JHS and JHP serve different purposes: - JHS is a web-enabled J session, i.e. it runs development tools (IDE) through web; only in the future would it be possible to build a web-based Window Driver (or other high-level toolkit) to create user apps.
- JHP is an SDK for web applications in J, i.e. it is specifically targeted to create end-user web apps in a traditional sense (like PHP, ASP, JSP etc.) where J serves as the back-end engine. So it will still be possible to create JHP apps in J7, but the developer may use the web-enables JHS session instead of the desktop IDE. (There may be some other enhancements like sticky session, as opposed to stateless CGI.) > From: Henry Rich <[email protected]> It's not an exercise for me, it's a project, and Ric and Joey have convinced me that JHS is not the way to go. Henry Rich Björn Helgason wrote: > I thought that using J7 and JHS as server were the object of this exercise. > > > 2010/4/4, Sherlock, Ric <[email protected]>: >> >>> From: Henry Rich >>> >>> Thanks for the tips. This is looking like a feasible project. I >>> will be on Windows only. >>> >>> What server did you use/do you recommend for someone who wants to >>> spend no money & have a debugging server with minimal effort? >> Well since it is Windows only I'd go for IIS. Free with most Windows >> versions and easier to configure on Windows than Apache. >> >>> Ric - could you send me (or post here) the code for your web app? >>> It >>> sounds very similar to what I want (& almost identical to a project I >>> have for next year) & it is always easier to start with a 'go-by'. >> Sure, will contact you off list for access. >> Ric >> >>> Sherlock, Ric wrote: >>>> Henry, >>>> I can recommend Oleg's web/jhp addon. I used it to develop a web >>> application used by a classes of up to 100 students to simulate >>> breeding animal populations. >>>> It uses cookies to track individual students sessions. >>>> For development purposes I just installed a web-server on my laptop. >>>> >>>> HTML/javascript can be quite fancy these days (my application >>> isn't!). It makes life easier though if you can target a single >>> browser. I don't imagine there would be any inherent difficulty in >>> using Flash or Silverlight, but haven't gone there myself. >>>> Ric >>>> >>>> http://www.jsoftware.com/jwiki/JHP >>>> http://olegykj.sourceforge.net/jhp/ >>>> >>>>> From: Henry Rich >>>>> >>>>> So, Joey, is the idea that my J script sits on the server and spits >>> out >>>>> HTML to the user's browser? >>>>> >>>>> Then the user's form input would get routed through CGI somehow and >>>>> presented to my J script? My IT guy says we are using >>>>> some-damn-thing-from-Microsoft that establishes sessions and gives a >>>>> session ID that should go into each form. So my J script could put >>> all >>>>> that into each screen. >>>>> >>>>> Forms and HTML I understand. And I can see that this would generate >>> a >>>>> usable interface. I can start with that. >>>>> >>>>> Two questions: >>>>> >>>>> How should my guy debug his HTML-generating code? He will just be >>> at >>>>> home with no server. Should I have him connect his browser to a >>> port >>>>> that passes the form input into his J verbs? >>>>> >>>>> The HTML interface will work. But it wouldn't be really cool. If >>> he >>>>> wants to make the user's screen fancy, does he have to use some >>>>> language >>>>> like Flash or perhaps Java? Do we have examples of how such a >>> program >>>>> would send information back to a server? (I assume the server >>>>> interface >>>>> would still follow the HTTP spec). >>>>> >>>>> Henry Rich >>>>> >>>>> Joey K Tuttle wrote: >>>>>> All of the older systems supprt this very well using GCI. I like j >>> as >>>>>> a server side engine and (almost) never use the GUI... >>>>>> >>>>>> Sent from my iPod - excuse terseness and typos. >>>>>> >>>>>> - joey >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> On Mar 27, 2010, at 14:02, Eric Iverson <[email protected]> >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> Perhaps I misunderstand the architecture of your app. But if the >>>>>>> server runs >>>>>>> on a web server and the client runs on a browser then gtk is >>>>>>> probably not >>>>>>> the way to go. gtk is similar to the Windows API or Java and runs >>> on >>>>>>> the >>>>>>> client and this doesn't sound like your situation. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I think jhs is the way to go. Unfortunately you are a bit ahead of >>>>>>> the curve >>>>>>> and there is no documentation and the current code in jhs that >>> could >>>>>>> be used >>>>>>> as templates is very very rough. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Basically one one needs to know html/forms/css/javascript. Then it >>>>>>> is easy >>>>>>> to have jhs serve a form to the browser that has displayed html, >>>>> input >>>>>>> fields. buttons, checkboxes, select lists etc. The user causing an >>>>>>> action >>>>>>> (pressing a button) runs a J sentence on the server and this send >>>>>>> back a new >>>>>>> html page to the browser. For a simple app you can get away >>> without >>>>>>> javascript and that simplifies things quite a bit. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> You can start by getting a handle on html and forms. There are >>> many >>>>>>> books >>>>>>> and web references for this stuff. Then css can be used to refine >>>>> the >>>>>>> appearance and give a better separation between content and >>>>>>> presentation. >>>>>>> Finally you can hook it up to a jhs task. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> You can take a look at this on your own machine by installing the >>>>>>> current >>>>>>> beta. Although still a bit of a mess you can take a look at >>>>>>> ~system/extras/util/jhs/core.ijs jijx.ijs jijs.ijs file.ijs. Your >>>>>>> app will >>>>>>> probably be a single file similar to file.ijs that creates a >>> locale >>>>>>> with the >>>>>>> app name. The file contains event handlers and the code to send >>> back >>>>> a >>>>>>> proper html page as the result. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Please let me (and the beta forum) know how it goes and ask >>>>>>> questions as >>>>>>> your project moves along. Start with a dead simple app that has a >>>>>>> single >>>>>>> text field and button in a form and have the button flip the text. >>>>>>> Once you >>>>>>> can do that it is a simple matter of more of the same. >>>>>>> On Sat, Mar 27, 2010 at 1:34 PM, Henry Rich <[email protected]> >>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> I have my students working on their project that will become a >>> web- >>>>>>>> based >>>>>>>> J app. The student in charge of the user interface is now ready >>> to >>>>>>>> start coding and I need advice on how he should start. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> I read in this forum that there is something called jgtk on the >>>>>>>> way. Is >>>>>>>> there a preliminary version of this that I can show him? If not, >>>>> any >>>>>>>> ideas on when one will be available? If not that, then any tips >>> on >>>>>>>> what >>>>>>>> to expect, and how he can use existing gtk documentation to get >>>>>>>> started? >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> His program will run on the server, using the user's browser as >>> the >>>>>>>> input device. IIRC, this means that jgtk is the correct way for >>>>>>>> him to >>>>>>>> write his GUI. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm
