In some areas of the world such as Canada the use of the word engineer in a certification or title waves a red flag in the face of Professional Engineers. After over 30 years of battling with them in another profession I have learned that it is pointless to attempt to reason with them. They cost one organisation I belonged to thousands of dollars to implement a name change of the organisation. The current theme they have is anyone working on systems or software of any description in Canada should either be Professional Engineer (read University degree in engineering or applied science) or working under their direct supervision. Canada is not the only country that has that issue going on, many other countries in the world are also having similar battles over the word. If they as a group wish to be so much of a "Dog in the Manger" or anal over the use of a word, frankly it is not worth the fight, time or energy to hassle with them. Norm
-----Original Message----- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Martin Sent: Monday, September 12, 2005 12:22 PM To: [email protected] Subject: Re: [BSDCert] BSD certs - naming and content On Monday 12 September 2005 09:08, Tillman Hodgson wrote: > On Mon, Sep 12, 2005 at 09:08:51AM -0500, Martin wrote: > > If you are only going to do Two exams, then:- > > > > Junior level either:- > > > > BSD System Administrator > > BSD Server Administrator > > > > Senior level either:- > > > > BSD System Engineer > > BSD Server Engineer > > You won't be able to use a designation with the word "engineer" in the > title in some countries. For that reason I'd avoid it. Really...almost everywhere I have been and read about recognises the distinction between a 'degreed Engineer' and an IT brand-certification-engineer knowing that the IT engineer engineers (creates) the server, network or whatever. Novell certified Network Engineer Certified Novell Engineer Master certified Novell Engineer Cerified Banyan Engineer Compaq accredited systems Engineer Certified unicenter Engineer Microsoft certified systems Engineer Ever heard of them ? > I do prefer the word "system" to "server" as it aligns better with the > work that SAGE is doing to standardize the terminology. Words have meanings. Some are context specific like 'engineer'. System denotes a bunch of components. Useful if you wanted to amalgamate network/server/workstation (or desktop) into one. Being accurate is important. If people can't differentiate between a 'degreed engineer' and an IT certified engineer that is pretty poor but the fix is to change it eg. specialist or expert > I see both the junior and the senior level cert as being about system > administration, albeit at different levels of complexity. Nobody wants a > cert with the name "junior" in the title but "BSD System Administrator, > level 1" or "level 2" (as the LPI has done) seems to be both accurate in > description and acceptable to those attempting to get the > certification. > > -T I never liked junior either. I would still like there to be Three core groups a) administrator (server) - minimum knowledge level - looks after the servers that have already been installed/configured/tested by the 'expert' - adds/deletes/modifies users, email, mailing lists, web pages, basic X etc. assists and learns from the expert etc. b) expert (server) - selects hardware, configures lvm, raid, selects and installs applications, security audits, backup configuration/planning, medium level X etc. c) Workstation/Desktop expert - High level X, window managers, works with users on notebook/server issues, sound, graphics, USB devices, printers, everything to do with installing, maintaining, fixing and upgrading workstations/desktops etc. I really hope these discussions crystalise into 'real world' certs. The larger the organization, the more these tasks are split due to workload and even though there are overlaps, we need clear, precise objectives for BSD certifications. Basically we need to be innovative and be better than the current certs. So many I have studied, have design, which is an engineering function, in at the most basic level where commands, command options, application knowledge, and support of users is the core critical need for an administrator. Feel free to critique :-) Regards...Martin _______________________________________________ BSDCert mailing list [email protected] http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/bsdcert -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.344 / Virus Database: 267.10.21/96 - Release Date: 9/10/2005 -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.344 / Virus Database: 267.10.21/96 - Release Date: 9/10/2005 _______________________________________________ BSDCert mailing list [email protected] http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/bsdcert
