Luckily while a very male-dominated industry, we're not lacking eminently qualified and talented women so I'm certain a gender balanced board is easily achievable.
On Wed, Oct 3, 2018 at 1:00 PM James Troy < [email protected]> wrote: > Benno, > > As I mentioned on the backlash – here it is… > > > > You see my response as not very positive or helpful – I think that is > quite sad really. > > > > “White dude” – well ½ of that is right… I am actually TSI. I would NEVER > want to be selected/hired/elected based on this. To the point its why I > never include it on any application forms, not because im ashamed of who am > I, but because I want to be selected on merit… > > > > The difference between my post and Mark’s post was he was offering help to > the victim, I am offering my thought/advice on a selection/election to a > board. I can see how you got these confused. > > > > I really hope there is full representation on any board, job, industry, > etc. I guess I wasn’t clear enough the first time – Do it on merit. If that > means on my next job interview I get pipped at the post by a more qualified > female/different ethnicity/religion person/pigeon then great. Its what I > want. Equality – real equality; not the quota kind. > > > > James Troy > > Senior Systems Administration > > > > > > *From:* AusNOG <[email protected]> *On Behalf Of *Benno Rice > *Sent:* Wednesday, 3 October 2018 1:21 PM > *To:* [email protected] > *Subject:* Re: [AusNOG] Sexual harassment in our industry. > > > > So I, too, am a lurker on this list. Hell, I don’t even run any networks > besides my home one, haven’t done for ages. > > > > That said I, too, have been watching this with interest and I’ve seen two > responses, well one response, and one class of responses, that I find > interesting. > > > > On the one hand, you’ve got stuff like James here. James is running the > exact same set of arguments that you normally get from, generally, white > dudes that feel threatened by any attempt to address the systemic problems > we have in society in general and tech in particular. Yes, yes I know they > don’t believe that those problems are there but, well, whatever. I saw > similar from Noel Butler and from Matthew Young up-thread. All of these > tend to come across as a knee-jerk reaction against the notion that we > might actually do something. > > > > On the other hand we had Mark Newton’s “What I can do to help.” post. > Instead of a knee-jerk reaction against doing something, he put forward a > completely reasonable set of steps that he promised to do if someone were > to come forward. Hell, his set of steps form a pretty good basis for the > enforcement process of a Code of Conduct. > > > > One of these messages was positive and valuable. The others were very much > not. > > > > Cheers, > > Benno. > > > > On 3 Oct 2018, at 12:57, James Troy <[email protected]> > wrote: > > > > Ive long been a member of Ausnog mailing list, I find the information that > is often posted here to be quite valuable; I have also been watching this > thread with a particular keen interest. > > > > Particularly as I was waiting to see how long the #MeToo and ‘gender > diversity’ was going to get pushed. > > > > Firstly let me say, any assault, sexual or otherwise is not acceptable. > Yes IT as an industry is over-represented by males; however to second you > start to include someone in something like a board selection based solely > on their genitalia is the second you loose any credibility. I wholy > subscribe to the idea of the ‘best person for the job’ > > > > If that means 25% of one gender and 75% of another then fine, they are all > selected on their merits. > > > > Anything short of selection based on merits (ie: Gender) opens an entirely > different can. Ie: is there someone of > Asian/African/Australia/aboriginal/TSI background? No? wow wouldn’t that be > racist? > > > > Suddenly people talk gender and its acceptable. > > > > I believe that IT, Along with many industries still has a long way to go > to be fully inclusive of all participants, regardless of > race/religion/gender/background – but selection based on gender, > percentages, inclusion policies is _*not*_ the way to get the recognition > that some hard-working people deserve. If I worked in a female dominated > industry (teaching, midwifery, childcare, etc) I would want to be selected > for something like this based on my work ethics, input, and recognition – > not simply to be the token male. > > > > We as an industry – and as humans – should be there to support our > colleagues when they get targeted and victimised, however I also agree that > if an accusation is made, and reported to the ‘other company’ then it > should also be accompanied with proof – too often we are seeing the #MeToo > being used as a weapon to destroy people – predominately men – without a > shread of proof. > > > > I do however agree that an ausnog post is not the correct forum for that > proof and that is best handled between the direct parties – it was > suggested at the CEO level – this protects the victim, the **Alleged** (I > use this term deliberately as until it is proof we have due process – > innocent until PROVEN guilty – same as the media reporting on items that > are before the courts.) aggressor until a chain of evidence can be > established and only then actioned upon. > > > > Im sure I will cop back-lash on this, virtue signalling and all… > > > > James Troy > > Senior Systems Administration > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > *From:* AusNOG <[email protected]> *On Behalf Of *dusty > *Sent:* Wednesday, 3 October 2018 12:33 PM > *To:* Matthew Young <[email protected]> > *Cc:* [email protected] List <[email protected]> > *Subject:* Re: [AusNOG] Sexual harassment in our industry. > > > > > > > > On Wed, 3 Oct 2018 at 14:59, Matthew Young <[email protected]> wrote: > > “While we're at it though, there needs to be female representation on the > Ausnog board.” > > People should be appointed based on their merits, not based on their > gender. > > > > Show me a man with a bias-free recruitment/selection process, and I’ll > show you a deluded patriarchal fool. > > > > > > > > *From:* AusNOG [mailto:[email protected]] *On Behalf Of *Paul > Wilkins > *Sent:* Tuesday, 2 October 2018 5:50 PM > *To:* [email protected] List <[email protected]> > *Subject:* Re: [AusNOG] Sexual harassment in our industry. > > > > "Seems you've never been to a meeting." > > > > The verity of this statement cannot be overexaggerated. > > > > Kind regards > > > Paul Wilkins > > > > > > On Tue, 2 Oct 2018 at 17:42, Mark Smith <[email protected]> wrote: > > On Tue, 2 Oct 2018 at 16:50, Paul Wilkins <[email protected]> > wrote: > > > > The need for a Code of Conduct has been raised and it's a good point. > > > > While we're at it though, there needs to be female representation on the > Ausnog board. I see where there's 5 directors been appointed, and they're > all men. I'm wondering who is doing the appointing. > > > > Seems you've never been to a meeting. That's covered in the closing > session. > > > > > That they couldn't find a woman up to the required standard gives rise > to an unfortunate impression of the board acting as a boy's club. > > > > Kind regards > > > > Paul Wilkins > > > > > > On Tue, 2 Oct 2018 at 16:10, David Hughes <[email protected]> wrote: > >> > >> > >> We thank Bevan for raising this important issue and bringing it to our > attention. > >> > >> This is a complex situation and we take any allegation of this nature > very seriously. We hope to discuss this further with those concerned in an > attempt to establish specifics, while maintaining the confidentiality of > all parties. If there are any actionable details we will offer assistance > to the party involved if they wish to escalate the matter further. > >> > >> Even though issues regarding the behaviour of delegates at our events > have never been raised with us, we want our attendees to feel safe and > supported. We have commenced a review of policies and processes from other > organisations and will work with our solicitors to draft a policy suitable > for AusNOG events and mailing lists. > >> > >> The organisers of AusNOG believe that behaviour of this nature is not > acceptable at any conference, function, or workplace in our industry. We > will attempt to engage the leaders of our industry to push for a broader > solution. > >> > >> > >> > >> David - on behalf of the AusNOG Board > >> ... > >> _______________________________________________ > >> AusNOG mailing list > >> [email protected] > >> http://lists.ausnog.net/mailman/listinfo/ausnog > > > > _______________________________________________ > > AusNOG mailing list > > [email protected] > > http://lists.ausnog.net/mailman/listinfo/ausnog > > _______________________________________________ > AusNOG mailing list > [email protected] > http://lists.ausnog.net/mailman/listinfo/ausnog > > _______________________________________________ > AusNOG mailing list > [email protected] > http://lists.ausnog.net/mailman/listinfo/ausnog > > > _______________________________________________ > AusNOG mailing list > [email protected] > http://lists.ausnog.net/mailman/listinfo/ausnog >
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