On Sat, 8 May 2004 16:10:51 -0500, Dan Minette <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Julia Thompson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > To: "Killer Bs Discussion" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Sent: Friday, May 07, 2004 10:43 PM > Subject: Re: Disturbing evidence of torture > > > > I missed what happened today. �What did Kennedy do? > > > > Julia > > I forgot to mention one interchange. �Kennedy said that Rumsfeld et. al. > knew of the abuses from Red Cross reports and did nothing. �Rumsfeld took > exception to this. �Technically, Rumsfeld was correct. �In reality, there > was a small, and tremendously inadaquate response, not no response. Yes, a one paragraph press release - we are investigating reports of abuse. ... > Trying to piece things together, it appears that the assumption that > Americans are so naturally good that abuse is impossible underlied the > planning. �Anyone who accepted the facts that Gautam so clearly showed > would never have put understaffed undertrained, virtually unsupervised > guards on an overcrouded prison, asked them to prepare prisoners for > questioning, and expected the prisoners to be properly treated. �It boggles > the mind. The Red Cross, three generals, �David Kay, Bremer, numerous Iraqi's, the press in the U.K. were all repeatedly reporting problems, which were ignored. I think you are minimizing the extent this was military intelligence policy done with the approval of higher-ups. The Pentagon, meaning the GOP political appointees, approved of the tough questioning tactics in Gitmo and Iraq and Afghanistan - despite as General Taguba said, estimating that something like 60% of the folks in detention were innocent. http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A11017-2004May8.html http://www.newyorker.com/fact/content/ Systemic Failures, not isolated individuals 'Cooks and drivers were working as interrogators' Many of the prisoners abused at the Abu Ghraib prison were innocent Iraqis picked up at random by US troops, and incarcerated by under-qualified intelligence officers, a former US interrogator from the notorious jail told the Guardian. Torin Nelson, who served as a military intelligence officer at Guantanamo Bay before moving to Abu Ghraib as a private contractor last year, blamed the abuses on a failure of command in US military intelligence and an over-reliance on private firms. He alleged that those companies were so anxious to meet the demand for their services that they sent "cooks and truck drivers" to work as interrogators. . . There is no evidence of abuses on the scale of Abu Ghraib being committed at Guantanamo Bay, but Mr Nelson said that like the Iraqi jail, it was packed with innocent people, who are only now being released. More reports from the UK press of sexual psychological abuse in Gitmo on my news site. http://elemming2.blogspot.com > The intertwined sins of management by wishfull thinking and denial of > reality seems to have been at the heart of this. �It seems more and more > obvious that, while the war itself was managed very well, the peace > aftwards was significantly bungled. �It isn't surprising: people do what > they believe in much better than what they don't believe in. �From the > start, Bush didn't believe in nation building. �We went into Iraq assuming > we'd win (which we did very well), we'd walk in as liberators (which sorta > happened...opinions were split), and the exile leaders who've been > whispering in our years would quickly form a temporary government that > would lead to quick elections, and a democracy that would be a great US > ally. > > Just like my old company, those who had experience and understanding of the > real challanges were dismissed as naysayers. �State was virtually shut out, > the general who had a more realistic assessment of the requirements of > post-victory Iraq was pushed out of the loop after stating realistic > requirements. �The financial cost of the post-war period was also > denied...remember when it was all to be paid out of the increased oil > revenue? > > Even now, State is being shut out of the loop. �One day Powell tells the > Black Caucus there will be no request for additional funds for Iraq, the > next day there is a request for 25 billion. > > Dan M. Except that the $25 billion is just immediate needs - a bigger supplemental request is expected after the election. I had no problem with the Democratic questioning, except for Sore Lieberman who should have run as Bush's VP. Rumsfeld was evasive and testy. Gary #1 on google for liberal news _______________________________________________ http://www.mccmedia.com/mailman/listinfo/brin-l
