> Whew, thanks for that, Dan; sorry if I came off as if I was > superior because reading is a priority for me, Dave. I > saw my 9 year old son, this fathers' day. He wasn't > interested in the soccer or volley balls I got him and just > wanted to play DS Mario, so I spent most of my visitation > giving my thumbs a workout. Maybe I would enjoy it > more if we played Fallout, but his helicopter mother would > never allow it. What I really would like to see is my > son reading the juvenile Heinlein books I tried to interest > him him but he says reading is boring. He prefers to > spend his time watching cartoons and playing video > games. When I was his age, I played baseball until it > was too dark to see. > Jon
> I think the one who owes an apology is me: I am more > ambivalent about my own and my son's gaming than I let on. > I'm delighted that, through gaming, Ryan has developed an > interest (and no small skill) in programming. He's learned > enough Lua (the language used to modify "Garry's Mod", an > open-ended physics engine "game") to have fans of his work. > I'm less delighted that it's like pulling teeth to get him > to engage in much of anything else, including school. > Like you, at his age, I was on my bike from sun-up 'til > the street lights came on, bashing around with my one good > childhood friend, and I think that there are things he's > missing as a result. > So please accept my apology for putting words in your > mouth. > Dave > Oooh. Garry's Mod is superb sandboxy fun. Hopefully school > contains some computer courses? You're probably right to be > concerned if gaming is done to the exclusion of all else, > but hopefully a guiding hand will maintain enough balance. > Like you, at his age, I was on my bike from sun-up 'til > > the street lights came on, bashing around with my one > good childhood friend, and I think that there are things > he's missing as a result. > I wonder if our memories of childhood are a little > extra-rosy? I used to do a bit of cycling, and run around > Wimbledon Common and go play at friends' houses, and go to > the zoo or museum, and play computer games, or be in the > yard with radio-control cars. I think we all mixed things up > a lot. Even these days, one weekend I'm in the garden Doing > Battle with the weeds and evil grass, another I'm doing a > 160km bike ride, another I'm out at the footy (Aussie > Rules/Rugby Union/Association Football depending on the > precise weekend?) or hiding in front of the fire playing a > game on the laptop or watching a movie. > Also, "When I was a lad, I spent my evenings coding > online-worlds and communicating with people all over the > planet, and my son seems to spend his days doing > thingthathasntbeeninventedyetin2012 and I think he's > missing out?" Maybe? :-) > I think one of the most important things growing up is to > have parents who both take an interest in what we do enjoy > and encourage us to try new things. If there's a bit more of > the former it's not the end of the world. > Charlie. > > Also, "When I was a lad, I spent my evenings coding > online-worlds and communicating with people all over the > planet, and my son seems to spend his days doing > $thingthathasntbeeninventedyetin2012 and I think he's > missing out?" Maybe? :-) > Yes, yes, and HELL YES! > I've been trying to formulate this as well as you did for > the duration of this thread. I was going to go backwards: > "When I was a boy, I spent my evenings banging rocks > together to make sharp spear and burning the meat of my prey > with fire. But look at kids today, using this newfangled > 'language' to 'talk' to each other. I think they're missing > out on the simple joys of basic survival." > > I think one of the most important things growing up is > to have parents who both take an interest in what we do > enjoy and encourage us to try new things. If there's a bit > more of the former it's not the end of the world. > Very true, and if I fail as a parent, it is in showing too > much interest in the world my son inhabits, rather than > following the model of generations past and bending him to > my will! > Dave > My wife and I, and our grown children, have talked about > how we (and in general our generation) have fallen short > as parents. One thing has stood out: the emphasis on > following one's dreams without the counterpoint of having > a very good plan B when one's dreams do not pan out. It's > fine to want to be an actor, a musician, a writer, but one > should not count on earning one's income that way. Back > in our day, a liberal arts major could find a good job in > business just by being one of a relatively small number > that were well educated. And, with college costs far > lower than now, they were not as burdened with student loans. > When I grew up, I heard Great Depression stories thousands > of times. My wife and I are professional, we had no horror > stories of bad economic times when we were kids, and we didn't > impress on our kids to think seriously on what happens when > things don't turn out well. Now, even if we improve income > inequality, the reality is that productivity improvements > mean that fewer workers are needed. For example, American > manufacturing is producing more goods than ever, with a > smaller workforce. And, we have not had a black swan > innovation that creates millions of jobs (e.g. the automobile, > the radio, the computer) in decades. The last big job burst > was the proliferation of PC applications around 1998-1999. > I've plotted job growth from 1939 until now, and you can get > a good fit from 1939 to 2000, with recessions and recoveries > clearly showing as deviations from this pattern. Since 2000, > there has been a clear falloff, so we now have over 30% fewer > jobs than we would if that trend has continued. > I really regret not preparing my kids for a world in which > they have to face hard realities. > Dan M. I missed the boat on gaming because of the generation gap, but it's not too late!~) I often feel lost in the brave new world of interactive gaming, iPods, iPhones, iPads and the World Wide Web. I wore a coonskin cap and grew up on various army bases in Hawaii, Japan, Washington and Texas. I missed out on the the skateboard and Frisbee fads and had my first transistor radio when I was in the Navy. It's very important to be literate in the electronic interface and to avoid the dangers in the world that I never had to face. I'm glad I missed out on some of that and disappointed at how science fiction became reality. The developed 1st world nations had our golden age and now it's time for the rest of the world to catch up, but at what cost to a sustainable planet? I'm sure much of my childhood and adolescence are colored by nostalgic memories of wading in Clover Crick, swinging from Tarzan swings into the bayou, eating fruit from bushes and trees, and running through fields of dandelions (that last is Ray Bradbury's!~). My parents who drank and smoked with no thought about the consequences, who felt that "children should be seen and not heard", and "spare the rod and spoil the child". I had to earn my keep. I resented my parents and only want their approval. My dad discouraged me from reading SF and said it was escapist fiction. I dreamed of the kind of mobile devices we take for granted today. If I failed as a parent, it is in NOT showing enough interest in the world my sons inhabit, and in following the model of my parents in bending my eldest to my will. I have no say in how my youngest son is raised, but his mother is wealthy enough that he won't have to worry about finding a career. Jon _______________________________________________ http://box535.bluehost.com/mailman/listinfo/brin-l_mccmedia.com
