At 08:38 PM 27/04/2015, you wrote:

So you are saying that a outlanding is a risky occurrence?

People are outlanding all the time, except for a few occasions they seem to be walking away and still have a glider they can use.

Maybe we should ban outlandings? Suggested new rule may read: "You must remain in gliding distance of a suitable landing point, unless you have a working vario."



Anyone who doesn't think an outlanding in a glider is a greater risk than landing back at the known aerodrome they took off from should get some re-training. Or start thinking.

After all what could possibly go wrong?

You couldn't possibly get a loss of control while manoeuvering for the landing on an unfamiliar paddock could you? Or while trying to catch a thermal to get away from low altitude? Made more difficult in the case under discussion by not having a vario.
Or hit an impossible to see power line?
Or a tree?
Or a line of trees cause unexpected wind shear?
Or ground loop and break the tailboom because the wingtip caught in the grass which was longer than you thought? Or hit the hidden fence in the long grass? (two very experienced contest pilots took a dual high tow one day to do some performance comparisons. They had a fine old time until one said to the other "we're at 2500 feet. Where is the aerodrome?" Yes, two outlandings in the same paddock. Fairly rough, long grass, the second guy to land landed to one side of the other. When they got out and met they found they were different sides of a fence. Yes, failure to adequately brief and decide who was formation lead at what time, amongst others.)
Or damage the landing gear  by dropping into a rabbit hole?
Or cattle were in the paddock when the ground was wet leaving deep hoofprints now that the ground is rock hard?
Or there are hidden largish rocks in the grass?
Or the tailskid  causes a fire (it has happened)?
Or the hidden ditch?
Or the river bed that looked like a last ditch way to avoid a bad accident in a contest flown over unlandable terrain with only the occasional ranch airstrip turned out to be full of human head sized boulders?

I'm sure there have been other creative ways to break people and gliders in outlandings.

I've done 62 in real paddocks not counting aerodromes I didn't originally intend to land on. Only damage was a flat tyre when a lump of Mallee root hit the wheel rim, removing a segment which slashed the tube but not the tyre on the way out. Last day of a contest fortunately. Luck.

Yes, there are procedures. They are designed to minimise risk but they won't eliminate it in this case as there are things simply beyond your ability to sense. There is always an element of luck. Mindlessly following these procedures and expecting everything will be OK is hopelessly naive.

And no, gliding doesn't need more stupid rules. There are far too many already. Application of knowledge and commonsense would be good though.



Mike











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