opaqueice Wrote: > > However, if this is the case I think the predominant effect would be 60 > Hz noise, which sounds like a low hum if it's getting to the speakers. > Did you hear anything like that, which went away when you swapped in > the shielded cable? >
No, the audible differences have more to do with detail and spatial precision. It might also cause a slight volume gain (emphasis on "slight"), but I'm not sure on that one (it's hard to distinguish slight changes in volume from perceived increased detail). I have an SPL meter but I haven't tried to measure a difference (I'd guess it might be 0.5dB, if anything). I'm a picky audiophile and do lots of testing on my gear, but at a certain point if your ears say "better", it's time to move on! opaqueice Wrote: > > Anything else (besides shielding) seems a bit hard to buy... for > example, using 12 gauge wire is fine, but what's the gauge of the > wiring in your walls? I'd guess 14, but may be wrong. > I couldn't say for sure, but I would guess you're probably right. But the walls may be using solid core wire instead of stranded. I can't remember what that the effective difference is, but I remember something about smaller solid core wire outperforming thicker stranded wire **for certain characteristics** (though certainly not all, and underperforms in other areas). opaqueice Wrote: > > In any case, using thicker wire and conductive grease can reduce the > resistance of the connection and therefore lower the voltage, but by a > really tiny amount - for example, go here and compare gauges: > > http://www.powerstream.com/Wire_Size.htm > Thanks, I'll check it out. I've kind of accepted a bit of willing ignorance though when it comes to EE. When it comes to physics I always rocked the Mechanics but struggled with E&M. I'm a professional programmer but in general I only care about where the bits go, not how they got there! opaqueice Wrote: > > About your friend - the thing is, if I put myself in his place, and > you'd just swapped in some fancy cable and asked me if I heard a > difference, I'd be hard pressed to say no, I don't hear anything... so > it's tricky. > You're right of course, but I trust that he would have told me the truth. He'd already indicated that he wasn't a believer before the test so I doubt he'd feel much peer pressure to cave in once the audition started. And my sister/his girlfriend flat out refused to even listen. She went off and laid down on the couch off to the side while "the boys" wasted time on this ridiculous test. So the air was thick with skepticism and a desire to NOT hear a difference. opaqueice Wrote: > > On the other hand some differences are really apparent, like between > two sets of speakers. Would you say the difference is at that level? > Yes. My sister's boyfriend is not an audiophile so it wasn't a subtle, hard to define difference he was hearing. It's not quite the difference between the B&W 703 and its little brother the 702. Maybe halfway between. When I auditioned those two speakers the difference was a sense of liveliness, detail, precision. The 703s were just exciting to hear while the 702 sounded excellent but unengaging. It's too cumbersome to do A/B tests with swapping out ALL power cords at once (i.e. compare w/all six upgraded cords and then w/out). Remember, each power cord upgrade added an incremental improvement to my system (SACD player, DAC/analog passthrough, amp - along w/line conditioners). But it's possible that the total difference would be about as drastic as the 703 vs 702 audition. opaqueice Wrote: > > About bi-wiring, if both cables are connected to the same post on the > amp, then bi-wiring just doubles the number of wires going from amp to > speaker (so in other words it's just like using thicker speaker cable > wired the usual way). It shouldn't matter that the wires are connected > to different posts on the speakers, since they are in electrical contact > at the amp end. > One theory I heard had to do with the current induced by the large woofers not settling instantaneously. A woofer has too much momentum to just stop on a dime. So the undesired, unintended movement induces a current that gets fed back into the signal path. The thought was that biwiring keeps that inducted current out of the signal path of the high freq signal path. Of course you're right that they're still electrically connected at the amp. I can't explain why that would help to reduce the effects of this inducted current. It's possible that biwiring doesn't do anything, but it's the metal bridge plates that confound the sound (when single-wired you need the bridge plates to electrically link the two sets of binding posts). I also wonder how much the amp "pushes" its signal out vs how much the drivers "pull" the signal in. In other words, is it the exact same signal being sent across each set of wires or do the LF/HF filters (I think my speakers are a 2.5-way design) influence the signal? Would the current/voltage/fairy dust be higher on the LF wire for LF signals? Again, I'm a confessed E&M moron. So rather than try to understand the physics, I just trust my ears. Also we don't actually know all there is to know about E&M. I remember reading about a pitted superconductor material that defied all E&M expectations. No one could account for its near-superconductive properties at room temperatures. And I think there was some mystery as to why some thin ribbon wires (flat, wide wires) outperform other superconductors. There's also no explanation behind the perceived performance differences in cryogenically treated cables (people claim there's an audible diff, I have no experience either way). opaqueice Wrote: > > I suppose one thing that could happen is that, since there might be > some physical separation between the cables, there could be some extra > capacitance or inductance induced which wouldn't be there in a single > wire pair. Usually, that would be considered a bad thing (since it > will change the frequency response), but I guess it might sound better > in some circumstances. In any case if that's the explanation you could > probably test it by re-arranging the cables to see if that has any > effect on the sound. For example, if they're long enough, try coiling > them up - that should maximize the inductance. > My wires are too neatly tucked away right now to give it a try, but I'll be moving and therefore rewiring in a few months so I will try to remember to experiment. opaqueice Wrote: > > I'd tried bi-wiring once before and didn't hear any change, but I'll > try it again later this week when I have a chance. Lemme know how it turns out - and what source material you use. Kudos, by the way, for having a skeptical but open mind on these things. I'm right there with you. If I didn't have my own system demonstrating these differences, I'd be the biggest doubter on the planet. Actually I was so stunned by this power cord thing that I was joking with my roommate: "Dude, we should upgrade the power cord on the refrigerator. Our food will be so much colder!" -- banzai ------------------------------------------------------------------------ banzai's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=5008 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=22000 _______________________________________________ audiophiles mailing list [email protected] http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
