Sorry guys, I thought I was deploying debating skills... I really hope no-one took offense.
On 15/08/07, Matthew Cashmore <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Enough on this now please chaps – let's keep this nice. > > m > > > On 15/8/07 11:32, "Brian Butterworth" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > On 15/08/07, *Simon Cobb* <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > "That's a total cop-out, either you can explain why no usability testing > is required or not. " > > if I'd taken up either position, I would explain it, I'm not going to do > it just because you ask. > > > > Great. I take it you withdraw your earlier position about Jakob Nielsen? > > > "Personally I don't drink so I can't see why I would never discover the > great truth that has been revealed to your good self." > > I don't have any truths. Except the truth that I can't spend time > discussing on this list something that's off-topic and that would be quicker > done face-to-face. That's all the pint reference was about. Not some > Blake-style path to enlightenment by excess. > > > It's hardly off-topic. Check out the backstage.bbc.co.uk > <http://backstage.bbc.co.uk> <http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/> stated > purpose. > > > > Over and out. I'm done here. > > > > Yeah, it shows. > > > > > > > > ------------------------------ > *From:* [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto: > [EMAIL PROTECTED] *On Behalf Of *Brian Butterworth > *Sent:* 15 August 2007 10:10 > > *To:* backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk > *Subject: *Re: [backstage] more data visualisation links > > > On 15/08/07, *Simon Cobb* <[EMAIL PROTECTED] > <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > wrote: > > Kim said: "Useful or Playful? Is the question to ask." > > I'd argue that useful and playful can be part of the same thing. Certainly > nothing ever stuck with me that I didn't enjoy using/ thinking about. > Likewise many of the children I used to teach. The trick is to combine the > 2. I think there's ways from that set of visualisations to encourage people > to make playful and useful interfaces to bbc data/ apps if the API's were > available. > > > > As I was trying to say, a system that allows the end-user to construct > live visualizations of data is a commendable idea, but (almost) by > definition this will be impossible for others to use. For example, many > people will use red to indicate an error state and green to indicate a OK > condition. But you can't use that for everyone as 10% of men are red-green > colourblind. > > If you do some research you will also find out that some people are > visually-orientated and respond well to these kinds of representations. But > others prefer speech over visual explanations and this kind of thing will > exclude those people. > > > Brian said: "I presume you have some substantive evidence that no testing > is require then?" > > That's not what I said, it's just that I'm not personally convinced that > his views are as up-to-date as they should be and so cannot perpetuate his > status as an untouchable usability expert. But that's best discussed over a > pint at some unspecified future backstage event rather than this list. > > > That's a total cop-out, either you can explain why no usability testing is > required or not. Personally I don't drink so I can't see why I would never > discover the great truth that has been revealed to your good self. Simply > being rude about someone is a failure to explain - just an insult rather > than a debunking. > > > ------------------------------ > *From:* [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto: > [EMAIL PROTECTED] *On Behalf Of *Brian Butterworth > *Sent:* 14 August 2007 18:12 > *To:* backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk > *Subject:* Re: [backstage] more data visualisation links > > > I guess this brings us right back to Richard MacDuff's "Anthem" programme > which attempted much the same but with music in the first Dirk Gently book > (coming soon to Radio 4)... > > On 14/08/07, *Kim Plowright* <[EMAIL PROTECTED] > <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > wrote: > > I think the point here is 'does the visualisation of the data adds > meaning, or is just pretty to look at?'. > > Does your visualisation tell people more about the data set than the > raw numbers? Is it 'legible'? Does it expose trends and meaning that > would otherwise be hidden to all but the most numerate? Does it let > someone reach sound conclusions faster, or navigate quicker, or become > more accurate? > > Which is Tufte territory, not Nielsen. > http://www.edwardtufte.com/tufte/ > > Not that there's anything wrong with pretty, but good datavis is about > adding layers of meaning, as well as the layers of aesthetics. > > Its possible to remove the 'data' during the visualisation process and > turn it in to a purely aesthetic entertainment experience, too. Some > of the Jonathan Harris stuff does this - it's information as > spectacle. Fun to look at, not 'wrong' per se, but a terrible way of > actually turning data -> information -> knowledge. > > Useful or Playful? Is the question to ask. > > > Some of these seem to be of dubious real use. Has anyone put any of > them > > though Jakob Nielsen-style user testing? > - > Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk > <http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/><http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/> discussion group. > To unsubscribe, please visit > http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html > <http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html><http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html>. > Unofficial list archive: > http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/ > > > > > > _______________________ > *Matthew Cashmore > *Development Producer > * > **BBC Future Media & Technology, Research and Innovation > *BC5C3, Broadcast Centre, Media Village, W12 7TP > > *T:* 020 8008 3959 (02 83959) > *M:* 07711 913241 (072 83959) > -- Please email me back if you need any more help. Brian Butterworth www.ukfree.tv
