Of course your position wouldn’t have anything to do with the profits you stand to make from an unrestricted transfer market.
Owen > On Sep 24, 2015, at 13:12 , Elvis Daniel Velea <[email protected]> wrote: > > Hi Owen, > > On 24/09/15 22:09, Owen DeLong wrote: >> Short answer: NO >> >> Longer answer: >> >> Finance alone does not reflect all community values. Eliminating needs-based >> evaluation for transfers >> will foster an environment open to speculation and other artifice used to >> maximize the monetization of >> address resources without providing the benefit to the community of >> maximizing utilization. > The environment open to speculation already exists, a needs-based criteria > will not stop the ones that want to speculate. Keeping needs-based criteria > in policy will only drive (keep some of the) transfers underground (ie: > futures contracts, all kind of financial artifices). I actually believe the > needs-based criteria removal will benefit the community by eliminating a > barrier in the correct registration of the transfers (resources) in the > registry (and whois). > > The allocation era has passed, ARIN should just be a shepherd and record the > transfers (and do the allocation exercise twice per year, when the IANA > allocates the few crumbs remaining). From my experience and observations, if > someone needs the IP addresses and has the money to pay for them I am sure > that they will not be stopped by ARIN's needs-base criteria... >> In fact, I believe that eliminating needs-basis will likely cause actual >> utilization to be reduced in the >> long run in favor of financial manipulation. > I dare to disagree. From where I am standing, the removal of needs-basis > criteria from the RIPE Region has increased utilization of the resources > transferred through the IPv4 marketplace. > Additionally, the removal of the needs-basis criteria has increased the > number of transfers, showing that the marketplace works and is useful to > hundreds (or even thousands) of companies from the region. > > I am not saying that the ARIN community should copy what the RIPE community > has done. I am just saying that if something is working and it's usability is > proven, it is rather strange to see some saying the opposite as an argument > against the removal of the needs-based criteria. >> >> Owen > cheers, > elvis >> >>> On Sep 24, 2015, at 11:55 , Leif Sawyer <[email protected]> wrote: >>> >>> Now that we've reached the magic ZERO in the free pool, what does the >>> community >>> think about this new draft policy? >>> >>> Should ARIN begin the process of streamlining the IPv4 policy so that it is >>> geared more toward the transfer market, and remove "need" as a criteria in >>> certain sections of the NRPM to increase the database accuracy? >>> >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On >>> Behalf Of ARIN >>> Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2015 12:54 PM >>> To: [email protected] >>> Subject: [arin-ppml] Draft Policy ARIN-2015-9: Eliminating needs-based >>> evaluation for Section 8.2, 8.3, and 8.4 transfers of IPv4 netblocks >>> >>> Draft Policy ARIN-2015-9 >>> Eliminating needs-based evaluation for Section 8.2, 8.3, and 8.4 transfers >>> of IPv4 netblocks >>> >>> On 17 September 2015 the ARIN Advisory Council (AC) accepted >>> "ARIN-prop-223 Eliminating needs-based evaluation for Section 8.2, 8.3, and >>> 8.4 transfers of IPv4 netblocks" as a Draft Policy. >>> >>> Draft Policy ARIN-2015-9 is below and can be found at: >>> https://www.arin.net/policy/proposals/2015_9.html >>> >>> You are encouraged to discuss the merits and your concerns of Draft Policy >>> 2015-9 on the Public Policy Mailing List. >>> >>> The AC will evaluate the discussion in order to assess the conformance of >>> this draft policy with ARIN's Principles of Internet Number Resource Policy >>> as stated in the PDP. Specifically, these principles are: >>> >>> * Enabling Fair and Impartial Number Resource Administration >>> * Technically Sound >>> * Supported by the Community >>> >>> The ARIN Policy Development Process (PDP) can be found at: >>> https://www.arin.net/policy/pdp.html >>> >>> Draft Policies and Proposals under discussion can be found at: >>> https://www.arin.net/policy/proposals/index.html >>> >>> Regards, >>> >>> Communications and Member Services >>> American Registry for Internet Numbers (ARIN) >>> >>> >>> ## * ## >>> >>> Draft Policy ARIN-2015-9 >>> Eliminating needs-based evaluation for Section 8.2, 8.3, and 8.4 transfers >>> of IPv4 netblocks >>> >>> Date: 23 September 2015 >>> >>> Problem statement: >>> >>> The current policies in NRPM sections 8.2, 8.3, and 8.4 regarding transfer >>> of IPv4 netblocks from one organization to another are currently a >>> hindrance in ensuring database accuracy. In practice, ARIN staff are >>> utilizing those polices to refuse to complete database updates which would >>> reflect an accurate transfer of control / utilization of netblocks in cases >>> where ARIN doesn't agree that the recipient organization has need, or more >>> often where the recipient organization bypasses the ARIN registry entirely >>> in order to secure the needed IPv4 netblocks in a more timely fashion >>> directly from the current holder. >>> Additionally, the 8.1 introduction section includes a perceived "threat" >>> of reclaim which serves as a hindrance to long-term resource holders >>> approaching ARIN with database updates when transferring resources. The >>> result is that the data visible in ARIN registry continues to become more >>> inaccurate over time. >>> >>> Policy statement: >>> >>> This proposal is for the following language changes in the respective NRPM >>> sections in order to eliminate all needs-based evaluation for the >>> respective transfer type, and allow transfers to be reflected in the >>> database as they occur following an agreement of transfer from the resource >>> provider to the recipient. >>> >>> Section 8.1 Principles: >>> >>> - Strike the 3rd paragraph which begins with "Number resources are issued, >>> based on justified need, to organizations. . ." since it mostly reiterates >>> other sections of ARIN policy. All transfers are subjected to those >>> policies, as called out in 8.2, 8.3, 8.4. Additionally, removing this >>> paragraph removes the perceived "threat" of reclaim which serves as a >>> hindrance to long-term resource holders approaching ARIN with database >>> updates, since in practice ARIN has not been forcibly reclaiming IP >>> resources assigned to "failed businesses." >>> >>> Section 8.2 Mergers and Acquisitions: >>> >>> - Change the 4th bullet from: >>> >>> "The resources to be transferred will be subject to ARIN policies." >>> >>> to: >>> >>> "The resources to be transferred will be subject to ARIN policies, >>> excluding any policies related to needs-based justification or inspection >>> of current or future utilization rate." >>> >>> - Remove entirely the last paragraph which reads "In the event that number >>> resources of the combined organizations are no longer justified under ARIN >>> policy at the time ARIN becomes aware of the transaction, through a >>> transfer request or otherwise, ARIN will work with the resource holder(s) >>> to return or transfer resources as needed to restore compliance via the >>> processes outlined in current ARIN policy." >>> >>> Section 8.3 Transfers between Specified Recipients within the ARIN Region: >>> >>> - Change the first bullet under "Conditions on recipient of the transfer" >>> from: >>> >>> "The recipient must demonstrate the need for up to a 24-month supply of IP >>> address resources under current ARIN policies and sign an RSA." >>> >>> to: >>> >>> "The recipient must sign an RSA." >>> >>> - Change the 2nd bullet under "Conditions on recipient of the transfer" >>> from: >>> >>> "The resources to be transferred will be subject to ARIN policies." >>> >>> to: >>> >>> "The resources to be transferred will be subject to ARIN policies, >>> excluding any policies related to needs-based justification or inspection >>> of current or future utilization rate." >>> >>> Section 8.4 Inter-RIR Transfers to Specified Recipients: >>> >>> - Change the introductory language from: >>> >>> "Inter-regional transfers may take place only via RIRs who agree to the >>> transfer and share reciprocal, compatible, needs-based policies." >>> >>> to: >>> >>> "Inter-regional transfers may take place only via RIRs who agree to the >>> transfer and share reciprocal, compatible, policies." >>> >>> - Change the 2nd bullet under "Conditions on recipient of the transfer" >>> from: >>> >>> "Recipients within the ARIN region will be subject to current ARIN policies >>> and sign an RSA for the resources being received." >>> >>> to: >>> >>> "Recipients within the ARIN region will be subject to current ARIN >>> policies, excluding any policies related to needs-based justification or >>> inspection of current or future utilization rate, and sign an RSA for the >>> resources being received." >>> >>> - Remove entirely the 3rd bullet under "Conditions on recipient of the >>> transfer" which reads "Recipients within the ARIN region must demonstrate >>> the need for up to a 24-month supply of IPv4 address space." >>> >>> Comments: >>> >>> a. Timetable for implementation: Immediate >>> >>> b. Anything else >>> >>> As the "free pool" for 4 of the 5 world's RIRs (APNIC, RIPE, LACNIC, and >>> ARIN) has now been exhausted, networks in need of additional IPv4 addresses >>> have shifted away from the practice of receiving them from the RIR's >>> resource pool. Instead, networks in need are seeking out current holders of >>> IPv4 resources who are willing to transfer them in order to fulfil that >>> need. Accordingly, the RIR's primary responsibility vis-à-vis IPv4 netblock >>> governance has shifted from "allocation" to "documentation." In other >>> words, the focus must move away from practicing conservation and fair >>> distribution (e.g. following guidelines set forth in RFC2050) to ensuring >>> an accurate registry database of which organization is utilizing a given >>> netblock as a result of transfers which occur between organizations. >>> >>> The RIPE registry can be used as a reference of one which has evolved over >>> the past couple years to shift their focus away from >>> conservation/allocation and towards database accuracy. IPv4 netblock >>> transfers within that RIR consist merely of validating authenticity of the >>> parties requesting a transfer. Provided the organizations meet the basic >>> requirement of RIR membership, and that the transferring organization has >>> the valid authority to request the transfer, the transaction completes >>> without any "needs-based" review. >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> PPML >>> You are receiving this message because you are subscribed to the ARIN >>> Public Policy Mailing List ([email protected]). >>> Unsubscribe or manage your mailing list subscription at: >>> http://lists.arin.net/mailman/listinfo/arin-ppml >>> Please contact [email protected] if you experience any issues. >>> _______________________________________________ >>> PPML >>> You are receiving this message because you are subscribed to >>> the ARIN Public Policy Mailing List ([email protected]). >>> Unsubscribe or manage your mailing list subscription at: >>> http://lists.arin.net/mailman/listinfo/arin-ppml >>> Please contact [email protected] if you experience any issues. >> _______________________________________________ >> PPML >> You are receiving this message because you are subscribed to >> the ARIN Public Policy Mailing List ([email protected]). >> Unsubscribe or manage your mailing list subscription at: >> http://lists.arin.net/mailman/listinfo/arin-ppml >> Please contact [email protected] if you experience any issues. > > _______________________________________________ > PPML > You are receiving this message because you are subscribed to > the ARIN Public Policy Mailing List ([email protected]). > Unsubscribe or manage your mailing list subscription at: > http://lists.arin.net/mailman/listinfo/arin-ppml > Please contact [email protected] if you experience any issues. _______________________________________________ PPML You are receiving this message because you are subscribed to the ARIN Public Policy Mailing List ([email protected]). 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