On 7/9/06, Khazeh <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
Dear Gilberto
I have always read your e-mails with interest and respect.
Thanks, I appreciate that.
Any way for the love of God (Allah) this lowly one will present the exact
text of your Letter, and offer something.
Please be forbearing with my offering.
Ok,
[...]
In other words, Bahais are saying Muhammad, as a
Manifestation is so
intimately related to Allah that saying "the imams are
like Muhammad"
is shirk. While from a Muslim perspective, saying
Muhammad is that close to
Allah can sound like shirk.
Your worry is that *** from a Muslim perspective, saying Muhammad is that
close to Allah can sound like shirk.***
Yes,
Firstly in this perspective of yours the transcendence [Tanzeeh/Taqdees] of
Allah God are emphasized. In other words from the perspective of many
Islamic Theologians especially of the Sunni following it is *transcendence*
that is emphasized.
There is a really interesting book called the Tao of Islam which
discusses a number of different subjects. A chunk of the book
discusses gender in Islam, both from a social perspective (gender
roles, marriage laws, mutaa, etc.) and also from a mystical
perspective (masculine and feminie aspects of the divine). The book
also looks at Islam through "Asian" eyes and sees many different
paired concepts which sort of correspond to Taoist ideas of yin-yang.
Heaven and Earth, the Pen and the Tablet, the Right and the Left hands
of Allah, khalifullah and abdullah, etc.
Another pair which is mentioned is also tanzih and tasbih in terms of
describing God. It advocates not just going all the way in one
direction or the other. Everything is in some kind of balance. The
legalists might emphasize tanzih a little more. The Sufis might
emphasize tasbih a little more. etc.
God is so transcendent that He is beyond all attributes.
He does not ascend, descend, egress, and regress. No > one even the Prophet
Muh.ammad is like Him. ((By the way the extreme of Tanzíh is ta'teel
[totally divesting God of all attributes except His Name Allah] )).
I'm not an extremist. It is possible to go too far an either
direction. I'm intrigued by the things I've read about Al-Hallaj and
Bistami and would be inclined to defend their utterances within an
orthodox context.
Then there is the other Pole that of *Tashbeeh* [Attributes and
anthropomorphisms] such as the Yadullah [the Qur'anic hand of God] Wajh
ullah [Countenance of God] *Ghazab Allah [the anger of God] etc.
NOW I believe the Bahái Teaching is quite reasonable and rational in this
regard. We believe the Essence of God is beyond comprehension, beyond words,
beyond depiction, and attributes…[Dhaat Allah}
Yes, the book Tao of Islam also mentions the dhat of Allah and points
out that grammatically it is feminine in gender.
But I'm digressing.
Yes, ultimately God beggars language.
but that God does have a Will
A Volition a Mashiyyat and that Mashiyyat/Will/Logos is expressed through
the Manifestations [the Maz.aahir] Who thereby reveal/manifest [yuz.hiruun]
God's Will.
No one in the Islamic Dispensation had the authority to disclose the Divine
Will [Mashiyyat] but His holiness Muh.ammad …until the year 1260 AH [=1844
CE] when the exalted Bab became the focal Point of that Will. The Primal
Will manifested His Purpose through Him.
Now we have your second worry re the Imams and what Iskandar referred to.
Extreme Shi'ism ascribed to the Imams a Purpose and authority beyond that
which was derivative from the Prophet Muh.ammad having verbally appointed
the First Imam 'Ali ibn Abi Taalib [Peace be upon Him].
The authority of the Imams was derivative. And this is what Baha'u'llah,
exalted be is His Utterance, was emphasizing in the Ishraqat and the
Gleanings
Isn't the Manifestation's authority also derrivative? God orders us to
obey the prophets.
I mean, it might be beneficial to go back to the original question of
prophetic sinlessness... I don't want to easily throw around the word
"sin" with regard to prophets, but aren't there cases in the Quran
where they didn't necessarily make the most superlatively ideal
decisions? They are guides, but they in turn are recipients of
guidance. We don't obey them for their own sake, but because God
orders us to.
[please ponder quote below.
Not only that but the Us.uliyyah 'Ulama [the divines adhering to the Us'uli
school of Shi'ih Twelver Islam] believed that a particular 'aalim of the day
should be followed should be THE marja'e taqleed. And all their books were
replete and are replete with these deductions re marja' e taqleed.
Actually, I think that approach makes a lot of sense. But it is
confusing to bring the prophet into it.Wahabis and other anti-taqlid
types often make that sort of accusation. They are a little extreme
and go too far but it makes sense. Obeying someone in the way one
should obey God actually is a kind of shrik. If that's what you are
saying, then that clears the issue up somewhat.
Peace
G
The information contained in this e-mail and any attachments thereto ("e-mail") is sent
by the Johnson County Community College ("JCCC") and is intended to be confidential and
for the use of only the individual or entity named above. The information may be protected by
federal and state privacy and disclosures acts or other legal rules. If the reader of this message
is not the intended recipient, you are notified that retention, dissemination, distribution or
copying of this e-mail is strictly prohibited. If you have received this e-mail in error please
immediately notify JCCC by email reply and immediately and permanently delete this e-mail message
and any attachments thereto. Thank you.
__________________________________________________
You are subscribed to Baha'i Studies as: mailto:[email protected]
Unsubscribe: send a blank email to mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subscribe: send subscribe bahai-st in the message body to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subscribe: http://list.jccc.edu:8080/read/all_forums/subscribe?name=bahai-st
Baha'i Studies is available through the following:
Mail - mailto:[email protected]
Web - http://list.jccc.edu:8080/read/?forum=bahai-st
News - news://list.jccc.edu/bahai-st
Public - http://www.escribe.com/religion/bahaist
Old Public - http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]
New Public - http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]
