>Does that mean my skin doesn't exist, or is only as real in the same >way a whirlpool is real?
It means that seeing your skin as some kind of permanent continuous thing is a fallacy. The skin you had twenty years ago was real and the skin you have now is real, but they are not the same thing. It is only a linguistic convention and function of memory in the brain that make them seem that way. What is not real is the idea that there is something called "my skin" which is continuous through time despite constantly changing. The same thing with conciousness. Brain cells are a little less transitory (on the time scale of a human life) than skin cells, and the patterns laid down in our brains as memory endure (although anyone who has ever discussed their childhood with a sibling or parent, or even re-read an old diary, should know how changeable our memories really are -- they are constantly revised), but conciousness is a process, not a thing. Imagine if I said, my heart was beating twenty years ago and my heart is beating now, therefore there must be some thing calle d a "heat-beat" that is continuous through time. But of course a "heart-beat" is not a thing, it's the ongoing working of the heart, in the same way conciousness is the ongoing working of the brain. If the heart stops working, the heartbeat is gone. If the brain stops working -- and I'm as sure of this as I am of anything in the world -- conciousness stops. I see no reason why it should be any different than any other biological process. Over a long enough time span, everything is like the whirlpool -- a temporary form with no fixed, permanent substance. Buddha called it "the coming into being and passing away of all things." Olin ----- Original Message ----- From: Mauro Diotallevi<mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: Killer Bs (David Brin et al) Discussion<mailto:[email protected]> Sent: Monday, October 27, 2008 12:08 PM Subject: Re: New Creationist Ploy On Sat, Oct 25, 2008 at 11:06 PM, Olin Elliott <[EMAIL PROTECTED]<mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>> wrote: >>Surely the "I" that perceives is something. Just because it can't exist >>outside a brain, doesn't mean it isn't real. > > > Its real in the same way that a whirlpool is real -- it has a form and appears to be a "thing" even though the matter in it changes every second. It's a temporary pattern with no fixed or permanent substance. I shed skin cells all the time, and they are replaced by new cells. The skin I had 20 years ago is literally not the same skin I have now. Does that mean my skin doesn't exist, or is only as real in the same way a whirlpool is real? And I'm not asking this rhetorically; I really am interested in your take on this. -- Mauro Diotallevi "The number you have dialed is imaginary. Please rotate your phone 90 degrees and try again." _______________________________________________ http://www.mccmedia.com/mailman/listinfo/brin-l<http://www.mccmedia.com/mailman/listinfo/brin-l> _______________________________________________ http://www.mccmedia.com/mailman/listinfo/brin-l
