[uucdigest] Friday, August 8 2003 Volume 03 : Number 6640
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[uuc] Info on negotiating a lease return [uuc] Re: Brake system help wanted ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 7 Aug 2003 22:56:26 -0400 From: "Gary Derian" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: Re: [uuc] Re: Brake system help wanted After a vacuum is pulled, the brake fluid fills all the nooks and crannies that get bypassed with a normal bleed. Gary Derian > How does drawing a vacuum and then back filling with fluid also open the valves in the ABS? I imagine the fluid simply fills in on > both side of the valve??? > > -Kevin > ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 7 Aug 2003 20:27:53 -0700 From: "Clan Hood-Douda" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: RE: [uuc] Where to buy these.... Got my aluminum t-stat housing from BMA for $20. The tool to spin off the fan clutch from the water pump is a 32mm bicycle headset wrench, $14 from your friendly neighborhood bike store. The one I got was designed by Snap-On, is made of thin metal so it slips right in there. Remember the fan clutch spins off reverse threaded. Mike - -----Original Message----- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Mr Sent: Thursday, August 07, 2003 8:36 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [uuc] Where to buy these.... Greetings all! I would like a good (inexpensive) source to purchase an aluminum thermostat housing and the tool that keeps the fan from turning while removing it. This is for a 95 325i. Thanks! Manuel Paredes Blown water pump!! L.A. BMWCCA __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free, easy-to-use web site design software http://sitebuilder.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 8 Aug 2003 00:03:22 -0400 From: "Dennis Liu" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: [uuc] Info on negotiating a lease return Thanks to ALL who responded to my question regarding lease returns! Especially Todd W, Todd S, WOC, Steve K, Dennis W, Michael K, Dale S, Ted P, Nick T, Hans H, Alex C, Lashdeep, and Dan S. I've collected the most pertinent bits, and copied them below for anyone who would like to save this info. 1. He needs to discuss it directly with Audi, dealer has nothing to do with it because the contract is between VW financial and him. it would be in his best interest to call them and discuss the potential purchase but not mention the damage he is responsible for. Does not always work, sometimes those folks will gamble on the auction. 2. I have found that banks, rather than the manufacturer's finance arm, are more likely to negotiate a lease buyout. I doubt this is an absolute rule, however. I negotiated the buyout of my 993 (from a bank) several months ago (I leased it in 2000). I called them after I received a contract in the mail for the buyout at the residual price. The residual was close to retail value. I called and told them I might be interested in keeping the car, but not at the residual price. I mentioned auction prices that I knew were lower, etc. I didn't tell them that the car was in pristine condition -- just that they wouldn't have to do much to it. They asked me what the mileage was -- I was well under the limit, but I told them I would drive the car cross-country before the lease was up, so the mileage would be just under the limit if they got the car back (I was serious!). I mentioned that as long as they sold it to me at or above what they would get at an auction then it would benefit both of us. Eventually, they offered a price $3600 below the residual (just about high-wholesale), but only if I financed it through them. Since the interest rate was competitive and I love the car, I bought it. This is the only personal benefit I think I have received from the lousy economy! 3. i know of people who have negotiated a lower buyout than the residual. and the other way too. a friend had a 20k resid on a saab convertible and bought it for 14 at lease end and i had a friend who had an acura tl that the dealer offered him money to turn in the car early so the dealer could flip it. however, the MOST INTERESTING thing i learned was that some banks insure the difference between the residual and the wholesale and in that instance they will not negotiate b/c they have nothing to lose. this happened to me when we went to turn in my wife's car (lexus) and we tried to negotiate a lower buyout than the residual. your negotiating should be done with the lease company. they own the car, the contract is with them and they have to dispose of it when you give it back to them. 4. In my experience, some companies will and some will not. Mazda did when I bought a 3rd gen coming off of lease in 1995. Porsche and Mercedes absolutely would not as a matter of policy when my car and my wife's ML-430 came off of lease within the last 6 months. I don't know about Audi, but my guess is that they will be the same as Porsche and won't negotiate. 5. Have him call the leasing company and ask them for the "real" buyout on the car. If they claim it is the pre-negotiated price, then ask to talk with their supervisor. They will sell you the car for what they believe they will get at auction. It is done all of the time and is really quite painless. 6. Negotiation at end of lease will probably depend more on who the lease is written through. Banks are more likely to negotiate with the lessee than manufacturers simply because they're not in the car business were as manufacturers' end of lease vehicles would probably go into a pool and dealers will have first shot at the vehicle. When negotiating, i find it best not to divulge too much information, for example mileage, if it's high or low i play it as average simply because you're trying to buy at the lowest possible price 'as is where is'. In California for example, if you buy out your lease car you will have to sign an odometer statement but at that point the negotiation is done and it's just a formality. ymmv. 7. I just returned an '00 BMW 525 wagon which I reall would have liked to buy. Residual was about 33K, trade-in now about $25K. When I asked them about negotiating a purchase price, the all but laughed at me. When it became fairly clear that I wasn't just going to roll over and lease another one, they went to BMW financial and came back to me with an offer of $31.5K. My turn to laugh at them! You would think that with the glut of lease returns out there, BMW would be giving dealers the opportunity to keep their customers happy. I recently heard that the reason they don't "give" much from residual values is because of insurance policies of sorts, in place to guarantee that value. In other words, if a car goes to auction and brings $10K less than the residual, the insurance co makes up the difference. A private sale at the same price wouldn't bring the difference from the insurance. Don't know if this is true, but it sort of makes sense. Can anyone substantiate this? If it's true, I suspect that the same might be true in the Audi universe. 8. My personal experience is with BMW Financial so it may not be applicable to Audi. Just last year, my lease was up on the 540. The residual was much higher on lease agreement than market value, that's a good thing for me. I tried two or three times to negotiate with BMW Financial to buy the car directly from them at lease end. They would not change one cent on the buyout cost. The encouraged me to talk to my BMW retailer. So I went to the dealer I leased my car from. The sales manager pulls up the record from BMW Financial and printout all the terms of the lease and new buyout cost. He give me a copy of the printout and told me to go home think about it. Well, buyout cost for me has been discounted by $4500. I went home and cranked out all the numbers for re-leasing as CPO or financing the car, it worked out that I CPO the car for $1200 so I can get the 3.9% CPO finance rate. Since it is CPO, I can get $500 rebate through BMW CCA rebate. I did shop around with other dealers and see how much they would offer for buyout. Some will only sell to me at the original lease buyout, others after some probing will let me have it with the lower buyout. So dealership will have different policies. CPO price is also different. My car was in premium conditions. The only things dealer did to CPO the car is Inspection I, which my car was almost due with one green light left, wipers, and all new brake pads. I know the front brake pads had as least 1/2 life left since I changed them not too long ago but the dealer still changed it out. This was all included with the $1200 CPO. I often wonder if I had bald tires what they would have done or charged me for a new set. They did skip detailing of the car since I told them I don't like the way they detail cars. My guess is the buyout cost change daily or weekly. Of course YMMV, especially with Audi. 9. [from an Audi employee] > Audi will not negotiate the buyback price and are usually VERY liberal on *damage* to their lease cars. My advise is to return the car and run. 10. Leases vary tremendously company-by-company, and also state-by-state, as state laws vary in this regard. Worse, the various leasing company lawyers intrepret the state laws differently, so you'll have Company X saying that they can't do what Company Y is doing. Having said that.... Years ago, lease companies were quite flexible. However, government types ruled that some leases were actually purchases, which has both tax and other legal implications. So, the leasing companies tend to have their hands tied in some respects. Depending upon the laws (and the leasing co. interpretation of said laws), the leasing company often will not deviate from the stated termination agreement. What usually happens is that the company takes the car back, and runs it thru an auction. Sometimes this gets short-stopped by the dealer, who, with some companies will have first right of refusal. If your friend is on good relations with the dealer, have him ask. In particular, the dealer should know what the leasing co. normally does with their cars. The dealer may be able to arrange the purchase and sale for a reasonable price. However, if the dealer is a butt..... 11. They will negoatiate the lease payoff amount. They will not do it happily, and they will not do it without plenty of coercion on your part. If the car is particularly nice, they will keep it for retail inventory, thus, you will NOT get to negotaite lease payoff. However, with a car that needs $1k in cosmetic work, I wouldn't think this car would qualify for your dealer's retail inventory. Especially since, I assume, this car will have some paintwork (I'm not saying the new car dealers don't have pre-owned stuff on the lot with no paintwork!). Your dealer will have first pick on all off lease audi's coming in, and pick the best to sell for retail....thus, they have plenty to choose from. Their other option for this car is to wholesale it. Usually, Audi Financial, or even the dealership, will have an affilitation with a local auction, or an auction that runs the Audi Sale (offlease Audi inventory owned by Audi Financial). They will run the car there and take a wholesale price. If that is where the car is headed...you can step in and try to buy it between a wholesale and retail number. It could be worth a try...but, it will take a lot of negotiating bull$%%% to get it done...which your friend may or may not want to deal with. 12. With my 'vette lease bank they would not come off the price at all - even though I told them the residual was too high. They did offer cheap financing for the buy-out, however. When it got down to the last week or two before turn in and I assured them I was turning the car in, THEN they dropped the price. First $1000 off, then $1500, and finally $2500 off. The guy I worked with was nice, but he was on commission. If he got me to take the car at full price he gets a nice bonus. Having to drop the price cut out or eliminated his commission - that is why he waited until too late to drop it. Now this is just with this one bank, YMMV. I asked about BMW here and got some good replies - it seems they will deal. For sure after you turn the car in (if that makes sense). My "plan" is to return the car and buy it back as CPO - hopefully with a nice discount off of residual and a $500 refund via BMWCCA. If the lease is via Audi financial - ask over on one of the Audi forums (or just search) - they may have entirely different practices than other lease banks. vty, - --Dennis ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 07 Aug 2003 23:33:05 -0500 From: Neil Maller <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: [uuc] Re: Brake system help wanted on 8/7/03 7:02 PM, "Stan Jackson Jr." <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > BTW, if you go to a dealer in an attempt to bleed the ABS, be sure to > SPECIFICALLY mention that you want the car pressure bled and that they need > to cycle the ABS using the Modic. Depending on where you are, some dealers > NEVER do this. They pump bleed and don't use the Modic. Pumpy the Bavarian brake dwarf always uses Modic. Neil 96 M3 ------------------------------ End of [uucdigest] V3 #6640 *************************** | | In memory of Michel Potheau - friend, enthusiast, founder of the BMW CCA. |________________________________________ | Please visit these UUC-approved BMW parts vendors/service providers: | (listed alphabetically) | | Autoscope-Motorsports - http://www.autoscope-motorsports.com | |==================================================== | | Koala MotorSport . BMW technical information, special tool sales/rental | http://www.koalamotorsport.com | |==================================================== | | Taylor BMW - http://www.taylorbmw.com - Doc Bimmer! | |==================================================== | Turner Motorsport Inc . 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