James Cridland wrote:
This is a splendidly informed debate, incidentally. I'm enjoying it.

On 1/31/07, *Stephen Miller* < [EMAIL PROTECTED] <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>> wrote:

    Media groups tend to equate a download
    with a (potential) lost sale. This is just not the case. Many
    people who
    download, especially cross borders may discover television from other
    countries to which they had no access.


Example: The Daily Show was sold to More4 as an exclusive purchase for within the territory of the UK. The production company is selling something that commands a good price because it is selling the rights to exclusively show this programme in the UK.

If the majority of people were watching it via BitTorrent et al, then the value of the show to the More4 is much less. This is the problem. Not a missed sale; but a very badly harmed value of a product.

That may well be the case, but why should it be so? Surely the whole point of this debate (at least from my point of view) is that this kind of thinking is in the past. As stated on other threads on the list, this kind of thing happened with DVD sales, many people now have region free capability to get round the regions as they are inconvenient.

What needs to be developed is new distribution systems, not excuses for old methods, nor seeing any form of global market as a problem. If content is available at a fair price globally and simultaneously, the advertising markets and audiences should greatly expand.

I disagree also with your assertion that bittorrent devalues the market place for the distributor. Possibly the end broadcaster may suffer depending on how new distribution methods are arranged. However, if the distributors were to stop fighting bittorrent et al, instead embracing it, I believe a lot of their problems would disappear overnight.

By a combination of launching their own service for free torrent downloads, coupled with (non distracting) product placement and traditional advertising to fund the shows, this factor can be negated. Don't forget that torrent sites rely on viral marketing to even begin their swarms. In contrast, a major media company need only advertise in the mainstream press and television as a legal alternative for their online distribution to quickly take off. Further to this, and most importantly, by including advertising and a free (non-DRM) source of the show officially, you negate the 'need' for people to obtain unauthorised copies. Sites such as thepiratebay would not gain any advantage for offering a freely available show through their site. If this were to happen, there would be little to worry about either. With an advertising based funding system and unencrypted shows, any secondary sharing just increases the exposure to the adverts. In turn, advertising companies could pay a small amount per unique download, as opposed to just buying space on a show. This figure could come mainly from the official distributor source, but any large secondary tracker could also be factored in.

I admit the main problem with this is a reedited torrent or other download with the adverts stripped out. However, this still cannot strip product placement, and with a freely available source should be limited to an extremely low number of people.

    Many other people who download are of course unable to afford the vast
    majority of what they download. They may be getting
    something for free, but still are not lost sales.


"I nicked it because I can't afford it" is an interesting claim when talking about downloading via computer and broadband connection (two luxury products), and it still doesn't recompense The Daily Show for lost value for its product, or More4 for lost advertising revenue. Remember, More4 and their advertisers are paying for the programme, so you don't have to.

This is also an interesting claim, as I would counter that broadband and computers are now so ubiquitous so as to not neccesarily be a luxury item. It is of course possible to build or obtain a computer sufficient for internet access and basic word processing applications etc. for less than £200. Whilst this is a large single outlay for poorer incomes, I would argue it is not above their means, and certainly is becoming increasingly necessary even to search for jobs. Your computer can then be used for other means. It is not solely a way to collect media. Contrary to this, buying DVDs at £20 a pop, you would only be able to afford 10 or so on the same budget.

This doesn't excuse the 'nicking' of the material as you put it, but does I hope highlight my point, which was that it is not a lost sale, the potential sale never existed. I focus mainly on visual arts, TV and movies, as due to product placement and adverts, these offer the most viable free distribution options with current methods of funding. I think the internet should be looked upon as a place to expand the free to air television market, with funding provided solely through site and media advertising. I do not view this as wishful thinking, and do not think that bittorrent downloading precludes this.



    Sadly, it is rare that media institutions are forward looking, nor
    wish
    to reconsider their current policies to take into account recent
    technological developments. What makes this worse is that a large
    number
    of people within their companies are likely to be 'illegal'
    downloaders,
    and there will be some that also know distribution protocols such as
    bittorrent, and the necessary economics to distribute in this way. I
    doubt however, any such people would find it advantageous to
    reveal this
    to their employer, unless they already held a large amount of
    influence
    in the company.


Well, all media institutions have people that research new technology within them. I'm paid to do that. I have used BitTorrent, Kazaa and Napster (all of which are/were possible to use legally, incidentally); I have hacked subscription television; and have done a variety of other entertaining things on and offline. I expect (and hope) the rest of my team have done so as well. Blimey - imagine what you'd be saying if we didn't bother to research?

[I ought to point out that I haven't, though, shared any substantive amount of other peoples' material; because I don't own it.]


Finally: you claim media institutions aren't forward looking. If you've not realised, you're arguing with someone who works for a commercial radio station, on a mailing list run by the BBC for developers to mash-up their content. Excellent. ;)

I do realise who you work for, but don't think that is hugely relevant to the debate. As mentioned in my last email, I'm not saying that people like you do not exist in commercial companies, merely that research is seen more as an interesting aside and future possibilities, as opposed to something that can be realised within the next year or so. Media companies are, somewhat understandably cautious, but this will do them no favours. The cat is already out the bag, Napster saw the end of music distribution as we knew it. Bittorrent is causing television to go the same way. It is possible for the media companies to take advantage of this, however, I cannot see it happening fast enough at current.

--
http://james.cridland.net/

I realise I may be in the minority with my views, however I do believe quite strongly that it is possible to sustain a rich media environment with online distribution funded solely by advertising revenues, and any difficulties are likely to be minor. Unauthorised distribution need not be a bane on the industry, but a tool to further the reach of the programmes.

                
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