How does that quote of Mark Twains go? "The reports of my demise have been much exaggerated"?
I'm here, but in all honesty, I skim through the digests or delete them unread after four of five days. I swear, most of you *guys* can carry on an argument until the dead horse is nothing but bleached bones. This is very bitchy of me to say, but when Jerone and John D.G. go at it, I just plain stop reading. I know they're both so polarized, _nothing_, _no way_, or _no body_ is going to change any of their opinions. Anyway, my arthritis usually gets to me and I can't sit still long enough to read and entire digest from one end to the other. Since I'm now posting around the time of the Super Bowl, I assume the traffic will be down and I'll be able to finish todays digest. However, Brett just whopped me upalongside the head and asked me what I'd been *doing* lately, so I took the hint and read the digests for the last three or four days (and it took me about 2 1/2 hours). My reaction? OH S**T, here we go again. I realise that things have now settled down into reasonable debate about writing a constitution etc. I don't know if anyone is interested, but here's my take on Brin-L, moderation, etiquette, IAAMOAC, etc: This list is a community in the very best sense. We don't have to deal with each others' dirty laundry (well, most of the time we don't, anyway) and we do get to deal with each other in a wholly ex corporeal arena. All thought and no body as it were. What an incredible opportunity to get to know other people. And the medium still knocks my socks off -- talking to someone on the other side of the world, like Brett, within the space of a few minutes??? At virtually no added cost??? If anyone would have told me that this was possible when I was in primary school, I wouldn't have believed it. Europe was somewhere you went maybe once in a lifetime and Australia was totally beyond my comprehension =+)). So, we have this community that is all thought. That is fortunate and unfortunate. Fortunate in that we discuss ideas and aspirations. Unfortunate in that we don't have any mutual interdependence for survival. If we were all living in an old growth forest here in Cascadia together, we'd know the good and the bad of each other, bump along day to day, live out our lives having to get over our spats and indiscretions and be there to enjoy each others accomplishments and joys. Now if this sounds a little warm and runny, it is -- it's also an idea of ebb and flow that I'm having lots of trouble putting into words. When I was more Entish and less tree-like (maybe more GIT and less Goddess-like =+)), I used to try and ding people offline for using hot language. Phrases like "You people" and "Why do you always" and "There you go again" don't do much to improve understanding and communication between people. The Brin used to talk about this attitude in the earlier days when he'd post. I'll never forget one where he talked about being less bullyish and more talkative and how hard it was to act like an adult sometimes. And that attitude is one of the things that has contributed to my participation decrease. I don't ever remember getting into an online or offline argument with someone where I couldn't agree to just drop it, or agree to disagree, or just go home and cry for a while. Here, I am continually amazed at members willingness to argue and argue and argue ad nauseum without actively listening or doing anything but become more polarized. Anyway, I think the current discussions on a constitution are great. The guidelines need to be a fluid thing, as does the current document. I am inclined to agree with Sonja on the wisdom of needing such a document, however. I just think we all need to respect our differences and act like grown ups. I'm also against banning anyone for a proscribed length of time. I can give a little history of Kyle and his banishment. Kyle was on the list briefly spewing venom and incoherence at everyone, DB included. He left of his own accord and things settled down. In response, I was asked to write the guidelines. They were approved by both Hector and Julia and then passed on to Dr. Brin who corrected my spelling among other things =+)), and approved them. He wrote that he envisioned BrinL to develop it's own leaders and form a "Council of Elders" maybe (like on Jijo). Later (it could have been weeks, months or as much as a year) Kyle signed back on. I contacted him and asked him how he was doing and to please not be nasty on BrinL. He didn't answer and unsubscribed himself before he could be bumped. I then talked to Hector and asked him to block his email address so he couldn't re subscribe. Hector did so immediately, and we haven't seen him since. (My personal feeling is that Kyle was very ill and needed treatment and that we weren't going to be able to help him in any way, so it was better for the list to have him gone). Kyle's writing was an egregious violation of human interaction, let alone the guidelines. To ban someone else for anything else would be a mistake, IMO. We're a COMMUNITY, damn it. If Jeroen or JDG makes someone mad, the best thing you can do is IGNORE them, for goodness sake, not continue to argue with them or threaten banishment. On to Julia who gets the "Classiest Woman I Know Award" for being a listowner and staying out of the nitty gritty while remaining involved. I am not/was never a listowner, only a 'now play nice' crone. As such, I still felt that my opinions might carry some weight and so was very reluctant to say what I thought about some subjects. Julia does this better than anyone I know. I think we may all want to light a candle at the altar of St. Julia, Mother *along* with St. Marvin of the List =+)). So please everyone, just try to listen more and talk less, OK? (I know that statement is an oxymoron in the middle of this epistle....) Dee: Maiden/Mother/Crone Boy/Man/Curmudgeon I think that was the progression we came up with. On to my biography: Jo Anne Bird 08-14-48. Yup, I'm a Leo =+)). I'm also OLD. I tried to get the award for official old fart of BrinL once, but Don beat me out. I've been married for over 30 years now to The Engineer. We have two daughters, Arwen age 27 and Sierra age 26. They both graduated from Lewis and Clark College in '96 and '97 respectively. I have a B.Sc.N from the University of Alberta, but no longer practice nursing in a facility. We now live in Milwaukie, Oregon. Sierra is getting married in October, and we are all busy getting ready for what we hope will be about a four day celebration. I facilitate a support group for battered women one night a week and do a fair amount of public speaking on drinking and driving and making the right choices surrounding that behaviour. Arwen and Sierra were badly injured by a drunk driver in 1993. Arwen has become a political activist in the criminal justice reform movement and drags the rest of us (often kicking and screaming) to speaking engagements, fund raisers, speeches, etc. My heart remains in the "Womens Movement", however, and trying to solve the very real problems of rape, incest and domestic violence. I like to sew and do other handicraft sorts of things, too. I took up metalsmithing a few years ago, but I don't work at that often. I find when my hands are busy on crafty things, my mind is more free to think creatively... I was raised a Roman Catholic, but I don't much consider myself RC any more. I don't know what I am. Notveryreligious, but not a spiritual, either. I'll let you know if/when I figure it out. We have two cats, one light-of-my-life Bichon Frise named Edgar, and a Cockatoo, Duke. Duke used to be Duchess until we had him chromosomally sexed. Now he suffers from gender confusion. Brett and Ray Ludenia like to tell cockatoo jokes -- now talk about a reason for banishment!! I think I'm the only person in the US, maybe the world, that liked "Harry Potter" more that "Lord of the Rings". HP is pretty magical for me and stays very close to the books. Also, the theme music is memorable. LotR is good, and I can even stand the shortening of the story line, but Lothlorien really blew, IMO, and the film is overly heavy on the special effects (like the crumbling stairway in Moria -- no need for that). Despite the fact that I just compared them, I think they are two different films and can be appreciated in their own right. I have recently discouvered that I'm not getting any younger and I'd better get off my butt and do some regular exercise because I can't force my body into doing what I want it to anymore. Dee, listen up.... I started swimming!!!. Yup, I make it a whole 3 days a week to the old folks home and swim in their very warm indoor pool. Surprise!! I feel better and my joints hurt less. Will wonders never cease =+)). Gawd, that's a lot of "I" statements. Enough about me. Lets talk about you. How do you feel about me? =+)) A last word: this missive contains strong wording, for me. I would normally have sent it to a few list members: Marvin, Dee, Vera (when she was here), Julia, Brett, Doug and maybe a few more for editing before I posted it. I didn't do that today to get it out in a timely manner. Anyway, who wants to edit a Tome? So, if anyone is offended, please let me know and we'll see if we can work it out. Amities, all Jo Anne P.S. Anyone got any better ideas for getting rid of spam besides replying and following the directions on the email? I did that for about 2 months, and I swear my amount of spam increased. [EMAIL PROTECTED]
