non-Unixes too. Newer versions show all images, including inline, as links, downloadable or viewable on separate screen. How many people are working on Arachne? Lynx is useful on those super-image-laden Web sites that are just too slow in a graphic browser. Didn't we hear some time last year that Arachne was going to be developed for portable, handheld devices like palmtops and cell phones? ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 7 Jun 2001 05:15:28 -0400 (EDT) From: "Thomas Mueller" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: Re: something wrong at the roots? from Joerg Bartels: Hello! I made the big step from my P60 to a AMD-monster 850MHz with 20GB HD. With parts from the trash in my compstore it was only about 300 euro. First I was booting with a Mandrake CD-ROM 8.0 and formating the HD with ext2. All works fine but then I saw I need windows. I made a partition for win98, tryed to install it -and failed. Next try and windows formated the HD! Ok must be my mistake. I made the windowsinstall, windows works Linux was blowing in the wind. I put the Linux-CD back and with DiskDrake I made a Linux partition all works fine. After a time I made a drive d: with DiskDrake and formated it under Linux with FAT32. Under windows there was the drive but windows could not read it only after formating under windows. Ok long talking- now my question. With some disktools windows crash on the d: drive (eg. SequoiaView) and sometimes windows says there are errors in the bootsektor of d: ? -It can fix it with scandisk- Under Linux the disk looks like: /mnt/windows hda1 DOS c: /mnt/disk2 hda3 DOS d: / hda5 /swap hda6 /home hda7 Is there something wrong with that Partitontab ? Thanks for reading! regards Joerg -fare from installing his good old DRDOS- (end of quote) Why did you need Windows? I intend to prove I don't need Windows when I buy new computer (then I probably won't need Arachne either, sorry to say). When anybody but MS writes a program that formats the whole hard disk when you didn't intend to, they call it a Trojan horse. When MS writes such a program, they call it Windows. Windows has been known to format the whole hard disk on installing, unlike DOS, OS/2, Linux, (Free, Net, Open)BSD. I partitioned my second hard disk into three logical partitions, using Linux fdisk. I tagged /dev/hdb5 as type 6, /dev/hdb6 as type 7, and /dev/hdb7 as type 83. Subsequently I formatted /dev/hdb5 with OS/2 Warp 3 as FAT, /dev/hdb6 with OS/2 Warp 3 as HPFS, and /dev/hdb7 with Linux as Linux native. MS-DOS 5 and 6.22, and Win98 emergency boot diskette, couldn't access that DOS partition ("Invalid media"), Datalight didn't even recognize that partition at all, but DR-DOS had no trouble; FreeDOS also read that DOS partition. Linux had no problems on these partitions. MS-DOS and Windows are buggy! My reason for downloading the Win98SE emergency boot diskette image was to see if it would give me the same "Invalid media" message. Also, this Win98SE boot diskette couldn't read a diskette in my then working 5.25" 1.2 MB (B:) drive, a surprise since that 5.25" 1.2 MB diskette was readable to MS-DOS 5 and 6.22 as well as DR-DOS and OS/2. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 07 Jun 2001 07:58:33 +0100 From: "Joerg Dietze" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: Re: Arachne dying, lynx in good health? Hi folks, I'm a little bit upset about the talking about Arachnes death. Yes, there are several bugs. Yes, there are several bells and whistles Arachne is not able to handle. Yes, there are several websites Arachne can't handle properly due to bad html code or whatever. But comparing A. with Lynx is not fair at all. Lynx is a text browser and Arachne is a graphical one. For extracting text from html code You don't need a browser. Get the page with wget and read it with Your favorite text editor. If You need graphical information, like maps,satellite photos, images of Arachne users :-), a graphical browser is needed. And AFAIK there is no graphical browser for DOS which is as stable as Arachne, even A.1.70rev.3 is more stable and more useful than any other thing I tested, including Skipper which comes with Geos/ Newdeal. I'm using A. since version 1.60b1 for my daily internet stuff (reading mail, looking at some story pages, reading some news at web.de) and it _WORKS_. Speaking about scrolling, remember that when You hit page up or page down, with a resolution of 1024x786 HiColor about 1.6 MB are to be moved via Your bus system. Compare this with the speed of Your ISA bus and You'll know what You can expect. With the exeption of dozeware, there is no slow software. Regards Joerg, looking forward for next version of Arachne. On Thu, 7 Jun 2001 05:15:33 -0400 (EDT), Thomas Mueller wrote: <snipped Howard's quote> > Was Arachne ever really going strong? Is its death stroll anything new? But > now, RAM is so cheap, there is no sense buying a new computer with less than > 256 MB, computer users move on to bigger things. Why put up with Arachne's > clumsy scrolling and other comical flaws? > Lynx has the advantage of being open-source, ported to many Unixes and some > non-Unixes too. Newer versions show all images, including inline, as links, > downloadable or viewable on separate screen. How many people are working on > Arachne? Lynx is useful on those super-image-laden Web sites that are just too > slow in a graphic browser. > Didn't we hear some time last year that Arachne was going to be developed for > portable, handheld devices like palmtops and cell phones? - -- Arachne V1.70, NON-COMMERCIAL copy, http://arachne.cz/ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 08 Jun 2001 00:07:48 -0400 From: "Clarence Verge" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: Re: Arachne dying, lynx in good health? On Thu, 7 Jun 2001 05:15:33 -0400 (EDT), Thomas Mueller wrote: > Was Arachne ever really going strong? Is its death stroll anything new? Probably no to both, but strength is relative and there are lots of delays on death row. ;-) >But now, RAM is so cheap, there is no sense buying a new computer with > less than 256 MB, Why would any reasonable person fill their computer with stuff they don't need just because it's cheap ? I'm setting up a new business requiring four new computers for the engineering department. Are we buying 1.2 Ghz boxes with 256Mb ram ? No way. 600-800Mhz PIIIs with 128M and that's both more speed and more memory than we will ever need. It's not the cost, it's the value. > users move on to bigger things. No doubt the majority are moving on to BIGGER things, but WE are moving on to BETTER things, I hope. <g> >Why put up with Arachne's clumsy scrolling and other comical flaws? Mostly because we like Arachne. <G> And for me, it gets the job done in a more pleasant manner than anything I have ever seen anywhere. > Lynx has the advantage of being open-source, ported to many Unixes and some > non-Unixes too. Newer versions show all images, including inline, as links, > downloadable or viewable on separate screen. How many people are working on > Arachne? Lynx is useful on those super-image-laden Web sites that are just > too slow in a graphic browser. I like Lynx a lot and if I never wanted to see a picture I would certainly use it. But that's not what most of us want or need. I'm not familiar with the new Lynxes you speak of. Perhaps the PERFECT software would be Lynx-like speed and Kevlar coating with Arachne's graphic capability. - - Clarence Verge - - Back to using Arachne V1.62 .... ------------------------------ End of arachne-digest V1 #1546 ******************************
