Thanks for sharing these docs. I am curious about the rationale for "Hidden Mode" as described in the visual spec <https://docs.google.com/document/d/1EpJnWAcPCxBQo6zPGR1Tg1NACiIJ-6dk7cYyK1DhBWw/edit>. Why is this mode desired only for non-root scrollers?
On Tue, Mar 22, 2022 at 4:33 PM Rahul Arakeri <arak...@microsoft.com> wrote: > Just checking in to see if anyone got a chance to review the doc. > > Please let us know if you have any questions/concerns (or if it looks good > as-is). š > > > > Thanks, > > Rahul > > > > *From:* Rahul Arakeri > *Sent:* Thursday, March 10, 2022 5:48 PM > *To:* Chris Harrelson <chris...@chromium.org> > *Cc:* Steve Kobes <sko...@chromium.org>; Ian Kilpatrick < > ikilpatr...@chromium.org>; Mike Taylor <miketa...@chromium.org>; > blink-dev <blink-dev@chromium.org>; Robert Flack <fla...@chromium.org>; > wangxianzhu <wangxian...@chromium.org>; Philip Rogers <p...@chromium.org>; > input-dev <input-...@chromium.org>; Yaroslav Shalivskyy < > yshalivs...@microsoft.com>; Olga Gerchikov <gerch...@microsoft.com>; > Sahir Vellani <sahir.vell...@microsoft.com>; Ben Mathwig < > benjamin.math...@microsoft.com> > *Subject:* RE: [EXTERNAL] Re: [blink-dev] Intent to implement: Fluent > Scrollbars. > > > > Hello everyone, > > > > Hereās the design doc. Please have a look at it and let us know what you > think. š > > FluentScrollbarsDesignDoc - Google Docs > <https://docs.google.com/document/d/1YDigd2XlAw0Lj5cQ5S-mGzntLZghLRUJ_wKLsCBxsuw/edit> > > > > Thanks, > > Rahul > > > > *From:* Rahul Arakeri > *Sent:* Tuesday, February 8, 2022 9:24 AM > *To:* 'Chris Harrelson' <chris...@chromium.org> > *Cc:* Steve Kobes <sko...@chromium.org>; Ian Kilpatrick < > ikilpatr...@chromium.org>; Mike Taylor <miketa...@chromium.org>; > blink-dev <blink-dev@chromium.org>; Robert Flack <fla...@chromium.org>; > wangxianzhu <wangxian...@chromium.org>; Philip Rogers <p...@chromium.org>; > input-dev <input-...@chromium.org>; Yaroslav Shalivskyy < > yshalivs...@microsoft.com>; Olga Gerchikov <gerch...@microsoft.com>; > Sahir Vellani <sahir.vell...@microsoft.com>; Ben Mathwig < > benjamin.math...@microsoft.com> > *Subject:* RE: [EXTERNAL] Re: [blink-dev] Intent to implement: Fluent > Scrollbars. > > > > Sounds good Chris, weāll send out a class design doc shortly to get > everyone on the same page. > > > > Re Manuel: Thanks for your input, weāll come up with a plan to keep > non-overlay scrollbars tests running as well.. > > > > *From:* Chris Harrelson <chris...@chromium.org> > *Sent:* Thursday, February 3, 2022 10:28 PM > *To:* Rahul Arakeri <arak...@microsoft.com> > *Cc:* Steve Kobes <sko...@chromium.org>; Ian Kilpatrick < > ikilpatr...@chromium.org>; Mike Taylor <miketa...@chromium.org>; > blink-dev <blink-dev@chromium.org>; Robert Flack <fla...@chromium.org>; > wangxianzhu <wangxian...@chromium.org>; Philip Rogers <p...@chromium.org>; > input-dev <input-...@chromium.org>; Yaroslav Shalivskyy < > yshalivs...@microsoft.com>; Olga Gerchikov <gerch...@microsoft.com>; > Sahir Vellani <sahir.vell...@microsoft.com>; Ben Mathwig < > benjamin.math...@microsoft.com> > *Subject:* Re: [EXTERNAL] Re: [blink-dev] Intent to implement: Fluent > Scrollbars. > > > > > > On Thu, Feb 3, 2022, 10:00 PM 'Rahul Arakeri' via blink-dev < > blink-dev@chromium.org> wrote: > > Just checking in on this.. Please let us know if you need anything from us > to move this discussion along. > > > > Hi Rahul, > > > > Since this is an intent to implement you don't need any official approval > from an API owner. Feel free to start landing code. Let me know if you run > into any issues, happy to help unblock progress. > > > > Thanks, > > Rahul > > > > *From:* Rahul Arakeri > *Sent:* Tuesday, February 1, 2022 11:43 AM > *To:* 'Steve Kobes' <sko...@chromium.org> > *Cc:* Chris Harrelson <chris...@chromium.org>; Ian Kilpatrick < > ikilpatr...@chromium.org>; Mike Taylor <miketa...@chromium.org>; > blink-dev@chromium.org; Robert Flack <fla...@chromium.org>; wangxianzhu < > wangxian...@chromium.org>; p...@chromium.org; input-...@chromium.org; > Yaroslav Shalivskyy <yshalivs...@microsoft.com>; Olga Gerchikov < > gerch...@microsoft.com>; Sahir Vellani <sahir.vell...@microsoft.com>; Ben > Mathwig <benjamin.math...@microsoft.com> > *Subject:* RE: [EXTERNAL] Re: [blink-dev] Intent to implement: Fluent > Scrollbars. > > > > Re Steve: For Linux, we don't have a strong preference on the default > scrollbar mode (and we donāt yet know the scope of work needed since we > never tested this feature on Linux). > > For Windows however, we recommend having minimal mode as the default as > outlined in the visual spec > <https://nam06.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fdocs.google.com%2Fdocument%2Fd%2F1EpJnWAcPCxBQo6zPGR1Tg1NACiIJ-6dk7cYyK1DhBWw%2Fedit&data=04%7C01%7Carakeri%40microsoft.com%7C2ac1a1970c5243b86f7508d9e7a78ba7%7C72f988bf86f141af91ab2d7cd011db47%7C1%7C0%7C637795529122747147%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000&sdata=wjV1rSuW5VI7QIGa5Zn%2BniKvbllT%2B81iqq1zjF62Zyo%3D&reserved=0> > . > > > > Re all: Please let us know if we all have consensus on the visual styling > <https://nam06.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fdocs.google.com%2Fdocument%2Fd%2F1EpJnWAcPCxBQo6zPGR1Tg1NACiIJ-6dk7cYyK1DhBWw%2Fedit&data=04%7C01%7Carakeri%40microsoft.com%7C2ac1a1970c5243b86f7508d9e7a78ba7%7C72f988bf86f141af91ab2d7cd011db47%7C1%7C0%7C637795529122747147%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000&sdata=wjV1rSuW5VI7QIGa5Zn%2BniKvbllT%2B81iqq1zjF62Zyo%3D&reserved=0> > of the scrollbars. If you want to see the feature in action, please feel > free to check out Microsoft Edge Canary > <https://nam06.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.microsoftedgeinsider.com%2Fen-us%2Fdownload%2Fcanary&data=04%7C01%7Carakeri%40microsoft.com%7C2ac1a1970c5243b86f7508d9e7a78ba7%7C72f988bf86f141af91ab2d7cd011db47%7C1%7C0%7C637795529122747147%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000&sdata=X%2BvICikSWgyvetSfBzwR6EAAqdSmxU6EXosFJSqdzCM%3D&reserved=0>. > (Experimental flag *edge://flags/#edge-overlay-scrollbars-win-style*). > > > > *From:* Steve Kobes <sko...@chromium.org> > *Sent:* Monday, January 31, 2022 11:38 AM > *To:* Rahul Arakeri <arak...@microsoft.com> > *Cc:* Chris Harrelson <chris...@chromium.org>; Ian Kilpatrick < > ikilpatr...@chromium.org>; Mike Taylor <miketa...@chromium.org>; > blink-dev@chromium.org; Robert Flack <fla...@chromium.org>; wangxianzhu < > wangxian...@chromium.org>; p...@chromium.org; input-...@chromium.org; > Yaroslav Shalivskyy <yshalivs...@microsoft.com>; Olga Gerchikov < > gerch...@microsoft.com>; Sahir Vellani <sahir.vell...@microsoft.com>; Ben > Mathwig <benjamin.math...@microsoft.com> > *Subject:* Re: [EXTERNAL] Re: [blink-dev] Intent to implement: Fluent > Scrollbars. > > > > Keeping non-overlay by default on Linux would be one way to mitigate the > risk that Ian mentions, namely that bugs specific to non-overlay mode may > creep in and not be noticed quickly. (This concern applies to some degree > both to bugs in websites, and bugs in Chrome.) > > > > On Mon, Jan 31, 2022 at 2:23 PM 'Rahul Arakeri' via input-dev < > input-...@chromium.org> wrote: > > Thanks Ian :) > > > > Re Chris: > > There will be some OS wiring missing (like switching between dark/light > modes, "Always show scrollbarsā, etc) but most of the code should just > work. Note that we've never really tested this feature on Linux so we do > not have an exhaustive list of stuff that will not work on Linux. > > > > *From:* Chris Harrelson <chris...@chromium.org> > *Sent:* Friday, January 28, 2022 3:45 PM > *To:* Ian Kilpatrick <ikilpatr...@chromium.org> > *Cc:* Rahul Arakeri <arak...@microsoft.com>; Mike Taylor < > miketa...@chromium.org>; blink-dev@chromium.org; Robert Flack < > fla...@chromium.org>; wangxianzhu <wangxian...@chromium.org>; > p...@chromium.org; input-...@chromium.org; Yaroslav Shalivskyy < > yshalivs...@microsoft.com>; Olga Gerchikov <gerch...@microsoft.com>; > Sahir Vellani <sahir.vell...@microsoft.com>; Ben Mathwig < > benjamin.math...@microsoft.com> > *Subject:* Re: [EXTERNAL] Re: [blink-dev] Intent to implement: Fluent > Scrollbars. > > > > Re Linux: I'm hoping we can just use the same code on Linux so that we > have overlay scrollbars everywhere. Rahul, would that work code-wise? > > > > On Fri, Jan 28, 2022 at 3:40 PM Ian Kilpatrick <ikilpatr...@chromium.org> > wrote: > > Exciting! > > > > Adding onto Rahul's answer here a little - overlay scrollbars (or > scrollbars which take to zero space) already exist on other platforms (e.g. > they are the default on OSX). It won't/shouldn't be a web compat concern as > most websites handle this already. > > > > An interesting side effect of this will likely be that we'll see more > sites (who are built after this change goes in) assume that scrollbars are > always zero width (as this is now the default on all platforms except > linux?) and as a result more content going forward being broken for those > users who opt-out. > > (To be clear there isn't much we can do about this - but an interesting > side effect). > > > > Ian > > > > On Fri, Jan 28, 2022 at 2:51 PM 'Rahul Arakeri' via blink-dev < > blink-dev@chromium.org> wrote: > > Hi Mike, > > > > Sure, Iāve created a chromestatus entry here: > https://chromestatus.com/feature/5693137379917824 > <https://nam06.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fchromestatus.com%2Ffeature%2F5693137379917824&data=04%7C01%7Carakeri%40microsoft.com%7C2ac1a1970c5243b86f7508d9e7a78ba7%7C72f988bf86f141af91ab2d7cd011db47%7C1%7C0%7C637795529122747147%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000&sdata=vfppOwtYwtmQrwqiprbugzqPulbVNcuag1WFpo5m60Q%3D&reserved=0> > > And yes, this proposed change is expected to have an impact on the pageās > layout. In itās default state, the scrollbars will be in āminimal modeā > (aka overlay scrollbars). These will *not* take up any layout space > (whereas, today in Chromium, the default scrollbars take up 17px AFAIK). > > The users will however still have an option to āAlways show scrollbarsā > via an OS setting. These *will* take up layout space (similar to what > Chromium scrollbars do today). > > > > Thanks, > > Rahul > > > > *From:* Mike Taylor <miketa...@chromium.org> > *Sent:* Friday, January 28, 2022 12:20 PM > *To:* Rahul Arakeri <arak...@microsoft.com> > *Cc:* blink-dev@chromium.org; Robert Flack <fla...@chromium.org>; > wangxianzhu <wangxian...@chromium.org>; p...@chromium.org; > input-...@chromium.org; Yaroslav Shalivskyy <yshalivs...@microsoft.com>; > Olga Gerchikov <gerch...@microsoft.com>; Sahir Vellani < > sahir.vell...@microsoft.com>; Ben Mathwig <benjamin.math...@microsoft.com> > *Subject:* [EXTERNAL] Re: [blink-dev] Intent to implement: Fluent > Scrollbars. > > > > Hi Rahul, > > > > Would you mind creating a chromestatus entry for this intent? (See "Step > 0" at http://dev.chromium.org/blink/launching-features > <https://nam06.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fdev.chromium.org%2Fblink%2Flaunching-features&data=04%7C01%7Carakeri%40microsoft.com%7C2ac1a1970c5243b86f7508d9e7a78ba7%7C72f988bf86f141af91ab2d7cd011db47%7C1%7C0%7C637795529122747147%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000&sdata=oeqZVkHsRXN%2FzGeO9BceS4FNDQ9LjZfrnQZTB8Xc4Uc%3D&reserved=0> > for a link). > > > > Also, out of curiosity (because I don't know much about scrollbars) - will > this proposed change have an impact on a page's layout? > > > > thanks, > Mike > > > > On 1/28/22 2:50 PM, 'Rahul Arakeri' via blink-dev wrote: > > *Intent to implement: Fluent Scrollbars.* > > > > *Contact emails* > > Rahul Arakeri: arak...@microsoft.com > > Yaroslav Shalivskyy: yshalivs...@microsoft.com > > Sahir Vellani: sahir.vell...@microsoft.com > > Olga Gerchikov: gerch...@microsoft.com > > Ben Mathwig: benjamin.math...@microsoft.com > > > > *Visual Spec* > > > https://docs.google.com/document/d/1EpJnWAcPCxBQo6zPGR1Tg1NACiIJ-6dk7cYyK1DhBWw/edit > <https://nam06.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fdocs.google.com%2Fdocument%2Fd%2F1EpJnWAcPCxBQo6zPGR1Tg1NACiIJ-6dk7cYyK1DhBWw%2Fedit&data=04%7C01%7Carakeri%40microsoft.com%7C2ac1a1970c5243b86f7508d9e7a78ba7%7C72f988bf86f141af91ab2d7cd011db47%7C1%7C0%7C637795529122747147%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000&sdata=wjV1rSuW5VI7QIGa5Zn%2BniKvbllT%2B81iqq1zjF62Zyo%3D&reserved=0> > > > > *Summary* > > This proposal is to modernize the Chromium scrollbars (both overlay and > non-overlay) to fit the Windows 11 Fluent design language. As a part of > this effort, we are proposing to update the visual appearance along with > some changes to how users interact with overlay scrollbars. > > > > *Motivation* > > As the rest of Windows has been embracing WinUI and native Fluent > controls, certain non-XAML apps like Chromium-based browsers still use the > traditional (Win32 looking) scrollbars. As such, we believe that the visual > appearance of scrollbars could use an update in the interest of maintaining > homogeneity with the rest of Windows. > > In a nutshell, weāre proposing that the default scrollbars should act more > like overlay scrollbars, be thinner, have insets and rounded edges. Users > will still have an option to select non overlay scrollbars via the "Always > show scrollbars" OS setting. Non overlay scrollbars will also be restyled > to match Windows theme. For details on scrollbar styling and state > transitions, please see the visual spec linked above. > > Also, please note that since some HTML controls (like <textarea> and > <select>) depend on the ScrollbarThemes(s) that are being refreshed, they > too will also get the new scrollbars. > > > > *Will this feature be supported on all six Blink platforms (Windows, Mac, > Linux, Chrome OS, Android, and Android WebView)?* > > No, this is aimed at Windows for now. However, it can be made available on > Linux too. > > > > *Ongoing technical constraints* > > None. > > > > *Tracking bug* > > https://bugs.chromium.org/p/chromium/issues/detail?id=1292117 > <https://nam06.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fbugs.chromium.org%2Fp%2Fchromium%2Fissues%2Fdetail%3Fid%3D1292117&data=04%7C01%7Carakeri%40microsoft.com%7C2ac1a1970c5243b86f7508d9e7a78ba7%7C72f988bf86f141af91ab2d7cd011db47%7C1%7C0%7C637795529122796656%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000&sdata=JVa%2FN%2FrTCNHWNnA4ZScgXpcm6a%2Fv7cDhum%2BLmcTygo0%3D&reserved=0> > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "blink-dev" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to blink-dev+unsubscr...@chromium.org. > To view this discussion on the web visit > 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