arachne-digest Thursday, December 26 2002 Volume 01 : Number 1995
---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 24 Dec 2002 18:11:19 +00 From: "Bastiaan Edelman, PA3FFZ" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: Re: WWWMAN and Win95: bug found!!! Congratulations !!! On Mon, 23 Dec 2002 21:46:48 -0500, Glenn McCorkle wrote: > On Tue, 24 Dec 2002 02:40:38 +00, Bastiaan Edelman, PA3FFZ wrote: >> Harry Potter, also known as Glenn, did it again ! >> Just tested the new wwwman on one machine only (2:31 am local time now) >> and it does not block anymore on \\ >> Gongrats Glenn :*)) > Gongrats ? > ^___????<g> I am a bit dislextic... the enlish spelling is not that simple. > http://www.webster.com/cgi-bin/dictionary?gongrats (nothing) > http://www.webster.com/cgi-bin/dictionary?gongratulation (nothing) > http://www.webster.com/cgi-bin/dictionary?congrats (nothing) > http://www.webster.com/cgi-bin/dictionary?congratulation (something)<g> > http://www.webster.com/cgi-bin/dictionary?congratulations (something)<g> > Congratulations should go to Michal....not me. > Thanks again Michal. :)) Thanks Michal, and Glenn, and Laurie, and others... thanks for the teamwork ;-(( Regards, Bastiaan > -- > Glenn > http://arachne.cz/ > http://www.delorie.com/listserv/mime/ > http://www.angelfire.com/id/glenndoom/download.htm > http://www.thispagecannotbedisplayed.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 24 Dec 2002 19:44:08 +00 From: "Bastiaan Edelman, PA3FFZ" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: access denied Hi List, I installed the new wwwman.exe on 3 machines now 1st = FAT32 laptop with 1.61 and the \\ and Your Computer bug is defenitely gone ( congrats :*) ) 2nd = FAT16 pentium I with 1.61 = new bug 3rd = FAT16 486 with 1.71UE = \\ bug is fixed = congratulations :*) The new bug *********** Booting to DOS, to win95 and DOS box or to win95 and back to DOS makes no difference. In Arachne by pressing F10 gives Arachne Desktop Choosing: All files, HTML pages or Text files does give a BEEP and the cursor disapears. Nothing happens... Touch 'Esc' = go back gives: URL = file:c:\arachne\*.* and the message "De toegang is geweigerd" This means in English: access denied. A reload does not help. Back to the desktop of Arachne, click utilities (works fine) Click 'History', click 'file:c:\arachne\*.*' => access denied again click 'file:@:*.*' => accessible drives = OK access denied on file:c:\arachne\*.htm and file:c:\arachne\*.txt Clicking \\ => file:C:\*.* Choosing now for "arachne\" gives that beep again. ************ So for the time being... the old wwwman.exe is reinstalled and all is well again (except the \\-bug). If I am the only one complaining... there is no point in looking into this matter causing trouble in just one of 3 machines with just one win95 version and Arachne 1.61. ************ CU, Bastiaan ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 24 Dec 2002 20:29:54 From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: test w3manw9x.zip Just tested w3manw9x.zip: Windows 98 [Verze 4.10.1998] Accessible drives Arachne 1.70 file:@:*.* Tue, 24 Dec 2002 20:23:31 _____________________________ Accessible drives ============================= *A: (Floppy) 3.5" 1.44 MB *C: Hard disk *D: MS-RAMDRIVE RAM disk *H: SUBST *I: SUBST *L: MS-RAMDRIVE SUBST *M: SUBST *O: SUBST *P: SUBST *T: SUBST *W: SUBST *X: SUBST *Z: SUBST Christof Lange ________________________________________________________________ Ceskobratrska cirkev evangelicka - Betlemska kaple na Zizkove Prokopova 4/216, 130 00 Praha 3, Czech Republic Tel. (+420) 222 78 06 73 / 222 78 20 02 http://www.volny.cz/cce.zizkov ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 25 Dec 2002 09:08:04 +0000 From: "Ron Clarke" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: Season's Greetings Hi Folks, A merry Christmas to all, it is now Christmas morning in Oz. Regards, Ron Ron Clarke http://homepages.valylink.net.au/~ausreg/index.html http://tadpole.aus.as - -- This mail was written by user of The Arachne Browser - http://arachne.cz/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 24 Dec 2002 19:12:46 -0500 From: "Glenn McCorkle" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: Re: %k On Tue, 24 Dec 2002 10:40:02, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > Glenn, > the $k function is great! Now anybody who needs a frontend for > a DOS database will like to use Arachne for it, because it has > become so easy now to write DGIs. Thank you for this Christmas > present. That's another idea that everyone can thank Clarence for. :)) BTW, I had to change the '$' to '%' in the subject because the cisnet.com SMTP program refuses '$' signs in the subject line. :( 554 Filtered out by Filter 0 because "Subject" = "Re: $k" BTW2, This gives me the perfect opportunity to tell everyone that '%' can be used in mime.cfg instead of '$'. (core.exe recognizes either one when it processes the mime.cfg line) - -- Glenn http://arachne.cz/ http://www.delorie.com/listserv/mime/ http://www.angelfire.com/id/glenndoom/download.htm http://www.thispagecannotbedisplayed.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 24 Dec 2002 15:14:02 -0800 From: "Ray Andrews" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: Re: arachne-digest V1 #1993 Hi Michal, Thanks for the info on DRFAT32 and freeDOS. It looks to me like you've bagged the "\\" bug once and for all. With Clarence incomunicado, I vote for you as our new official ASM guru. > Long filenames are not supported, because Micros**t has some patent > on it. Then what about that ever-so-useful suite of LFN compatible DOS utilities (LCOPY.EXE, LDIR.EXE, ... etc.)? Would Bill make the earth shake in his wrath if he knew about them? Ray Andrews, Vancouver, Canada - -- Arachne V1.71;UE01, NON-COMMERCIAL copy, http://arachne.cz/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 24 Dec 2002 15:37:10 -0800 From: "Ray Andrews" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: Re: arachne-digest V1 #1994 Hi Glenn, Michal, > Subject: Re: WWWMAN and Win95: bug found!!! Bug fix downloaded and tested OK! Man, I wish I could buy you guys a beer. Oh, and, not to gloat, but L.D, remember when you said that Glenn shouldn't try to fix the "\\" bug because it would turn Arachne into bloatware?? ... Old wwwman.exe = 27,754 bytes New wwwman.exe = 27,664 bytes Sorry for rubbing it in, but now Arachne can live in peace on FAT32 systems and might just become the browser of *choice* for many a Windows user! (Take *that* B.G.) Ray Andrews, Vancouver, Canada - -- Arachne V1.71;UE01, NON-COMMERCIAL copy, http://arachne.cz/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 24 Dec 2002 20:05:11 -0500 From: "Glenn McCorkle" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: Re: arachne-digest V1 #1993 On Tue, 24 Dec 2002 15:14:02 -0800, Ray Andrews wrote: > Hi Michal, > Thanks for the info on DRFAT32 and freeDOS. > It looks to me like you've bagged the "\\" bug once and for all. > With Clarence incomunicado, I vote for you as our new official ASM guru. >> Long filenames are not supported, because Micros**t has some patent >> on it. > Then what about that ever-so-useful suite of LFN compatible DOS utilities > (LCOPY.EXE, LDIR.EXE, ... etc.)? Would Bill make the earth shake in his > wrath if he knew about them? Hmmm, And not to mention... LFNDOS by Chris Jones. ;-) - -- Glenn http://arachne.cz/ http://www.delorie.com/listserv/mime/ http://www.angelfire.com/id/glenndoom/download.htm http://www.thispagecannotbedisplayed.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 24 Dec 2002 21:32:52 -0500 From: Roger Turk <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: Re: arachne-digest V1 #1993 The first PC word processor that I used, the Leading Edge Word Processor (LEWP) that came with the first PC I bought, the Leading Edge Model D (~1986) used long file names and the same technique that M$ uses, the alias file. The only difference between M$'s LFN and LEWP's LFN is that BG puts a tilde before the number, whereas LEWP had no special character between the number and the truncated file name. It seems to me that M$'s LFN is a hoax --- it looks at the LFN, goes to the alias file and finds what 8.3 file name really is used to access the file. If you go to the DOS screen in Windoze and want to go to the "Program Files" folder, you have to "CD PROGRA~1" and the same with other folders/files, eliminating spaces and truncating the LFN to 8.3. Holiday greetings to all around the world. Roger Turk Tucson, Arizona Glenn McC and Ray Andrews wrote: . > On Tue, 24 Dec 2002 15:14:02 -0800, Ray Andrews wrote: . > > Hi Michal, . > > Thanks for the info on DRFAT32 and freeDOS. . > > It looks to me like you've bagged the "\\" bug once and for all. . > > With Clarence incomunicado, I vote for you as our new official ASM guru. . > >> Long filenames are not supported, because Micros**t has some patent . > >> on it. . > > Then what about that ever-so-useful suite of LFN compatible DOS . > utilities > (LCOPY.EXE, LDIR.EXE, ... etc.)? Would Bill make the earth . > shake in his > wrath if he knew about them? . > Hmmm, . > And not to mention... LFNDOS by Chris Jones. ;-) . > -- . > Glenn ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 24 Dec 2002 23:01:19 -0400 From: "L.D. Best" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: Re: arachne-digest V1 #1994 Ray, You misconstrue what I said. I didn't say he should not attempt to fix the \\ bug. What I said, and what I stand by, is that attempting to make Arachne run on advanced platforms when it is designed for -- practically the lifeline for -- low-end legacy non-supported by most of the world systems, said systems neither needing or being able to function with bloatware. l.d. P.S. Grand Solstice, Merry Xmas, Happy post-Channuka, great Kwanza, and any other belief you have which teaches peace, tolerance, and the value of working together ==== On Tue, 24 Dec 2002 15:37:10 -0800, Ray Andrews wrote: > Hi Glenn, Michal, >> Subject: Re: WWWMAN and Win95: bug found!!! > Bug fix downloaded and tested OK! > Man, I wish I could buy you guys a beer. > Oh, and, not to gloat, but L.D, remember when you said that Glenn > shouldn't try to fix the "\\" bug because it would turn Arachne into > bloatware?? ... > Old wwwman.exe = 27,754 bytes > New wwwman.exe = 27,664 bytes > Sorry for rubbing it in, but now Arachne can live in peace on FAT32 systems > and might just become the browser of *choice* for many a Windows user! > (Take *that* B.G.) > Ray Andrews, > Vancouver, Canada > -- Arachne V1.71;UE01, NON-COMMERCIAL copy, http://arachne.cz/ - -- Arachne V1.70;rev.3, NON-COMMERCIAL copy, http://arachne.cz/ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 25 Dec 2002 11:06:37 +0100 From: flox <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: Re: arachne-digest V1 #1993 > And not to mention... LFNDOS by Chris Jones. ;-) I think the best is DOSLFN (link at www.opus.co.tt/dave/) bye, flox - -- Florian Xaver http://www.drdos.org unofficial dr-dos site http://www.flox.at.tf/ dos page - ogg/mp3 page for dos kurt ostbahn & die kombo page ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 25 Dec 2002 06:15:27 -0500 From: "Sam Ewalt" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: Re: Why can't you simply do FTP instead of doing "browser upload"? On Tue, 24 Dec 2002 12:49:47 +0200, Cristian Burneci wrote: > To Glenn: I humbly suggest that, before implementing the HTTP upload, > you should try and fix this d**n word-wrap bug in textareas. It is a > very old bug that nags us every time we write e-mails using the internal > editor. I know the work-around, but it would be nice for us to never > have to resort to it :) IMHO there are lots of other things that deserve attention before that very minor flaw. Being an old fart who learned to type twenty years before PC's were available, I've always hit "enter" at the end of the line. I can do this without thinking. It's a good habit to use short lines for email anyway. I vote for Glenn to concentrate on whatever strikes his fancy. Sam Ewalt Croswell, Michigan, USA - -- Arachne V1.70;rev.3, NON-COMMERCIAL copy, http://arachne.cz/ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 25 Dec 2002 06:33:38 -0500 From: "Sam Ewalt" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: Re: arachne-digest V1 #1993 On Tue, 24 Dec 2002 20:05:11 -0500, Glenn McCorkle wrote: >> Then what about that ever-so-useful suite of LFN compatible DOS utilities >> (LCOPY.EXE, LDIR.EXE, ... etc.)? Would Bill make the earth shake in his >> wrath if he knew about them? > Hmmm, > And not to mention... LFNDOS by Chris Jones. ;-) GEOWORKS supported long filenames in DOS several years before Microsoft managed to get 95 launched. So Microsoft has no claim to the idea whatsoever. Sam Ewalt Croswell, Michigan, USA - -- Arachne V1.70;rev.3, NON-COMMERCIAL copy, http://arachne.cz/ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 25 Dec 2002 06:45:30 -0500 From: "Sam Ewalt" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: Re: arachne-digest V1 #1994 On Tue, 24 Dec 2002 23:01:19 -0400, L.D. Best wrote: > Ray, > You misconstrue what I said. I didn't say he should not attempt to fix > the \\ bug. What I said, and what I stand by, is that attempting to > make Arachne run on advanced platforms when it is designed for -- > practically the lifeline for -- low-end legacy non-supported by most of > the world systems, said systems neither needing or being able to > function with bloatware. Yes, but going into 2003 what's a low end legacy system? Anything running 95, 98 or ME would now be considered "legacy" systems by the mainstream. Tempis fugit. Arachne should be compatible with those no longer advanced systems that are now commonly discarded as "obsolete". Sam Ewalt Croswell, Michigan, USA - -- Arachne V1.70;rev.3, NON-COMMERCIAL copy, http://arachne.cz/ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 25 Dec 2002 14:32:56 +00 From: "Bastiaan Edelman, PA3FFZ" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: Re: arachne-digest V1 #1994 On Wed, 25 Dec 2002 06:45:30 -0500, Sam Ewalt wrote: > On Tue, 24 Dec 2002 23:01:19 -0400, L.D. Best wrote: >> Ray, >> You misconstrue what I said. I didn't say he should not attempt to fix >> the \\ bug. What I said, and what I stand by, is that attempting to >> make Arachne run on advanced platforms when it is designed for -- >> practically the lifeline for -- low-end legacy non-supported by most of >> the world systems, said systems neither needing or being able to >> function with bloatware. > Yes, but going into 2003 what's a low end legacy system? Anything > running 95, 98 or ME would now be considered "legacy" systems by > the mainstream. > Tempis fugit. Arachne should be compatible with those no longer > advanced systems that are now commonly discarded as "obsolete". Many of us are 'forced' to use those 'obsolete' winxx systems... exept for small .txt mailings nearly all text are in WORD-format now. And I have lots of other programs and hardware that need windows... So Arachne must be able to run in an environement where win is present. I started computing with BASIC... DOS... and Windows followed. Everage lifetime of these OS's = 7 years... I wonder what and when is next? Regards, Bastiaan > Sam Ewalt > Croswell, Michigan, USA > -- Arachne V1.70;rev.3, NON-COMMERCIAL copy, http://arachne.cz/ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 25 Dec 2002 14:36:26 +00 From: "Bastiaan Edelman, PA3FFZ" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: Re: arachne-digest V1 #1994 On Tue, 24 Dec 2002 23:01:19 -0400, L.D. Best wrote: > Ray, > You misconstrue what I said. I didn't say he should not attempt to fix > the \\ bug. What I said, and what I stand by, is that attempting to > make Arachne run on advanced platforms when it is designed for -- > practically the lifeline for -- low-end legacy non-supported by most of > the world systems, said systems neither needing or being able to > function with bloatware. > l.d. > P.S. Grand Solstice, Merry Xmas, Happy post-Channuka, great Kwanza, and > any other belief you have which teaches peace, tolerance, and the value > of working together > ==== > On Tue, 24 Dec 2002 15:37:10 -0800, Ray Andrews wrote: >> Hi Glenn, Michal, >>> Subject: Re: WWWMAN and Win95: bug found!!! >> Bug fix downloaded and tested OK! >> Man, I wish I could buy you guys a beer. >> Oh, and, not to gloat, but L.D, remember when you said that Glenn >> shouldn't try to fix the "\\" bug because it would turn Arachne into >> bloatware?? ... Old wwwman.exe 1.61 = 32,540 bytes >> Old wwwman.exe = 27,754 bytes >> New wwwman.exe = 27,664 bytes Bloatware?? We are getting smaller... Bastiaan >> Sorry for rubbing it in, but now Arachne can live in peace on FAT32 systems >> and might just become the browser of *choice* for many a Windows user! >> (Take *that* B.G.) >> Ray Andrews, >> Vancouver, Canada >> -- Arachne V1.71;UE01, NON-COMMERCIAL copy, http://arachne.cz/ > -- Arachne V1.70;rev.3, NON-COMMERCIAL copy, http://arachne.cz/ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 25 Dec 2002 17:36:29 +0100 From: Bart Buitinga <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: Re: arachne-digest V1 #1994 At 15:37 24-12-02 -0800, you wrote: >Hi Glenn, Michal, > >> Subject: Re: WWWMAN and Win95: bug found!!! > >Bug fix downloaded and tested OK! >Man, I wish I could buy you guys a beer. > >Oh, and, not to gloat, but L.D, remember when you said that Glenn >shouldn't try to fix the "\\" bug because it would turn Arachne into >bloatware?? ... > >Old wwwman.exe = 27,754 bytes >New wwwman.exe = 27,664 bytes > >Sorry for rubbing it in, but now Arachne can live in peace on FAT32 systems >and might just become the browser of *choice* for many a Windows user! >(Take *that* B.G.) If you mean the average microsoft wetware, after explaining it the difference between real mode and a dos shell, and convince it of the advantages of knowing such details, you might have a point there. Personally I like arachne most of all because of her educational properties (such as bugs, of course...) BRB > > >Ray Andrews, >Vancouver, Canada > > > >-- Arachne V1.71;UE01, NON-COMMERCIAL copy, http://arachne.cz/ > > > > ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 25 Dec 2002 17:43:36 +0100 From: Bart Buitinga <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: Re: arachne-digest V1 #1994 At 14:32 25-12-02 +00, you wrote: >On Wed, 25 Dec 2002 06:45:30 -0500, Sam Ewalt wrote: > >> On Tue, 24 Dec 2002 23:01:19 -0400, L.D. Best wrote: > >>> Ray, > >>> You misconstrue what I said. I didn't say he should not attempt to fix >>> the \\ bug. What I said, and what I stand by, is that attempting to >>> make Arachne run on advanced platforms when it is designed for -- >>> practically the lifeline for -- low-end legacy non-supported by most of >>> the world systems, said systems neither needing or being able to >>> function with bloatware. > >> Yes, but going into 2003 what's a low end legacy system? Anything >> running 95, 98 or ME would now be considered "legacy" systems by >> the mainstream. > >> Tempis fugit. Arachne should be compatible with those no longer >> advanced systems that are now commonly discarded as "obsolete". > >Many of us are 'forced' to use those 'obsolete' winxx systems... >exept for small .txt mailings nearly all text are in WORD-format now. >And I have lots of other programs and hardware that need windows... Programs we'll all have to choose for ourselves, but considering worddocs, feel free to join me on a little quest to convince others of the necessity to send out info in some other than commercial standard, thus returning all such mail with a request to convert to RTF or HTML. (although I must admit that for me too, having some converter installed is a matter of survival in this town. If I'm not mistaken some doc2txt for dos has already been discussed, together with the pdf2txt converter) BRB > >So Arachne must be able to run in an environement where win is present. > >I started computing with BASIC... DOS... and Windows followed. >Everage lifetime of these OS's = 7 years... I wonder what and when is >next? > >Regards, Bastiaan > >> Sam Ewalt >> Croswell, Michigan, USA >> -- Arachne V1.70;rev.3, NON-COMMERCIAL copy, http://arachne.cz/ > > > ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 25 Dec 2002 10:35:30 -0700 From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: arachne-digest V1 #1994 On Wed, 25 Dec 2002 "Bastiaan Edelman, PA3FFZ" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > > I started computing with BASIC... DOS... and Windows followed. > Everage lifetime of these OS's = 7 years... I wonder what and when > is next? > I'm tired of climbing through WINDOWS. I'm rather be walking through DOORS. Desktop Oriented, Optimized Resource Server (or some other silly phrase). Okay ... I'll go back to bed and dream some more. Bob - - ________________________________________________________________ Sign Up for Juno Platinum Internet Access Today Only $9.95 per month! Visit www.juno.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 25 Dec 2002 10:25:50 -0700 From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: arachne-digest V1 #1994 Yes, Sam ... Except that M$ won't even give me copies of Win95 to put in village schools in developing countries. Rather stupid, considering that a CD-ROM with Win95, Win98, WinME, and Win200Pro (all on one CD) goes for 5 US Dollars on the black market. Even though somebody will probably install Win-doze as soon as I leave the village, I need to deliver a functional system (with software included). Considering the environment, that means all freeware, all DOS. And THAT means Arachne as the HTML Viewer. So, while you're correct about what is now considered 'legacy-ware', there also remains a need for a program that only requires DOS to boot up. If it's possible to keep the DOS and also be compatible with Win-doze, then I'm still happy. If it's one OR the other, I would vote to "close the window" and stick with the (legally) free stuff. Happy Holidays, Bob Dohse On Wed, 25 Dec 2002 06:45:30 -0500 "Sam Ewalt" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > On Tue, 24 Dec 2002 23:01:19 -0400, L.D. Best wrote: > > > Ray, > > > You misconstrue what I said. I didn't say he should not attempt > to fix > > the \\ bug. What I said, and what I stand by, is that attempting > to > > make Arachne run on advanced platforms when it is designed for -- > > practically the lifeline for -- low-end legacy non-supported by > most of > > the world systems, said systems neither needing or being able to > > function with bloatware. > > > Yes, but going into 2003 what's a low end legacy system? Anything > running 95, 98 or ME would now be considered "legacy" systems by > the mainstream. > > Tempis fugit. Arachne should be compatible with those no longer > advanced systems that are now commonly discarded as "obsolete". > > Sam Ewalt > Croswell, Michigan, USA > -- Arachne V1.70;rev.3, NON-COMMERCIAL copy, http://arachne.cz/ > > > ________________________________________________________________ Sign Up for Juno Platinum Internet Access Today Only $9.95 per month! Visit www.juno.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Dec 2002 05:36:50 -0500 From: "Sam Ewalt" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: What's important for Arachne's future? On Wed, 25 Dec 2002 10:25:50 -0700, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > So, while you're correct about what is now considered 'legacy-ware', > there also remains a need for a program that only requires DOS to boot > up. If it's possible to keep the DOS and also be compatible with > Win-doze, then I'm still happy. If it's one OR the other, I would vote to > "close the window" and stick with the (legally) free stuff. Bob, I couldn't agree with you more. I don't use Windows myself-- although I may start any day now because of Javascript and secure transactions on the web. I'd prefer to just keep using DOS. If Glenn and his helpers can cram a little more functionality into Arachne we'll all be happy campers. So here's a question for everyone: What new features are most important for Arachne's future development? Sam Ewalt Croswell, Michigan, USA - -- Arachne V1.70;rev.3, NON-COMMERCIAL copy, http://arachne.cz/ ------------------------------ End of arachne-digest V1 #1995 ******************************
