Dear Peter Brinson, I would just as soon see a few of these "threads" cease as well, but you guys just keep coming. As for your point, that simply reinforces what I have said. With your PBS documentary about GM, doesn't that show the corruptibility of the STATE planners who then exerted their STATE(city, county,state,Federal) power through charging the Chicago streetcar companies to maintain the streets at their expense, while the GM busses--if that is what they bought--(there were also White and other makers). I would expect that Westinghouse and the electric busses and streetcars might have had something to say. But with a shift to a new method--GM busses, there was more in the PUBLIC trough. Again, the PEOPLE were satisfied with electric streetcars and busses and the PLANNERS displaced that type of transport. Thank for making that point. All those environmental friendly transport options were introduced by the private sector when there was a NEED.
Eric Peter Brinson wrote: > As much as I would like to see this thread end, I'm not sure this > information is true. > There is a fair amount of evidence (though there is some controversy > around it) that private enterprise, not the state, killed the > streetcar. Specifically, GM, Standard Oil, and a few other companies > were accused of conspiring to do so--why? so that they could create > more demand for internal combustion engine vehicles--automobiles and > buses. You can see the film "Taken for a Ride" for the story, or > google Branford Snell's name and you'll get some of the controversy. > > The point being: in countries like ours, two groups of people make > decisions that affect everybody: government and business. Government > is accountable to the people through the voting process; business is > accountable to the people through the market. While there are many > examples of businesses responding to consumer demand, there are just > as many, or perhaps more, examples of businesses shaping consumer > demand (ever heard of a thing called advertising?). As one's ability > to shape society with your dollar bills is limited, government is > about the only other mechanism available in which ordinary people > COULD theoretically make a difference. > > If you remove government from the urban planning process, you end up > with companies like GM basically doing urban planning. In short, > somebody has to do it. Do you feel comfortable leaving it up to "the > market," knowing that "the market" basically just means millionaires > in this context? > > Peter > > p.s. Schwinn definitely influenced modern bicycling, but I'd guess GM > and Ford probably influenced it just as much. > > On Nov 5, 2007, at 12:48 PM, Eric Westhagen wrote: > > > Dear Group, > > > > Again, today, there are links from "bikies" contributors about "mass > > transit." Personally, I cross the country by train and have not flown > > for years. But suggesting that THE STATE is the solution to a shift > > toward mass transit flies in the face of fact and history. At every > > turn it is the government which killed off mass-transit. How can one > > have blind faith that matters will be different? It is the MASS of > > people who demand a mode of transport and government either follows > > the > > MASS for votes or certain other interests with power. > > > > Who killed off streetcars with unfair taxes and road repair > > requirements > > in favor of gassy buses? ---government. And in my time we still had > > rail passenger service in Wisconsin. But the people spoke against > > that > > service and refused to ride if they could drive. Railroads were > > required to follow a lengthy regulation process to drop the unwanted > > services so they ran empty trains for years. Two such trains served > > Ripon. One went all the way to Milwaukee and the other ran from > > Fond du > > Lac and NW. Old railmen, high on their union bump list would play > > cards > > in the coach in the empty car. > > > > We are now seeing a rebirth of rail for freight in Wisconsin. > > There is > > a need. That way should precede mass passenger transit if it is to > > succeed. I know that the contributors to "bikies" would like > > GOVERNMENT > > to follow their advice or pressure and demands that people leave their > > cars at home and ride the rail. That will happen when the roads > > become > > so saturated that people CHOOSE RAIL. Then the same enterprisers who > > have revived Wisconsin rail will fill the need if it exists. But how > > can regional committee planners make this happen. Remember the money > > pot is only so large at the PUBLIC trough. The current budget > > crisis is > > an example that the "game" squeezes education rather than cut the > > "pets" > > of the advocates. > > > > Eric > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Bikies mailing list > > [email protected] > > http://www.danenet.org/mailman/listinfo/bikies _______________________________________________ Bikies mailing list [email protected] http://www.danenet.org/mailman/listinfo/bikies
