A capitalistic model does not work for a finite resource like IP addresses. All that would happen is that a large company could just buy up all of the space, and then set its own price for everyone else. How's that for "fairness" ?? I don't see how you can argue for treating smaller orgs more fairly by proposing to allow large companies to set whatever ridiculous price they want.
I still don't get the needs argument at all. If an org can't show that it needs the addresses, then why do they need the addresses? I agree that in the past it was difficult for small non-multihomed orgs to get space. But now that the minimum is a /24, it is so ridiculously easy. -Randy ----- On Dec 19, 2014, at 6:59 PM, Steven Ryerse [email protected] wrote: > I'm not being ignorant I am trying to get to bottom of the discussion. I wish > ARINs resources were issued by ARIN in a capitalistic manner. Then as long as > an Org is willing to pay the going rate resources could be acquired guaranteed > as long as there are sellers. There is no needs testing in that model just > supply and demand and the ability to pay. How do we change to the > Capitalistic > model from what we got now? > > Steven L Ryerse > President > 100 Ashford Center North, Suite 110, Atlanta, GA 30338 > 770.656.1460 - Cell > 770.399.9099 - Office > 770.392-0076 - Fax > > ℠ Eclipse Networks, Inc. > Conquering Complex Networks℠ > > -----Original Message----- > From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf > Of Ted Mittelstaedt > Sent: Friday, December 19, 2014 11:23 AM > To: [email protected] > Subject: Re: [arin-ppml] Internet Fairness > > First point here Steven is you have completely ignored and failed to respond > to > my first comment regarding why ARIN is the way it is - because it exists in a > capitalistic society - because you have no answer for that. > > I do not really believe for a second that you really want an honest debate on > this issue. What you are doing is sitting back and cherry picking weak > arguments to respond to, and ignoring strong ones. So I am not going to waste > much more time with you on this. > > But I will say that your comment: > > " If .com domain names were nearing runout, would that really make it OK to > start denying small Orgs .com domain name requests?" > > is one of the most ignorant I've seen on this list in quite a while. > > The DNS system exists to make IP addresses that are hard to remember, replaced > by domain names that are easy to remember. The average English speaking adult > knows about 50,000 English words. There's over 100 million .com domain names > registered at this point. We have far and away exceeded the number of English > .com one word domain names that an average person would know. > > Therefore we have long ago "run out" of .com domain names. Oh sure, you can > still register new .com domain names that are nonsense like > fdgcjghhgeafvrar.com or you can make up elaborate long sentences like > thisismynewdomainanemisntitkewel.com and register those names, but neither of > those meets the bar of being an easy to remember name. They are, in fact, > harder to remember than the IP addresses that they are supposed to make "easy > to remember" > > There > > On 12/18/2014 9:15 AM, Steven Ryerse wrote: >> Thanks for your comments! Actually the total number of possible .com >> permutations is limited too. IPv4 addresses and .com domain names are both >> just Internet resources that Internet users need to use the Internet. >> Obviously there are less IPv4 addresses than .com combinations, but IPv4 is >> still the only way to access most of the Internet. While ARIN has resources >> to >> allocate - I'm absolutely fine limiting the size of an allocation to match >> the >> size of an Org and their network, but I'm not fine with denying an Org any >> resources. >> >> Also IPv4 cannot somehow be saved by conservation. Regardless of any policy, >> ARIN will run out of IPv4 probably within the next year. If .com domain >> names >> were nearing runout, would that really make it OK to start denying small Orgs >> .com domain name requests? >> >> Steven Ryerse >> President >> 100 Ashford Center North, Suite 110, Atlanta, GA 30338 >> 770.656.1460 - Cell >> 770.399.9099- Office >> >> ℠ Eclipse Networks, Inc. >> Conquering Complex Networks℠ >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On >> Behalf >> Of Andrew Sullivan >> Sent: Thursday, December 18, 2014 11:59 AM >> To: [email protected] >> Subject: Re: [arin-ppml] Internet Fairness >> >> On Thu, Dec 18, 2014 at 04:35:41PM +0000, Steven Ryerse wrote: >>> >>> If it is not OK to deny the Minimum domain (available) name to an Org, then >>> it >>> isn’t OK to deny an Org the Minimum IP allocation. They are both Internet >>> resources. >>> >> >> The analogy seems faulty to me. The number space is finite (and in the case >> of >> v4, not very large). The name space in any given registry is admittedly not >> infinite, since (1) it's limited to labels 63 octets long from the LDH >> repertoire and (2) useful mnemonics are generally shorter than 63 octets and >> usually a wordlike thing in some natural language. There are, however, lots >> of >> registries (more all the time! >> Thanks, ICANN!); and last I checked neither info nor biz was anything close >> to >> the size (or utility) of com, even though they've both been around since 2001 >> and have rather similar registration rules. So, there is an argument in >> favour >> of tight rules for allocation of v4 numbers that is not available in the name >> case. >> >> Best regards, >> >> A >> >> -- >> Andrew Sullivan >> [email protected] >> _______________________________________________ >> PPML >> You are receiving this message because you are subscribed to the ARIN Public >> Policy Mailing List ([email protected]). >> Unsubscribe or manage your mailing list subscription at: >> http://lists.arin.net/mailman/listinfo/arin-ppml >> Please contact [email protected] if you experience any issues. >> _______________________________________________ >> PPML >> You are receiving this message because you are subscribed to >> the ARIN Public Policy Mailing List ([email protected]). >> Unsubscribe or manage your mailing list subscription at: >> http://lists.arin.net/mailman/listinfo/arin-ppml >> Please contact [email protected] if you experience any issues. > _______________________________________________ > PPML > You are receiving this message because you are subscribed to > the ARIN Public Policy Mailing List ([email protected]). > Unsubscribe or manage your mailing list subscription at: > http://lists.arin.net/mailman/listinfo/arin-ppml > Please contact [email protected] if you experience any issues. > _______________________________________________ > PPML > You are receiving this message because you are subscribed to > the ARIN Public Policy Mailing List ([email protected]). > Unsubscribe or manage your mailing list subscription at: > http://lists.arin.net/mailman/listinfo/arin-ppml > Please contact [email protected] if you experience any issues. _______________________________________________ PPML You are receiving this message because you are subscribed to the ARIN Public Policy Mailing List ([email protected]). Unsubscribe or manage your mailing list subscription at: http://lists.arin.net/mailman/listinfo/arin-ppml Please contact [email protected] if you experience any issues.
