It might be good to talk about use cases (what different locations) and features (ability to support different locations for different things: system, addons, user).
It seems the use cases can be fit into cross-platform equivalencies: - immutable, admin-level locations: Program Files; Applications and .app; /usr/lib - extensible: C:\Documents and Settings\All Users\Application Data; /Library/... /etc/... - user-specific in home (inside or outside of Documents): C:\Documents and Settings\user\My Documents /Users/user/Documents /home/user/... One question is whether addons are separate or part of system or user space. Feature-wise, - ability to recognize different non-adjacent locations for system, addons, user; - how are these locations are configured (manually, in configuration dialog) and where this configuration is stored (profile.ijs, etc.) - should installer offer different locations - possibility of more than one J installation (even of the same version) - when more than one end-user app is install, could they share same instance of J installation --- Eric Iverson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > You raise a point I have been thinking about and your comment about 3 parts: > immutable system, extensions, user > makes some sense. > > This suggests a minor tweak to our current layout which is to add addons to > the user folder. This would remove the admin requirement for using JAL for > addons. But addons would then be duplicated and user specific in a multiuser > system. How much such we cater to multi-user systems where different users > have different addons? > > So I come back to thinking that addons (at least for now) should be > considered as part of system and not part of user. > > I also think that JAL will be used for updates to system and won't be > restricted to addons. There is no reason it can't be used to update the > standard library and even binaries and tools. > > If system is in a secure folder and addons is in system, you will have to be > admin in order to use JAL. > > I don't mind this as long as the user was encouraged to use a non-secure > folder and explicitly chose to make system secure. > > The use of "program files..." in vista is a nightmare because of the virtual > backing store rules. In vista if a non admin program writes a file to > "program files..." it gets written to a virtual backing store in home. Tthis > same user runnning as admin sees the primary files and not the backing > store. And another user sees only the primrary files. This mess is not easy > to protect against and my only thought is to recommend as strongly as > possible against "program files..." in vista. And if it isn't a good idea in > vista (where most xp users will eventually be forced), why induldge in it > now in XP? > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Oleg Kobchenko" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > To: "Beta forum" <[email protected]> > Sent: Thursday, October 04, 2007 2:11 AM > Subject: Re: [Jbeta] Mac 602 beta update > > > > This works as expected, however it is a good example of > > installation for a J-written end-user product rather than > > J as development environment. > > > > The previous layout was better, when all the files and folders > > are observable and explore-able rather than hidden. > > Some things may not even work, like Find in Files, open > > system scripts with open dialog, etc. Writing addons into > > the space of conceptually immutable app doesn't feel right either. > > > > However, the dmg package is better than tgz. > > > > A closest system to compare is Eclipse: it has three parts: > > immutable Java runtime, extensible IDE and user workspace. > > > > > > --- Eric Iverson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > >> Following the many suggestions I have repackaged J602 for Mac. There are > >> still serious rough edges but it feels like progress. I have not updated > >> the > >> web site beta download page as I'd like to get some feedback first. > >> > >> Mac 602 beta users: > >> http://www.jsoftware.com/download/j602abeta_intel.dmg > >> http://www.jsoftware.com/download/j602abeta_powerpc.dmg > > > > > > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________________________________________ > > Boardwalk for $500? In 2007? Ha! Play Monopoly Here and Now (it's updated > > for today's economy) at Yahoo! Games. > > http://get.games.yahoo.com/proddesc?gamekey=monopolyherenow > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm > ____________________________________________________________________________________ Take the Internet to Go: Yahoo!Go puts the Internet in your pocket: mail, news, photos & more. http://mobile.yahoo.com/go?refer=1GNXIC ---------------------------------------------------------------------- For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm
