[uucdigest] Friday, February 18 2000 Volume 03 : Number 293 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ | For all available Digest commands including unsubscribe/subscribe, | visit the BMW UUC Digest page: http://www.uucdigest.com | Send SUBMISSIONS to [EMAIL PROTECTED] | Complaints? Send 'em to [EMAIL PROTECTED] if you must. | Visit http://www.bubbaclub.com | www.bimmers.com - "serving enthusiasts on the 'net" | Visit http://www.bimmer.org - ultimate BMW bulletin boards! | Subscribe to the Zionsville Autosport Parts Digest: | http://www.zionsvilleautosport.com/majordomo.htm ����������������������������������������� In this BMW UUC Digest: [uuc] Re: [TheUUCGarage] <ot> Driving/shifting question [uuc] E30 won't go into 1st gear, and sometimes second [uuc] Chelsea TidBit [uuc] E34 Steering wheel removal/HELP [uuc] Speakers for my E28 M5 Re: [uuc] Speakers for my E28 M5 RE: [uuc] <ot> Driving/shifting question [uuc] Re: Driving/shifting question [uuc] E30 Blower Fan noise [uuc] Re: Driving/shifting question [uuc] Turn-in technique Re: [uuc] Turn-in technique [uuc] Gears [uuc] Wind Noise Re: [uuc] Turn-in technique Re: [uuc] Gears ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2000 16:05:59 -0600 From: Rich Gay <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: [uuc] Re: [TheUUCGarage] <ot> Driving/shifting question on 2/18/00 10:12 AM, Moe Drippins at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > I've been practicing Heel/Toe for a short bit now, and have a > question. > > I've found that once I got the mechanics of it down (double clutching > I had already been doing, so that wasn't much of an issue), I'm having > a hard time watching the road and my speedo/tach all at the same time, > while at the same time trying to figure out what speed I want to be at > when I start the turn-in so I can gauge how much to blip the throttle > and what gear to be in. > > Which leads me to a possible solution (and thus, the question). When > you are going into a turn, do you know ahead of time what speed you > want to be at at turn-in? This seems logical to me, since you'd then > know what gear to be in at that time, and what RPM's as well. > Additionally, you can gauge at what time to start your blip based on > how fast your speedo needle is diving toward your target speed. > > Did I get this right? I sort of do it by feel/sound... the faster I'm going when downshifting, the deeper I blip the throttle to bring the engine to a higher RPM, listing to the sound of the engine rather than looking at the tach. - Rich ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2000 17:10:38 -0500 From: "Phemister, George" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: [uuc] E30 won't go into 1st gear, and sometimes second <<<<<<<Alarcon, Rob" asks Subject: [uuc] E30 won't go into 1st gear, and sometimes second !>>>>>>> try bleeding the clutch. George ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2000 14:25:34 -0800 From: "KKiely" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: [uuc] Chelsea TidBit Jame, NO, no not really. Don't give a rat's ass about her or her ilk. - -Kevin ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2000 17:46:33 -0500 From: Matt Dull <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: [uuc] E34 Steering wheel removal/HELP Hello All: I am contemplating replacing the steering wheel on my 93 M5 with one from a 95 M3. I have both vehicles, so I can do a swap to confirm that this actually does work. (according to Jason as Zionsville) . Anyway, I am looking at the wheel on the M5 and it does indeed have the 4 holes behind the steering wheel where right behind where the four horn switches are. It was my understanding that there are allen head bolts here that need to be loosened to remove the airbag assembly. I am looking in the holes and there are no allen head bolts. It looks almost like a very narrow slot for a screwdriver instead, but I am sure this is not so. Can anyone help with either a description or a link to a written article that details the removal for the E34 M5. (The E36 M3 would be great also as this is next.) Thanks, Matt ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2000 15:20:42 -0800 From: "Michael Lesser" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: [uuc] Speakers for my E28 M5 When I bought my '88 M5 two years ago, I took the Alpine head unit, ADS six channel X 50 watt amp, and the ADS 642 crossover from my much beloved and late lamented tii, and installed them in the new car. I installed my two 8" Soundstream subwoofers in the rear parcel shelf, but couldn't find a way to use the two pairs of ADS 320i component speakers from the old car in the M5 without cutting into the door panels and rear shelf. I would like to upgrade the original equipment speakers, and wonder if anyone out there has done so successfully without changing the look of the M5 interior. Any advice and ideas will be much appreciated. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2000 18:48:37 -0500 From: "Dean Boucouras" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: Re: [uuc] Speakers for my E28 M5 I am not completely familiar with the rear deck of an E28 M5, but years ago I installed ADS plate speakers (I believe that they were 300i) in the rear deck of my E23. No holes had to be cut in the rear deck. They worked beautifully for over 10 years. Dean ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2000 18:51:05 -0500 From: Mark Borchik <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: RE: [uuc] <ot> Driving/shifting question Heel and toe shifting... It might as well have been "Greek" when I first started doing schools. There was so much other information that needed to be assimilated in such a short time then. I got by doing the double-clutch thang for awhile, and then, one day, without even realizing it, it just kinda came to me... Without specifically practicing it... Without thinking about it... It just materialized... Out of the necessity of realizing the most efficient way to get around the track in the quickest way possible... By utilizing whatever resource was available to accomplish that mission. Now, nary a day passes without the use of this technique... Every time I drive. I can't imagine driving any other way... Even in the most pedestrian of shi*tboxes... It makes driving even the most lowliest forms of transportation a helluva lot more fun! Yeee-Ha! Life is short. Mark Borchik ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2000 15:56:34 -0800 From: David Rowney <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: [uuc] Re: Driving/shifting question I agree with Scott - go by feel and don't look at the tach, because in a braking zone you should be looking for the turn-in point, (and in a racing situation, glancing in the mirror to check for pass attempts by cars behind you). After a lot of practice you won't think about it any more, and will be able to concentrate on turn-in point (and maybe foiling the guy trying to pass...). On a long braking zone like Turn 11 at Sears Pt. (I think Scott meant 11, not 12 which is just a kink), where you are braking from high speed to a 2nd gear hairpin, I've found it works best to get most of the braking done before the 'heel/toe' shift. Also I've found it is smoother to just crack open the throttle for a longer relative time rather than 'blip' the throttle for a short time. This makes it easier to judge how high the revs are getting, and requires less angle of the foot. In a short braking zone (like Turn 2 Sears, 4th to 3rd in my race car), you don't have this luxury, but there is not as much RPM change as well, so you can do a quick 'blip'. Have fun! Dave ************************************************************************ * Dave Rowney, Hopper Racing * * BMW 328i-G-Stock Solo II * * El Cerrito, California 94530 USA * * http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/Hopper_Racing/ * ************************* [EMAIL PROTECTED] ****************** ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2000 19:04:16 EST From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [uuc] E30 Blower Fan noise My newly acquired '87 325i has a blower fan problem.. (part of the HVAC system) - everytime it's put on the 3 or 4 position, it makes a really loud noise - is this real common among high mileage E30's? I've heard blowers on E30's make noise before, but this is ridiculously loud.. anyway, my question is how hard is it of a job to replace, and what's the cost of replacing one? TIA - -Ted '99 323i/4 ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2000 16:07:36 -0800 From: "Scott D Miller" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: [uuc] Re: Driving/shifting question Zach is perplexed: >Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2000 13:59:04 -0500 >From: "George, Zachariah (CICG Development)" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Subject: RE: RE: [uuc] <ot> Driving/shifting question > >I don't understand all the fuss. >Every single time I want to go from >a higher gear (5) to a lower gear (4), >I depress the clutch pedal, blip the >gas a split while the tranny is disengaged, >proceed to downshift, and release the >clutch before the rpms can return to >their previous level. I know I have synchros, >but the downshift feels positively smoother, >when I do this. What is all this Heel AND toe business? > >perplexed in New York, >Zach Since this has been discussed at various times on this and other digests, I find it hard to believe that someone who has been around for more than a couple of months does not understand this issue. So this was either meant tongue-in-cheek, or you somehow missed all the previous discussions. Abducted by aliens? Whatever, here's my simple explanation. You are speeding towards a tight turn at a fairly high rate of speed, like, say, on a race track. This could also happen on public roads, but we tend to drive slightly less aggressively on public roads, right? So let's pretend we're at the track. Oh, and we must assume you're in a car with a manual transmission. DISCLAIMER: Do not use this heel-and-toe downshift technique in a car with an automatic transmission, the results will be, um, less than happy. Not to mention that there is no clutch pedal. Sorry, back to my simple explanation. High speed straight approaching a low-speed turn. Apply the brakes. Slowing down, slowing down, still slowing down, the turn-in point is approaching. Hey, time to downshift. One foot on the clutch, other foot still on the brake, and you use your third foot to blip the throttle. Wait, that's three feet! I've only got two. OK, who's got 3? No one on this list that I know of. If you keep your foot all the way over on the brake pedal, you can't blip the throttle. OK, let's try that agin. Slowing down, left foot to the clutch, right foot off the brake and onto the throttle pedal to blip, but wait, WE DIDN'T SLOW DOWN ENOUGH, I'M GONNA HIT THAT WALL! BANG! Ouch, now does my insurance cover this? But that's another discussion. Now, you could just start slowing down sooner so that you could brake sufficiently first, then release the brake and downshift while coasting, and then get back on the gas to turn in. But this takes longer. Part of high performance driving is learning how to keep the car at its limits at all times. We don't want to take longer to brake and turn. In fact, the heel and toe thing leads to trail braking, yet another subject, that will also help keep the car at its limits. What to do? There is, of course, the third scenario: Position your foot kind of between the brake and throttle pedals. Part of your foot stays on the brake to complete slowing the car. The other part of your foot slides or swings over and blips the throttle, smoothing your downshift. Three pedals, two feet, but no big deal. It works. It is called heel and toe downshifting, but usually it is actually the side of your foot and the other side of your foot. It just kind of depends on what works for you, or the size of your feet. Or perhaps you'd prefer to just get a third leg and foot surgically attached?!!? THAT I'd like to see. Now that was simple, right? Scott Miller GGC BMW CCA #44977 ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2000 19:29:16 -0500 From: Eric Carnell <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: [uuc] Turn-in technique --- Michael Weishaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Don't you mean brake like mad, downshift, enter the turn, > accelerate through and as you exit the turn? - --- Matthew Yip wrote: Not really - if you turn in while braking or coasting, the car is relatively unbalanced. If you're near the limits of adhesion, the rear will most likely try to swap ends with the front. If you're not braking that hard, well, that's another story. In a RWD car, the amount of power that's applied is more critical BUT regardless of the drive wheels, it's important to keep the power "on" to ensure static dynamics. Matthew: I can't believe you always turn-in under acceleration. Virtually all the books on racing technique, talk about trail-braking into a turn so that there is less understeer at the turn-in initiation point. Granted you are very quickly getting on the gas to keep the chassis set and not unbalance the car. Consider turn 1 at Summit Point. Is anyone actually back on the gas before initiating the turn in? I know my stock M3 would understeer like crazy if I tried to do that. In my E34 I have to trail-brake a bit longer to try to get a little rotation going since the understeer is even worse. Mario Andretti once said (and I paraphrase) that too many drivers actually think the brakes are for slowing the car. He was referring to the need to apply just a touch of brakes before the turn in point in many corners, just to get the front tires to bite a bit more. Mind you, this is subtle chassis balancing, and in no way treatens a spin (since the car hasn't even started its rotation yet). My point is: You should still be at least partly on the brakes (but coming off them) as you make the first turn-in movement of the steering wheel. - --Eric Carnell ncc ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2000 18:03:30 -0800 (PST) From: Matthew Yip <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: Re: [uuc] Turn-in technique - --- Eric Carnell <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > I can't believe you always turn-in under acceleration. Virtually > all the books on racing technique, talk about trail-braking into a > turn so that there is less understeer at the turn-in initiation > point. Granted you are very quickly getting on the gas to keep the > chassis set and not unbalance the car. Consider turn 1 at Summit > Point. Is anyone actually back on the gas before initiating the > turn in? Turn 1 @ Slummit Point is a prime example for turn-in under acceleration. Anything else results in massive understeer. Turn 5 is a very different case however - trail brake almost to the apex in order to rotate the rear of the car - different type of turn however - - diving rather than flat. > My point is: You should still be at least partly on the brakes (but > coming off them) as you make the first turn-in movement of the > steering wheel. That'll result in a spectacular spin b/c, while the front wheels will bite nicely at the moment of turn-in, the driver has no time to transition into acceleration without going thru a neutral chassis phase. I vivdly remember my first drivers school when I was berated an naseum for braking past the turn-in point. As my instructor said - - you'll lose it someday and I don't want to be around you when it happens. ===== Matthew Yip [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.geocities.com/mgyip/ '87 GTi 16v - x2 '88 M5 '99 F350 __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Talk to your friends online with Yahoo! Messenger. http://im.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2000 21:16:41 -0500 From: "Duane Collie" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: [uuc] Gears > > I need to find out what's going on here. At times while I am stopped > > at a red light I cannot get into 1st gear. If I go into second first and > > then try 1st it will go in ... most of the time. Sometimes I cannot even > > get it in second ! Classic E36 trans. Lot of them do it. Know what I found did the trick in mine? A short shift kit and one of UUC Motorwerkes TITANIUM knobs. The extra heavy mass of the Titanium knob has enuf of that engineering fulcrum stuff to overcome the balkiness and it slips right in....easy as pie. - - Duane Collie The Seven Sled <shifts for itself ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2000 21:19:30 -0500 From: "Duane Collie" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: [uuc] Wind Noise > I don't know if anyone else has experienced wind noise. I know I live in > Texas, but I tend to experience wind noise when getting up pass 65mph. I > don't know if this is normal or not. Ever lube the rubber on the window seals? Get a tube of Gummifluge (sp., I know) next time you're at the dealer. Can't hurt....and will make your windows operate easier and prolong the door seal life. Will help the sealing, too. And its cheap to buy. Things always slide better when well-lubricated. - - Duane Collie The Seven Sled ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2000 22:26:35 -0500 From: "James Sheridan-Peters" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: Re: [uuc] Turn-in technique > Turn 1 @ Slummit Point is a prime example for turn-in under > acceleration. Anything else results in massive understeer. Turn 5 > is a very different case however - trail brake almost to the apex in > order to rotate the rear of the car - different type of turn however > - diving rather than flat. > > > My point is: You should still be at least partly on the brakes > (but > coming off them) as you make the first turn-in movement of the > > steering wheel. > > That'll result in a spectacular spin b/c, while the front wheels will > bite nicely at the moment of turn-in, the driver has no time to > transition into acceleration without going thru a neutral chassis > phase. I vivdly remember my first drivers school when I was berated > an naseum for braking past the turn-in point. As my instructor said > - you'll lose it someday and I don't want to be around you when it > happens. Perhaps this is best with an extra footnote: "Under acceleration does not necessarily mean foot to the floor." - -- James Sheridan-Peters [EMAIL PROTECTED] National Capital Chapter '98 323is '85 SCCA Spec RX-7 #00 ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2000 22:28:00 -0500 From: Patrick Burns <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: Re: [uuc] Gears Duane Collie wrote: > Classic E36 trans. Lot of them do it. Know what I found did the trick in > mine? A short shift kit and one of UUC Motorwerkes TITANIUM knobs. The > extra heavy mass of the Titanium knob has enuf of that engineering fulcrum > stuff to overcome the balkiness and it slips right in....easy as pie. *rolls eyes* You're saying the inertia from the shifter knob is what's helping? What's the mass of your Ti knob (and how fast are you moving it?!), and why wouldn't just pushing harder work? If the there's a shifting problem, I'm going to go out on a limb here and say the shifter _knob_ isn't it. (you can all put down your Carroll Smith books now, I read that part too, and your BMW doesn't brake that hard) ------------------------------ End of [uucdigest] V3 #293 ************************** _________________________________________ | Please visit these UUC-approved BMW parts vendors/service providers: | (listed alphabetically) | Bonneville Motorwerks . http://www.bonnevillemotorwerks.com | Circle Tire Co. (used & classic BMW parts) e-mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] | Curry's Auto Service . http://www.currysauto.com | Eurosport . http://www.eurosport-hp.com | Koala MotorSport . http://www.koalamotorsport.com | Taylor BMW - http://www.taylorbmw.com - Doc Bimmer! | The Ultimate Garage . http://www.ultimategarage.com | UUC Motorwerks . http://www.uucmotorwerks.com | Zionsville Autosport . http://www.zionsvilleautosport.com ����������������������������������������
