Very well-said Rajib.
Couldn't have said it better.
--Ram da
On 9/15/05, Rajib Das <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
As Mayur rightly points out, CM's position on this one
is devoid of logic. While he is highly racist about
"those other Indians", he sniggers at the use of
pejorative terms such as "mainstream" Assamese or
mainstream Indians. Even to a person with low
inferential capabilities, it will be obvious both
these things belong to the same boat.
From what we have observed so far, the US continues to
be divided very strongly along different groupings. It
isn't surprising there is no chance in heaven or hell
that a hispanic or a black or a woman will become the
president in the US any time soon. And sure enough,
the muslim woman in purdah will have more than enough
stares if she tries walking down some small town in
Texas. Or trying to win the mayoral seat in Waco,
Texas. So yes, power is indeed channelized along
groupings.
As always CM's deep hatred of India and things Indian
clouds his thought and vision to the point of becoming
ludicruous. I believe someone benchmarking Guwahati
against Bangalore in terms of sunrise industry jobs is
doing the right thing. Doing it with St. Louis would
be ludicrous. Similarly someone benchmarking Assam
Bandhs against those happening in Maharasthra would
make a lot of sense. Trying to compare with Louisiana
would be futile. Trying to find the cause of progress
amongst the South Indians and not in Assam could also
give rise to certain home truths that need to be
addressed. Benchmarking against some community in
Ireland could perhaps be a good academic exercise but
just about that and nothing else.
A large majority of Indians - Indian nationalists,
mainstream (whatever that may mean) or otherwise, are
not preoccupied with comparing against Pakistan or
Bangladesh. The comparison with China's relatively
better progress is a common theme. So is India's
ability to weather global competition better than
Europe. Even as they do these benchmarks (even
including the ones with Pakistan and Bangladesh), they
lead more productive lives, generate jobs and bring in
millions in investments. Obviously there are enough
smart people there - and may I venture to suggest that
there would be "smarter" people than many of us
posting out here with our assumed superiorites. So it
would indeed be a good idea benchmarking against the
very best in India. An Anjan Dutta could do a good
thing benchmarking against some of the initiatives of
Chandrababu Naidu. Entrepreneurs in Assam should
indeed look to what those in Gujarat are doing right.
Educators must find out why Mizoram has 100% literacy.
And yes, administrators must look to Bangladesh to see
why they have better numbers on social indicators than
in Assam (or India). As an aside, in jest and for time
pass, it would be a good idea to compare with
Missouri.
Trying to prove a point (about the equality of
mainstream and others) with an air of self-assigned
superiority resulting in the body of the argument
itself defeating its premise is NOT an idea of a good
benchmark to have while debating :-)
Regards
--- mayur bora <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Hi Mr Mahanta Da
>
> Thanks for intensifying the academic orientation of
> the debate. Whether you accept it or not, academic
> discussion sometimes gets stifled under the weight
> of
> its high sounding words. The first weakness
> indicated
> earlier is nothing but a testimony of my deeply
> ingrained belief that whatever is observed in the
> relationship between the Assamese speakers and other
> tribal groups is grossly unjust and unacceptable. So
> there can't be any question of any conscious effort
> to
> perpetuate the hegemony of the 'mainstream' over the
> 'sub streams'. The fact that it was indicated by
> someone belonging to the so called 'mainstream' as
> one
> of the weaknesses is proof enough that the person
> does
> now want any perpetuation, rather what he craves for
> is ruthless dismantling of that pernicious tendency.
>
> I failed to understand how Ram's analogy is not
> tenable as per you. In American social milieu also,
> everyone sees the ghost of the 'past' very
> frequently
> and they can't be brushed aside as sporadic or
> isolated occurrences. I think Ram's analogy is
> fairly
> valid.
>
> The very fact that you are attributing some traits
> to
> the people of Haryana goes a long way to show that
> you
> also probably suffer from the same syndrome which
> you
> are consciously trying to dilute or should I say
> demolish.
>
> I am startled by your argument that to see something
> good in others signify your insecurity vis a vis
> them.
> Going by that logic, a secure individual is one who
> always criticises others. That is perhaps the
> easiest
> job in this world. You show a beautiful flower or a
> bird to a pathological 'critic'. He will point out
> 100
> minus points in it. Misconception about NE is so
> well
> entrenched in people's minds that, to dispel it
> fully
> is a herculean task. I sincerely believe that given
> a
> chance, one should try to demolish those
> misconceptions. That of course does not mean that it
> should become be all and end all of life. As regards
> my insecurity, I am afraid I have a very strong
> view.
> I am aware of my shortcomings. I do try to rectify
> them sometimes. But never ever I let those
> weaknesses
> to give a feeling of inferiority complex vis a vis
> others.
>
> I was harping on one point from my first mail that
> everything is relative in this world. When
> everything
> is relative, you can't wish away benchmark to judge
> them. Benchmark will remain whether we like it or
> not.
> Otherwise many charms of the world will vanish.
>
> My view is that let us give some attention to the
> practical aspect of the debate so that loser's
> pursuit
> can be tranformed into a winner's destination. Don't
> you feel that LIGHTING A CANDLE IS HUNDRED TIMES
> BETTER THAN CURSING THE DARKNESS ?
>
> But thank you Mahanta da for your perspective on the
> issue. Would be looking forward to more of it.
>
> regards
>
> Mayur
>
> Malabika's comment and my endorsement are not
> fixations on semantics,
> but rejection of a deeply ingrained, but
> unacceptable
> cultural
> chauvinism that permeates thruout the south Asian
> subcontinent's many
> peoples. It also works in a pac-man-like, the bigger
> fish eating up
> the smaller fry manner.
>
>
> Ram's analogy to the American milieu is not only a
> stretch, but a
> completely inapplicable analogy. Why? Because in
> America political
> power is not distributed along ethnic or religious
> or
> cultural lines.
> True the racial minorities once were held under with
> overtly
> suppressive methods, but that is in the past.
>
> India's political powers continue to be divvied up
> along ethnic and
> religious lines, and rarely, if ever, along
> ideological or issue
> based ones. India has unable to break free of this
> mode, and will
> not in the foreseeable future.
>
> In that context, use of terms such as 'main-stream',
> 'tribal' etc.to
> categorize and label people , even without any
> intention of causing
> any harm, perpetuates and tacitly endorses a
> legitimacy of the
> hegemony of numerical majorities along ethnic,
> language and religious
> lines, which could not be more inimical to the
> realization of the
> much touted but far-from-reality 'secular,
> democratic
> and federal
> republic of India'.
>
> Terms like 'main-stream-India', automatically
> sidelines the peoples
> of NE India for example and makes them also-ran, not
> all that
> important components. And it is not a figment of
> insecure minds, but
> a well established and demonstrated fact. Just look
> at the Haryana
> folks' perception of the NE that you spoke of. And
> they, some of the
> most corrupt and violent people in the sub-continent
> should talk.
>
> Finally, I have another comment on your effort. You
> are attempting to
> evaluate the strengths and weaknesses of the people
> who call Assam
> home, using the populations of other parts of India
> as
> a benchmark.
> Obviously you feel insecure of your own ethnic
> identity in
> comparison, and thus want to pinpoint the areas that
> might need
> improvements, relatively speaking.
>
> First off, it is a lost cause, because you are using
> a
> benchmark that
> does not exist. It is as nebulous and fictional as
> one
> could be.In
> our architectural jargon we would call it a
> 'rubber-scale', one that
> could be bent and stretched to fill any need of the
> user. Why I say
> that is because if you try to quantify the qualities
> of those other
> peoples that you propose to judge those of Assam by
> you will immediately find that they would not stand
> to
> ordinary
> scrutiny even momentarily. If you don't believe me,
> give it a try and
> any number of netters will be able to show you why
> :-).
>
> Secondly, should anyone attempt to reach higher
> goals,
> it is imperative
> that
> they should aim for a sufficiently high aim. Low
> expectations,
> reaching for low standards, is one of the biggest
> impediments to
> growth and achievement. Your using the examples of
> 'those other
> Indians' is such a low-expectations-pursuit. Very
> much
> in line with
> all those Indian nationalists who go ga-ga over
> anything that seems
> better than Pakistan or B'desh. That I would submit,
> is nothing less
> than a loser's pursuit :-).
>
>
=== message truncated ===
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