--- Dan Minette <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Ronn!Blankenship" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: "Killer Bs Discussion" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Sent: Saturday, September 20, 2003 7:38 PM
> Subject: Re: Equal rights opportunity or numbers?
>
>
>
> > I agree with you. I just brought that up because it's the situation that
> > must be dealt with in America today.
>
> I've got a question for you then, Ronn. I'll agree, for the sake of
> arguement, that quotas for hiring creates more problems then it solves.
> But, I cannot see how refusing to measure what's happening will solve
> problems.
>
> Let me give a simple example from my work history. A company I worked for
> in Texas had a RIF (Reduction in Force). In a RIF, in Texas, no reasons
> need to be given; its not performance based. In this particular RIF, 21
> people were let go in engineering. All 21 were over 55. There was 1 person
> over 55 who was able to keep his job, becasue his boss convinced the
> company that they couldn't achieve a particular goal if he were let go.
>
> Technically this is legal, because the company's position is that they just
> decided to slash the least important positions. The fact that they created
> positions that were very similar a few months later and hired younger
> people to fill those positions was just a coincidence. I consider that
> obviously false. However, it was impossible to prove this on a case by
> case basis; which was the requirement.
>
> To me, it is obvious that the company decided to get rid of its oldest
> engineers. The pension liability they would have if they allowed these
> workers to work till they were 65 was the most likely reason for this
> action. Another thought was that older engineers were not talented enough
> because they were old.
>
> My questions for you is:
>
> 1) Should this sort of action be legal?
>
> 2) Do you consider the type of measurement I made be considered a quota?
>
> I certainly see the problems inherent in quotas. I don't support quotas.
> However, I have a hard time accepting the proposition that if we just don't
> look everything will be fine. My personal suggestion is to look to where
> affirmative action has been implemented with unprecedented success both in
> achieving the goals of affirmative action and in achieving the goals of the
> organization itself and see what we can learn from that.
>
> Dan M.
>
Dan, why can't we all agree that it was wrong, and accept that quanifying the
wrongness is not allways a simple task, but tht the human mind is capable of
recognizing the wrongness. You don't need numbers to show that it is wrong
when it is so very clear.
=====
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Jan William Coffey
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