- The skeleton mentioned is only the deforming joints right? or does it include (for example) IK/FK switching, controls, etc. ?
If it is adding joints to the mesh via topology, I'm not sure that it is more than limited usefulness; agreeing with Nathan here. This might be an easy problem to solve, but it is not the bottleneck in rigging- as nathan said, might help with background characters, if the skeleton joints have consistent names, and I guess it could be used and tweaked for forground characters. On the other hand, I'd suggest alternate skinning/deformation techniques that avoid weight painting by hand as a really important and useful rigging speedup ;) cheers On Tue, 2013-04-30 at 13:42 -0500, Alexander Pinzon Fernandez wrote: > The method is fully automatic. > The method generates a new skeleton from a mesh of polygons. > The method links the skeleton and mesh. > The method does not use any sample skeleton. > The proposed method provides only the skeleton, and the artist will have to > animate the skeleton. > > > > 2013/4/30 Nathan Vegdahl <[email protected]> > > > > It would look like makehuman > > > > Eh... I think I may be a bit confused. The proposal is about > > automatically generating skeletons for an arbitrary model, but it > > sounds like the workflow you outlined doesn't automate that step at > > all. What you've outlined is still cool, but it sounds orthogonal to > > what is currently being discussed, unless I'm misunderstanding > > something...? > > > > Moreover, unless I'm mistaken, Makehuman is specific to bipedal > > characters with roughly human characteristics. Whereas the intent of > > the original proposal (unless I'm misunderstanding it) is to function > > for any morphology. > > > > --Nathan > > > > > > > > On Tue, Apr 30, 2013 at 12:18 AM, Patrick Shirkey > > <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > On Tue, April 30, 2013 12:54 pm, Nathan Vegdahl wrote: > > >> For something like this to be really useful, I think it needs to be > > >> user-guide-able. And even then, it would mostly be useful for > > >> background characters, not hero characters (which need fine tuning by > > >> an artist). > > >> > > >> I can imagine this being useful, for example, for fully automatic > > >> rigging of a crowd's worth of background characters. But it would > > >> need to take guidance from the user regarding the style and morphology > > >> of the characters, and the topology, naming scheme, and alignment of > > >> the skeleton to be generated. And honestly, I haven't a clue what > > >> that would look like. > > >> > > > > > > It would look like makehuman > > > > > >> In general, building base skeletons is not the bottleneck of rigging > > >> characters anyway. And even if you want to make that faster, just > > >> having better/faster tools for doing it manually would get you more > > >> bang for your buck than automatic generation, I suspect. > > >> > > > > > > Animating models is the current bottle neck. This is how I have achieved > > > it with a limited amount of success: > > > > > > > > > 1: Create mesh and apply xonotic rig in makehuman > > > 2: export model and rig to mhx with "Feet on Ground" > > > 3: open blender > > > 4: install iqe/qim exporter > > > 5: install makehuman tools and mhx importer > > > 6: import mhx to blender > > > 7: export iqe of model/rig from blender > > > 8: find and download original official xonotic model blend file > > > 9: Open with blender > > > 10: export model/rig/anims to iqe > > > 11: open both iqe files in a text editor > > > 12: extract anims from official xonotic models iqe file > > > 13: add anims from official xonotic model to makehuman xonotic model > > > 14: save mh iqe file > > > 15: build iqm convertor tool from source > > > 17: run iqm convertor tool on mh iqe file to create animated iqm file > > > 18: import iqm file to external 3d game engine (cube2) > > > > > > cube2 import steps > > > 19: Place xxx.iqm file in packages/models/xxx folder where xxx is the > > > name of the model > > > 20: add iqm.cfg file and edit with correct commands for loading the iqm > > > 21: add the model name and location to the map.cfg file > > > 22: load the map in coop edit mode > > > 23: load the model with the "newent mapmodel i" where i is the numerical > > > position of the model in the model list > > > > > > additional steps for using animated model in cube2 > > > > > > 24: make changes to some hardcoded function variables to allow loading > > new > > > animated playermodels > > > 25: add new playermodel to the game config > > > 26: load animated model as a playermodel or bot in coop edit mode > > > > > > > > > End result: > > > > > > http://iguanapro.com/cube/mh4-2.png > > > http://iguanapro.com/cube/mh4-3.png > > > http://djcj.org/video/goblin-demo.mpeg > > > > > > > > > It's a very manual process and not very workable if building a crowd of > > > models in the thousands or hundreds of thousands like for ex. Massive > > from > > > Weta can do > > > > > > There are also issues with scaling and position of the center of origin > > > between models. In this specific case cube2 doesn't (obviously) support > > > changing the center of origin of a model so it has to be handled before > > > exporting from mh/blender. I could not find an obvious method or tutorial > > > for changing the center of origin on a blender model. MH allows changing > > > it at export from origin at hips to feet on ground. > > > > > > To cutdown on a lot of manual steps it looks like the way to go is to add > > > an iqe exporter to MH and > > > export the blend animations/rigs to bvh for inclusion in MH assets > > > archive. Then everything can be applied in MH before exporting to iqe > > > cutting out around 10 steps in the process. FYI, I am working on the MH > > > iqe exporter at the moment. > > > > > > > > > -- > > > Patrick Shirkey > > > Boost Hardware Ltd > > > > > > > > > > > >> --Nathan > > >> > > >> > > >> On Thu, Apr 25, 2013 at 9:02 AM, Alexander Pinzon Fernandez > > >> <[email protected]> wrote: > > >>> Automatic Skeleton Extraction > > >>> > > >>> Alexander Pinzon Fernandez > > >>> > > >>> Email: [email protected] > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> Short description: > > >>> > > >>> The character animation is generally done with skeletons that control > > >>> each > > >>> joint in the character which drastically simplifies the animation > > >>> process. > > >>> The construction of the skeleton given a polygon mesh is a task > > >>> typically > > >>> performed by an artist. This project proposes to implement a method for > > >>> extracting the skeleton automatically given a polygon mesh. > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> *Name*: Alexander Pinzon Fernandez > > >>> > > >>> *Email*: [email protected] > > >>> > > >>> *IRC*: apinzonf > > >>> > > >>> *www*: http://apinzonf.wordpress.com/, > > >>> http://wiki.blender.org/index.php/User:Apinzonf > > >>> > > >>> *Additional Contact Info* > > >>> > > >>> *Phone*: +57 300 2 92 74 30 > > >>> > > >>> *Physical Address*: Cr 81 H No 42a-58 sur Bogota-Colombia > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> Synopsis > > >>> > > >>> The character animation is generally done with skeletons that control > > >>> each > > >>> joint in the character which drastically simplifies the animation > > >>> process. > > >>> The construction of the skeleton given a polygon mesh is a task > > >>> typically > > >>> performed by an artist. This project proposes to implement a method for > > >>> extracting the skeleton automatically given a polygon mesh. > > >>> > > >>> This method iteratively contracts the shape in the reverse direction of > > >>> the > > >>> curvature flow, with a constraint that forces the contracted model will > > >>> closely match the original. In each iteration eliminates details. After > > >>> the > > >>> model volume is close to zero is passed to the next stage in which > > >>> through > > >>> a special surface simplification method removes vertices to obtain a 1D > > >>> structure. > > >>> > > >>> Paper used: > > >>> > > >>> AU, Oscar Kin-Chung, et al. Skeleton extraction by mesh contraction. > > >>> ACM > > >>> Transactions on Graphics (TOG). ACM, 2008. p. 44. > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> Benefits to Blender > > >>> > > >>> This project proposes a new tool for blender user that requires extract > > >>> the > > >>> skeleton of polygon meshes. > > >>> > > >>> This method allows to obtain the skeleton of a polygon mesh quickly and > > >>> automatically. > > >>> > > >>> This method is insensitive to noise because it uses a smoothing > > >>> algorithm > > >>> for contraction which removes the noise and detail in each iteration. > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> Deliverables > > >>> > > >>> 1. A new skeleton extraction tool for Blender. > > >>> 2. Some pages of documentation to be included in the manual > > >>> 3. A technical document for developers to improve the method in the > > >>> future. > > >>> 4. A tutorial explaining the use of the tool. > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> Project Details > > >>> > > >>> The project would divide into seven parts: > > >>> > > >>> 1. Iteratively contracting the mesh until the volume is close to > > >>> zero. > > >>> 2. Simplifying polygon mesh to obtain a 1D structure (skeleton). > > >>> 3. Relocating skeleton nodes in the center of each segment. > > >>> 4. Create vertex groups for each node of the skeleton. > > >>> 5. Converting a 1D polygon mesh into an armature. > > >>> 6. Link vertex groups to bones of the armature. > > >>> 7. Generation of the documentation and tutorials. > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> Project Schedule > > >>> > > >>> - *2 Weeks:- May 27 – Jun 09:* Iteratively contracting the > > >>> mesh until the volume is close to zero. > > >>> - *3 Weeks:- Jun 10 – Jun 31:* Simplifying polygon mesh to > > >>> obtain a 1D structure (skeleton). > > >>> - *2 Weeks:- Jul 01 – Jul 14:* Relocating skeleton nodes > > in > > >>> the center of each segment. > > >>> - *2 Weeks:- Jul 15 – Jul 28:* Create vertex groups for > > >>> each > > >>> node of the skeleton. > > >>> - *3 Weeks:- Jul 29 – Aug 18:* Converting a 1D polygon > > mesh > > >>> into an armature. > > >>> - *2 Weeks:- Aug 19 – Sep 01:* Link vertex groups to bones > > >>> of > > >>> the armature.. > > >>> - *1 Weeks:- Sep 02 – Sep 08:* Testing the tool and Define > > >>> and > > >>> implement graphical user integration. > > >>> - *2 Weeks:- Sep 09 – Sep 22:* Generation of the > > >>> documentation > > >>> and tutorials. > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> Bio > > >>> > > >>> I graduated as systems engineer in Colombia in 2007. > > >>> > > >>> I am a MSc computer science student at National University of Colombia. > > >>> > > >>> Skeleton extraction and mesh smoothing are the research topics of my > > >>> MSc. I > > >>> am use CGAL, Graphite and Qt libraries. > > >>> > > >>> Since 2007 I am a member of the Bioingenium Research Group of National > > >>> University of Colombia. > > >>> > > >>> I have been using Blender for about 10 years. I was working on the > > >>> develop > > >>> of a operator to remove noise from a mesh at GSOC 2012 – Blender suchi > > >>> branch “Mesh Smoothing for 3d Scan Data”. > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> WORK EXPERIENCE: > > >>> > > >>> 2012 Google Summer of Code – Blender Foundation: “Mesh Smoothing for 3d > > >>> Scan Data”. > > >>> > > >>> 2010 - Scire Foundation, Software Architect: > > >>> > > >>> Design and development of web services data, hibernate and oracle. > > >>> > > >>> Programming GUI with RichFaces. > > >>> > > >>> Library of generic manipulation of trees, based on Java reflection > > >>> techniques. > > >>> > > >>> 2005 - 2007 Sigtech, LTDA, Developer Engineer: > > >>> > > >>> SIGC System Development for the "Departamento Administrativo de > > >>> Catastro Distrital DACD". > > >>> > > >>> Software used in development: Oracle 9i, Visual Basic 6, PL / SQL > > >>> Developer. > > >>> > > >>> 2004 -2005 IIE and Colciencias, Student Monitor research: > > >>> > > >>> Project: " Theater of Memory in Virtual Worlds:" > > >>> > > >>> Architecture for handling streaming video that comes from a digital > > >>> camcorder and put it as a texture of a 3D plane in a virtual setting, > > >>> using > > >>> the Java software, J3D, JMF, VRML, X3D. > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> SOFTWARE DEVELOPED: > > >>> > > >>> Nukak3D http://sourceforge.net/projects/nukak3d > > >>> > > >>> 3D medical image platform for visualization and image processing. > > >>> > > >>> Nukak3d is a flexible architecture that integrates general-purpose > > >>> graphics libraries such as VTK, ITK, VTKInria3D, OpenGL, under a > > >>> graphical > > >>> user interface (wxWidgets) for three-dimensional visualization and > > >>> processing of medical images. On C++. > > >>> > > >>> JNukak3D http://sourceforge.net/projects/jnukak3d > > >>> > > >>> Software for three-dimensional visualization of DICOM images based on > > >>> java. > > >>> > > >>> JVC1394 http://sourceforge.net/projects/jvc1394/ > > >>> > > >>> Wrapper for the library Libdc1394 to enable communication with the Java > > >>> programming language. Java Video Capture for IEEE 1394 cameras. On C, > > >>> C++, > > >>> Java, Swig. > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> PUBLICATIONS > > >>> > > >>> León J., Pinzón A., Sánchez C., Romero E. A distributed plugin based > > >>> architecture for medical image processing. Proc. SPIE 8674, Medical > > >>> Imaging > > >>> 2013: Advanced PACS-based Imaging Informatics and Therapeutic > > >>> Applications, > > >>> 867403 (March 29, 2013);doi:10.1117/12.2007180. > > >>> > > >>> Pinzón, A., Leon, J.C., Romero E., Diseño y desarrollo de una > > >>> aplicación web para la visualización eficiente de imágenes medicas, > > con > > >>> procesamiento 3D por software o por hardware. En Seminario > > Internacional > > >>> de > > >>> Procesamiento y Análisis de Imágenes Médicas SIPAIM 2009, (Noviembre > > >>> 27-27, > > >>> 2009), Bogotá Colombia. > > >>> > > >>> Pinzón A., Romero E., Visualización 3D de imágenes médicas: > > una > > >>> herramienta Open Source, En Seminario Internacional de > > Procesamiento > > >>> y > > >>> Análisis de Imágenes Médicas SIPAIM 2008, (Noviembre 24-27, 2008), > > >>> Bogotá – > > >>> Colombia. > > >>> > > >>> Mendoza, B. U., Ramos, G. A., Mendez, L. M., Santamaria, W., > > >>> and Pinzón, A. 2006. Camera Motion Control from a Java 3D > > >>> Environment: Virtual Studio Application in Decorative Arts Museum > > >>> Collections. In Proceedings of the 2006 international Conference on > > >>> Cyberworlds (November 28 - 29, 2006). CW. IEEE Computer Society, > > >>> Washington, DC, 58-64. > > >>> _______________________________________________ > > >>> Bf-committers mailing list > > >>> [email protected] > > >>> http://lists.blender.org/mailman/listinfo/bf-committers > > >> _______________________________________________ > > >> Bf-committers mailing list > > >> [email protected] > > >> http://lists.blender.org/mailman/listinfo/bf-committers > > >> > > > > > > > > > -- > > > Patrick Shirkey > > > Boost Hardware Ltd > > > _______________________________________________ > > > Bf-committers mailing list > > > [email protected] > > > http://lists.blender.org/mailman/listinfo/bf-committers > > _______________________________________________ > > Bf-committers mailing list > > [email protected] > > http://lists.blender.org/mailman/listinfo/bf-committers > > > _______________________________________________ > Bf-committers mailing list > [email protected] > http://lists.blender.org/mailman/listinfo/bf-committers _______________________________________________ Bf-committers mailing list [email protected] http://lists.blender.org/mailman/listinfo/bf-committers
