Was nothing to do with 9/11 but a change to aircraft registration rules in about 2006 - in order to validate the existing registrations all owners had I think 2 years to transfer their aircraft registration to the new system, and those who did not were no longer kept on the register. Many gliders and aeroplanes that were not being flown chose not to bother.
Wombat Sent from my iPad On 28/02/2013, at 4:55 PM, "Christopher McDonnell" <[email protected]> wrote: > CASA register search and pick glider option. Lots of oldies I know of though > who did not comply with 9/11 fallout panic and have fallen off the register. > > From: Ron Sanders > Sent: Thursday, February 28, 2013 3:50 PM > To: Discussion of issues relating to Soaring in Australia. > Subject: [Aus-soaring] glider register > > > can anyonwe tell me how to find the totl australian glider register? > > ron > On 27 February 2013 20:55, tom claffey <[email protected]> wrote: >> >> Aircon? - I want one! :) >> >> From: Mike Borgelt <[email protected]>; >> To: Discussion of issues relating to Soaring in Australia. >> <[email protected]>; >> Subject: Re: [Aus-soaring] LiFePo4 ~ Why not move to 24 volt systems? >> Sent: Thu, Feb 28, 2013 12:44:04 AM >> >> You usually move to higher voltage to transmit greater power at the same or >> lower current which reduces wiring weight. I suspect in light aircraft the >> power requirement for the electrics is driven by systems other than the >> avionics i.e electrically driven hydraulic pumps or simply electrically >> driven flaps, landing gear retract etc. >> There is consideration of going to 42 volts for cars for this reason. >> >> B50s work down to 10 volts, B300/B500/600/800 a little less. B400 and B700 >> down to 4 volts.(internal boost regulator cuts in). A 12 v nominal SLA >> battery is about to die at 11V terminal voltage when discharged at typical >> glider rates. If you are losing more than 0.2 volts or so between the >> battery and the instrument you need to fix the wiring, fuses switches etc. >> >> There doesn't seem to be any overwhelming reason to go to 24 volts in >> gliders. I'll bet most "24 or 28 volt" avionics has a switch mode regulator >> to get 14 volts before going to the rest of the gadget or simply to the 5 >> volts or so required by the logic circuits. >> >> If we go to electric flaps and aircon like the Duckhawk this may change. I >> think it has something like a 54 A-H battery. >> >> Mike >> >> >> At 08:13 AM 28/02/2013, you wrote: >>> Content-Type: multipart/alternative; >>> boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0056_01CE1593.E2557430" >>> Content-Language: en-us >>> >>> My contribution to the battery aspect of this thread is to question why we >>> are so infatuated by 12 volts? [I once wrote Standards, and Standards often >>> impede innovation] >>> >>> I also agree that the electrical systems must be designed and implemented >>> taking into consideration volts, amps, temperature high and low, wiring, >>> insulation, noxious gases, fusing, short circuit and thermal runaway, G >>> load, weight and many other factors >>> >>> At Oshkosh 2006 the Blue Mountains Avionics presentation said for light >>> aircraft the move to 24 volt systems was a no brainer, just so logical. >>> Most instrumentation and radio’s require 10 volts and a 12 volt system >>> decays to 10 volt reasonably fast. Microair’s need probably 10.5 before the >>> transmitter goes garbled, Cambridge falls over at about 8 volts. Mike >>> could perhaps comment on the minimums for Borgelt instruments. PDA’s and >>> XCSoar have a USB 5 volt input so may work longer on a 12 volt system? >>> Some avionics are designed for 35 volt DC maximum input [but XCOM and >>> Microair apparently have 16 ~ 17 volt maximum input specification] >>> >>> But starting with 24 volts gets much more out of the battery before >>> avionics fail. Even moving to say 16 volt to keep within radio >>> specification could lead to increased useful battery life. >>> >>> Cranking amps for starter motors is at the high drain end of the drain >>> spectrum but arguably is early in a batteries discharge cycle in the glider >>> application. >>> >>> So why not have 16 ~ 24 volt systems in gliders? >>> >>> Alan Wilson >>> [ARMIT Comm Eng] >>> Canberra >>> >>> From: [email protected] [ >>> mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of >>> [email protected] >>> Sent: Wednesday, 27 February, 2013 8:58 PM >>> To: Discussion of issues relating to Soaring in Australia. >>> Subject: Re: [Aus-soaring] LiFePo4 >>> >>> Nice one Arie. >>> You do bring a bit of costing perspective into the argument here. >>> >>> The YouTube footage is interesting (horrific?), but I suspect basically >>> irrelevant. >>> >>> I think that any glider pilot who knows anything about the problem, does >>> not want to experience an inflight cockpit fire UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES. I >>> know of one example, where the pilot was VERY happy to have survived the >>> experience - without having to bail out. He reported that fire - as in >>> burning - was NOT the problem. He reported that the amount of fumes and >>> smoke generated in an incredibly short time from the ignition of the >>> plastic wire covering due to shorting of the electrical system was in fact >>> the primary problem. For this unfortunate pilot, there were really two >>> problems: first he had to be able to breathe, and secondly he had to be >>> able to see what you are doing - basically impossible in a cockpit filled >>> with smoke! >>> >>> Re your statement "willing to replace a couple of batteries each year ...." >>> Probably a slip of the pen: As Bernard has pointed out a high quality SLA >>> gel cell type battery MAY last up to 9 or 10 years, but this is hardly >>> likely to be the norm. Five - seven years seems to be much more realistic >>> estimate. As far as I can tell, the life of the LiFePo4 batteries is not >>> claimed to be any better than this latter figure. >>> >>> At this point in time, LiFePo4 batteries are MUCH more expensive. However I >>> expect that in a few years time the price will have fallen, and many glider >>> pilots will be using these "new fangled" devices,. >>> >>> I suspect that I will need to replace my current glider batteries in the >>> near future. I do not have a max AUW of the non-loading bearing parts >>> problem - one valid argument for lighter batteries - and my power >>> consumption figures - high power consumption requirements are another valid >>> argument for using LoFePo4 - are relatively modest, so I have no intention >>> of using LifePo4 batteries for the replacement. >>> >>> What this whole discussion has crystallised for me is the requirement, >>> regardless of the type of battery selected, is to always use a high quality >>> battery manufactured by a reputable factory who stands behind their >>> product. [I have in the past tried "cheap" batteries, and regretted it.] >>> >>> Regards, >>> Gary >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: Arie van Spronssen >>> To: Discussion of issues relating to Soaring in Australia. >>> Sent: Wednesday, February 27, 2013 6:56 PM >>> Subject: Re: [Aus-soaring] LiFePo4 >>> >>> >>> Hi, >>> >>> When people start talking of glider batteries I laugh at their logic. We >>> have a toy that cost anywhere between 2 - 10k and upwards to keep in the >>> air each year (not including getting to and from the airfield and actually >>> getting it in the air) and they are not willing to replace a couple of >>> batteries each year for well under a $100. >>> >>> These fancy batteries may be ok but in the vast majority of gliders the >>> simple still works best and is cheap and safe. >>> >>> Yes I do play with these fancy batteries in my radio control toys but with >>> great care and they are always stored in a lipo safe bag. You only have to >>> watch this video to agree http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mw8jb1KmAG8 yes I >>> know the newer ones are better but these are only small and look at how >>> they go up and even the newer ones can still have problems. >>> >>> regards, >>> Arie >>> >>> On 27/02/2013 12:52 PM, Future Aviation wrote: >>> >>> Hello all >>> >>> >>> >>> It just occurred to me that I have omitted to thank John >>> Parncutt >>> >>> for his research and his willingness to share the findings with >>> us. >>> >>> >>> >>> Of course, in this context Mike Borgelt's professional advice >>> must >>> >>> also be mentioned. Both contributions are extremely useful to >>> many >>> >>> of my gliding friends including myself. Many thanks to both of >>> you! >>> >>> >>> >>> Believe it or not, the last set of SLA batteries powering the >>> engine >>> >>> circuit in my ASH 25 lasted for 10 years. At the time I opted >>> for the >>> >>> most expensive SLA batteries I could get my hands on and now it >>> appears >>> >>> that the old saying holds indeed true. You only get what you >>> ........ >>> >>> >>> >>> Kind regards to >>> all. >>> >>> >>> >>> Bernard Eckey >>> >>> >>> >>> -----Original >>> Message----- >>> >>> From: >>> >>> [email protected] >>> >>> [ >>> mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of >>> Mike >>> >>> Borgelt >>> >>> Sent: Wednesday, 27 February 2013 11:22 >>> AM >>> >>> To: Discussion of issues relating to Soaring in >>> Australia. >>> >>> Subject: Re: [Aus-soaring] >>> LiFePo4 >>> >>> >>> >>> As I said yesterday, do proper engineering on your battery >>> installation. >>> >>> If you don't have real numbers for temperature limits, discharge >>> curves at >>> >>> various rates, charging characteristics etc etc you aren't >>> doing >>> >>> engineering, you're just >>> guessing. >>> >>> A battery designed to start a racing motorbike and then be >>> recharged by the >>> >>> alternator and floated at that voltage likely has quite >>> different >>> >>> characteristics, design and longevity from one designed for >>> charging and >>> >>> deep discharging over several hours then recharging. You can >>> also just stop >>> >>> and get off the bike when the battery catches >>> fire. >>> >>> Li batteries all need individual cell monitoring during charge >>> and use or at >>> >>> least when charging after mostly >>> charged. >>> >>> The problem with Ni MH batteries is the number of cells (10 for >>> a nominal 12 >>> >>> V system). You will have at least one weaker cell which will >>> deep discharge >>> >>> more than the others and will be undercharged or more likely the >>> other cells >>> >>> will overcharge resulting in reduced battery life. Individual >>> cell >>> >>> monitoring would help but with 10 cells vs 4 for Li it is a >>> pain. >>> >>> 3 years isn't bad for a NiMH battery >>> pack. >>> >>> Some people have a problem with max weight of non lifting parts >>> and a few >>> >>> kilos saved may make the difference between flying in or >>> outside the >>> weight >>> >>> and balance envelope. For these LiFEPO4 may be worthwhile but >>> use the >>> >>> correct >>> cells. >>> >>> The cylindrical Tenergy cells sold by these people have >>> engineering data and >>> >>> are Underwriter Labs tested. The tests are published there too. >>> Start >>> >>> here: >>> http://www.all-battery.com/lifepo4battery.aspx >>> >>> I've dealt with them and they did what they said they >>> would. >>> >>> Also these people may be of interest: The batteries seem to be >>> the same as >>> >>> the Tenergy cells but with a different colour outer sleeve. >>> >>> They have battery monitoring/cutoff circuitry available also. >>> You must use a >>> >>> low voltage cutoff at >>> least. >>> >>> http://lithbattoz.com.au >>> >>> The old sealed lead acid batteries are OK. They are heavier >>> although in many >>> >>> installations that may not matter. The capacity is usually >>> quoted at the 20 >>> >>> hour rate. In modern gliders 1 amp continuous is not an unusual >>> load so >>> >>> that's the 7 hour rate. Likely it is a 5 A-H battery at this >>> rate. Give it a >>> >>> couple of dozen charge cycles and it is a 3 or 4 A-H battery and >>> you begin >>> >>> to have problems. Note also the number of cycles you get is non >>> linear with >>> >>> depth of discharge. Small % discharge you'll get lots of cycles. >>> Large % >>> >>> discharge many, many fewer >>> cycles. >>> >>> Size the battery to handle the longest flights and then use two >>> batteries. >>> >>> Use one routinely, keep the other charged then when the first >>> battery dies >>> >>> due to low capacity you have a known good battery. >>> >>> Put that one in the first position then put a new one in >>> the standby >>> >>> position. You should always have a good battery available >>> then. >>> >>> If using some new type either learn enough to do an engineering >>> analysis or >>> >>> find someone willing to do one for you. Otherwise these things >>> may get >>> >>> needlessly banned or we have fires in gliders. It would be >>> embarrassing to >>> >>> explain to your insurance compny why you had to bail out of your >>> burning >>> >>> glider. >>> >>> >>> >>> Mike >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> >>> Aus-soaring mailing >>> list >>> >>> >>> [email protected] >>> >>> To check or change subscription details, >>> visit: >>> >>> >>> http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> >>> Aus-soaring mailing >>> list >>> >>> >>> [email protected] >>> >>> To check or change subscription details, >>> visit: >>> >>> >>> http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Aus-soaring mailing list >>> [email protected] >>> To check or change subscription details, visit: >>> http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring >>> No virus found in this message. >>> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com >>> Version: 2012.0.2238 / Virus Database: 2641/5635 - Release Date: 02/26/13 >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Aus-soaring mailing list >>> [email protected] >>> To check or change subscription details, visit: >>> http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Aus-soaring mailing list >> [email protected] >> To check or change subscription details, visit: >> http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring > > _______________________________________________ > Aus-soaring mailing list > [email protected] > To check or change subscription details, visit: > http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring > _______________________________________________ > Aus-soaring mailing list > [email protected] > To check or change subscription details, visit: > http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
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