Hi there, On Tue, 5 Jan 2021, backu...@kosowsky.org wrote:
Robert E. Wooden wrote at about 10:02:58 -0600 on Monday, January 4, 2021:
> On 1/4/2021 9:55 AM, Les Mikesell wrote: > > On Mon, Jan 4, 2021 at 9:32 AM G.W. Haywood via BackupPC-users wrote: > >> I've tried using a 4B and gave up with it - unreliable. ... > > Maybe you just have a bad one or it is overheating in its case ...
Nope. We have several. They all do it. It isn't an overheating problem. Some of them aren't even in cases - they're mounted on flat panels (which are in turn mounted vertically for maximum convection cooling) and the rooms in which they run are very cool. Nagios says the temperatures are fine at the crash but they do throttle themselves at high temperatures anyway. There's also a chip register which can be inspected to see if CPU temperature limits have been exceeded.
> > ... I've left a 4B powered up for months without crashing.
My wife uses one for desktop stuff and it's more or less fine for that use. It can be left running idle for many weeks; the best uptime ever according to Nagios was about 110 days. It crashed (around lunchtime) on New Year's Day after 68 days when (we think) she was thrashing a database. But if for example she connects a powered USB device like a second HDD it's almost bound to crash immediately. So after a few bad experiences there are things we just don't do now, and that's how we can manage to get more than a couple of days uptime.
> > Mine doesn't have a load like backuppc ...
I'm pretty sure that load is one of the issues. Running as a database server here, the disc is thrashing constantly, 24/365. The backup server is obviously only a heavy load during backups, and then only some backups.
Robert E. Wooden wrote at about 10:02:58 -0600 on Monday, January 4, 2021: > I'm going to add here that I have seen a few posts (elsewhere) that some > 4B w/8Gb RAM had crash issues and a 4B 4Gb running the same program runs > ... Wondering what model 4B the OP is using? (2Gb, 4Gb, or 8Gb?)
They're all 4GB. They were purchased well before the 8GB was released.
Well I was considering buying a 4B 8GB mounted in my router "cabinet"
Keep an eye on the cooling.
to do the following 3 things: 1. Backuppc server (secondary ...
If it's a secondary I'd be a little anxious for you but just about OK with that. I wouldn't now consider a 4B for any backup of my own, as it would be too easy to let things slide and create your own accident.
2. Using NUT, monitor the UPS powering the switches/routers/VOIP devices in my router cabinet
As I said I run Nagios/Icinga on 4Bs, I also run Smokeping which does quite a bit of network activity too. But if it crashes, no big deal.
3. Potentially also serve as an occasional mythtv frontend for a basement TV used during exercise
Well my preferred forms of exercise precludes anything like that, but I'm sure it would be OK. We watch all our movies on a Pi 2! On the whole pretty reliable although we only run it in the evenings, but it doesn't like mplayer. Omxplayer seems not to be in development any more (this is hearsay from her indoors:) but that's what we use.
Would be good to understand if the issues with crashing 4B are due to: 1. One-off faulty device
Absolutely not. We've tried really hard to get the things going with multiple different discs, USB/SATA interfaces, power supplies, cables and the 4B devices themselves. The only common theme is the 4B. The same discs, interfaces, PSUs and cables are fine on (again, several) Pi3B+ devices. The 4Bs don't run reliably with just a Webcam.
2. General hardware design issue
Yes. It could be more than one thing. Could be that there's more wrong with the USB design than the already well-documented problems. Could be that the power stability is an issue - being an erstwhile electronics designer I've never liked the idea of hanging the PSU on the end of two metres of skinny flex for example, but I've never gone into that and tried running with a shorter cable. If I wanted to do it myself I'd probably do it all myself, but I don't have the time.
3. General OS/software issue
We can't rule out supplier- or hardware- specific drivers.
4. "Overload" of some type
Don't think so, but the opportunity for power line noise bothers me, I've seen both CPUs and RAM devices fall over for that reason.
5. Weird other interaction among HW/OS/apps etc
Assuming the interaction isn't because of something specific to the Pi (my comment under your 3 above) I don't think so. I've had problems with very different setups - file servers, database servers, backup servers, performance monitoring, security cameras (both USB and IP) and desktop. All were the same basic OS, but different application software. All continuous, if not necessarily all heavy, system usage. The uptime on the 3B+ that I'm using to type this message is 285 days: piplus:~$ >>> uptime 14:50:08 up 285 days, 1 min, 2 users, load average: 0.12, 0.11, 0.06 The Alix device for my main firewall (which is behind another firewall, and although it's sort of Linux it's much stripped-down for a firewall): fw44g: # uptime 13:45:57 up 323 days, 23:43, load average: 0.03, 0.02, 0.04 I've never got anywhere even close to that on a 4B. On Alix boards I've had getting on for 1000 days uptime. Never seen one crash. -- 73, Ged. _______________________________________________ BackupPC-users mailing list BackupPC-users@lists.sourceforge.net List: https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/backuppc-users Wiki: https://github.com/backuppc/backuppc/wiki Project: https://backuppc.github.io/backuppc/
