Hey, I passed one of those 'expert' exams, the Nortel Passport Frame-Relay exam... was like the CCIE, but without the difficulty.
I asked the proctor to clarify a question and she showed me how to do it... Yeah, I treasure that one... To be honest, I do actually have some skills. I have deployed Exchange 2007 UM, I have deployed quite a few AD forests in my day... I even did our companies (mostly cuz I was annoyed by the person who did it and redid it....)... I configured our Firewalls (ASA 5510 with CSC at head-end 5505's everywhere else), I installed a pair of 3524s to replace an out of contract 3560... (being replaced in 10-day warranty) I know how to configure a switch, I know how to route... Yes, I am not a programmer, but I can do IPCC scripting (designed and implemented quite a few call centers...) I can write a SOW, a BOM and PCR... I know that that FXO didn't show up because he stuffed it in a router without DSPs (or the lines are ground start and they threw away the little grounding connector for the router...) Jonathan On Fri, Sep 4, 2009 at 8:42 PM, Michael Ciarfello<[email protected]> wrote: > You are both right. CCIE is the cream of the crop certification across all > vendors (Microsoft, Novell (past), HP, Linux, etc, etc, etc. Bay Networks > tried to have a CCIE-like exam in the mid 90's where there was a practical. > They're gone now. Avaya (the number 2 IPT vendor in the world?) I believe > still has some kind of cert. Who wants that? Shoretel? lol. Shoretel is > for traditional PBX techs that embraced change. So yes, CCIE is still the > most sought after certification. It's skills are useful in other vendor's > warez. A Cisco R&S CCIE should have no problems configuring an Extreme > switch, etc. > > On the other hand, the cheater sites and cheaters have taken a BIG dent out > of the intregrity of the exam. I think Cisco has corrected this in the > latest revs and it might be on the way up again. > > The third hand (hey, I'm weird, but I can type MUCH faster) I have heard > from multiple people of whom I regard that certifications in general are > becoming less and less important. Companies are looking for experience > (already discussed.) What I would like to add is to be claimed as an > expert, you should also know how to write (as in a Scope of Work, a testing > plan, an implementation plan, a change order, a presentation, etc, etc, > etc) > > An expert also should know how to call out parts and determine > compatibility. You are on the job and are short one FXO port. A customer > says, here, I have this VIC-2FXO. You put it in the 3845 and it doesn't > work. How about you are asked to install 1,000 more phones and the customer > has two 7825 servers. > > Our company has turned down many a CCIE becasue they had ZERO skill in > writing scope of works, pre-sales, some project management, etc. It's just > a skill we look for. These multi-facated skills are what more and more > companies are looking for. > > Don't forget that IPT Is changing FAST. Last year it was dialtone and IPT. > This year it's Unified Communications with phones, handheld devices, > presence, mobility, etc. Take a look at the Cisco products. Now we have > Phone Proxy--You have to know firewalls (ASA). CUMA also needs firewall. > Conferencing and web collaboration (MeetingPlace, third party video > endpoints and systems such as Tandberg, Polycom, etc.) Pretty soon there > might not be any more MCS servers. VMWare and blade computing (what's the > new Cisco data center product there???) you will have to know about in order > to even install these products. 3750's and 6500's are becoming VSS switches > and Nexus switches. You can't expect to have 500 people come into a project > so each person does his/her slice of the pie. Or to troubleshoot something > simple. Project would never end waiting for all those skill-sets or getting > more than one skill-set onsite at the same time. > > Switching: VSS and Nexus. Voice CCIE exam doesn't even deal with something > simple like VTP. I need another switch for all these VG224's. Here, use > this switch. It was undermy desk. Yea thanks, no problem. I setup a 3750 on > the CCIE test. > > Routing: becasue customers have MPLS today and who here knows how to work > with BGP? Access Lists, Distribution lists, how come the IP phones can't > communicate with the remote site? Ping doesn't even work. > > Microsoft: OCS anyone? More advanced Active Directory? > > Conferencing: MeetingPlace, third party endpoints, etc. > > Hey, security wants to be able to talk to person X on their handhelds. > Radio over IP anyone? (IPICS) Heavy Multicast usage. And I see people on > these forums cry about getting Multicast Moh working. > > The silos we all used to play in are now melting down into one big pot and > we better know how to cook with all those ingredients. > ________________________________ > From: [email protected] > [[email protected]] On Behalf Of Nara Shikamaru > [[email protected]] > Sent: Friday, September 04, 2009 7:16 PM > To: Wayne Lawson > Cc: [email protected] > Subject: Re: [OSL | CCIE_Voice] Passed, thanks! > > No, he's right, it doesn't make someone an expert. No method of training > can prepare people for the real world like . . . the real world! Experience > is king. I work with an Engineer at Cisco who is, in fact, a CCIE . . . in > R&S. His specialty today is in IPCC Enterprise, he's not CCIE Voice and I > can't think of anyone I would rather speak with when it comes to call > centers. It's clear when we talk that he not only has a strong command of > voice applications and call centers but he also understands the appropriate > application of the technology when it comes to organizations. He gets it > because he's done it. No education or training in the world can beat > experience, Ivy League schools can't teach a person to be an effective > professional, high schools and colleges can't prepare people for > everything. Education and training is the best start to any worthwhile > endeavor. But that's all it is; a start. > > On Thu, Sep 3, 2009 at 8:03 PM, Wayne Lawson <[email protected]> > wrote: >> >> Erwan - you don't think the CCIE is the "expert" of networking.....are you >> nuts?....Do you not understand the IT industry?.... >> >> Regards, >> Wayne A. Lawson II - CCIE #5244 >> Founder & President - IPexpert, Inc. >> Mailto: [email protected] >> Mobile: +1.810.334.1564 >> :: Message sent from iPhone. >> On Sep 3, 2009, at 10:45 PM, Erwan Erwan <[email protected]> wrote: >> >> Hi Jon, >> >> Congrats, definitely I understand your feeling , when u have to passed >> with hard work compare to those that cheat the lab. >> >> Just my opinion looking at the situation in my company on what we >> see about CCIE >> >> I do not really agree if CCIE cert is the expert/doctorate in networking, >> cause it more to config and troubleshoot for the cisco equipments. And i >> think that is the reason Cisco create it beside the marketing behind it :) >> >> And I meet lots out there with 20 years exp , even without CCNA , got the >> skills and knowledge beyond CCIEs, like understanding the protocol and work >> on multiplaform for voice. Sometimes those guy can solve the issue better >> than TAC cause they hv more comprehensive knowledge. >> >> Just opinion :) >> >> Thks, >> >> >> --- On Thu, 9/3/09, Jonathan Charles <[email protected]> wrote: >> >> From: Jonathan Charles <[email protected]> >> Subject: Re: [OSL | CCIE_Voice] Passed, thanks! >> To: "jeremy co" <[email protected]> >> Cc: [email protected] >> Date: Thursday, September 3, 2009, 2:29 PM >> >> The problem is that there are some integrators that actually do a >> technical interview... Some companies understand the CCIE is >> meaningless and ignore the certification. >> >> I do not. >> >> If you have a CCIE, then I need to CCIE levels of skill. >> >> >> >> Jonathan >> >> On Thu, Sep 3, 2009 at 12:44 AM, jeremy co<[email protected]> wrote: >> > No offence, >> > But IMO you don't need 5 years or whatever years of experience to get >> > CCIE. >> > for being comfortable with lots of issues in the field I agree with you >> > though. CCIE is just an exam, neither proving you have field experience >> > nor >> > knowledge of networking needed for real world project it proves that you >> > understand certain aspect of technology front and back that falls within >> > CCIE exam blueprint.yet acknowledge your troubleshooting skills on those >> > areas. >> > if sb ever went through AAR setup and troubleshooting could answer your >> > question, However cheater's would't be able to answer that. >> > Anyway , I encourage people to start their CCIE journey even if you have >> > zero experience, buy equipment, get hands on , read Docs and I call it >> > experience. you don't have to be in the field to know in and out of >> > working >> > with cisco equipments you already have in your home lab. >> > >> > my 2 cents. >> > >> > Jeremy >> > On Thu, Sep 3, 2009 at 3:10 PM, Jonathan Charles <[email protected]> >> > wrote: >> >> >> >> Just some quick things I wanted to add.... >> >> >> >> >> >> First, take this lab as soon as you can... DO NOT WAIT. >> >> >> >> When Cisco adds DNS, AD, OCS, SIP Providers, T.38 faxing to CUC, VPIM >> >> and a crap load of techs they can't test for yet (missing underlying >> >> infrastructure right now...), this test will become nearly impossible >> >> >> >> <moral high horse> >> >> >> >> Second, I have been doing Cisco VoIP for 5 years now. I started doing >> >> day 2 support for SBC back in 2004. >> >> >> >> I have the CCNP, CCDP, CCSP and I was one of the first few dozen >> >> people to get the CCVP in May of 2005. >> >> >> >> I have been working on CCM since it was called CCM... I consider >> >> myself an expert at dial peers, telco issues, Unity, CallManager (and >> >> CUCM) IPCC, Routing and Switching. >> >> >> >> I took the R&S Lab back in 2003 (failed it and gave up and went to do >> >> voip...)... >> >> >> >> All of that being said, I want everyone to realize that the CCIE is >> >> NOT a beginner's certification. >> >> >> >> I mean to say, that if you have less than 5 years of experience in >> >> voice, you should expect 5 years of pain and suffering before passing. >> >> >> >> The people out there braindumping the exam and passing it with no >> >> skills will never get through a tech interview worth a damn. And they >> >> certainly won't be worth a crap on a customer site. >> >> >> >> I have a tech interview that will annihilate any posers... I do not >> >> ask factoid questions, "What plugs into an FXS?" for example, all of >> >> my questions end with the line, 'walk me through your troubleshooting >> >> procedure...' >> >> >> >> And yes, I have had CCIE R&S's try to get past me who didn't know why >> >> OSPF wouldn't come up when a DS3 was terminating a bunch of DS1s. And >> >> I have had CCIE Voice's try to get past me who couldn't answer this >> >> question...: >> >> >> >> "You have a remote office, Automatic Alternate Routing is implemented >> >> correctly. During a WAN outage, calls are not rerouting to the PSTN, >> >> walk me through your troubleshooting procedure." >> >> >> >> Yes, the question is mean, yes, the question is unfair and YES, a >> >> customer once asked me why calls didn't reroute during a WAN outage. >> >> >> >> >> >> The next time someone tells you that you should cheat on the exam, ask >> >> them the above question, see if they can answer it, see if they could >> >> handle the normal onslaught of customer questions when you have to >> >> explain the limitations and features of Cisco products. >> >> >> >> </moral highhorse> >> >> >> >> Party on. >> >> >> >> >> >> Jonathan >> >> >> >> On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 11:46 PM, Jonathan Charles<[email protected]> >> >> wrote: >> >> > OK, took it on Tuesday and passed version 3.0 in RTP... my number is >> >> > 25309 >> >> > >> >> > So, that is done, one less thing. >> >> > >> >> > Here is how I did it.... >> >> > >> >> > A lot of people post things about how they studied and studied, yeah >> >> > I >> >> > did that. >> >> > >> >> > I did two things. >> >> > >> >> > I built an exact rack of the lab, here is what it was: >> >> > >> >> > Three DL380 G3s, CUCM Pub, Sub and UCCX 7. >> >> > CUPS and CUC ran on VMWare... >> >> > >> >> > HQ had a Cisco 3750-24PS and a 2821 with a VWIC-1MFT-T1 and a WIC-1T >> >> > with Three PVDM sticks: a 32, a 48 and a 64 (don't ask...) >> >> > >> >> > SiteB (BR1 for IPExpert labs) was a 2811 with a VWIC-1MFT-T1, a >> >> > HWIC-4ESW and a WIC-1T with two PVDM sticks and 16 and a 48 >> >> > >> >> > SiteC (BR2) was a 2821 with a VWIC-2MFT-E1, an NME-CUE, a >> >> > -HWIC-9-ESW-D and two PVDM 64s >> >> > >> >> > Phones were four 7965s, one 7971, two 7961s. >> >> > >> >> > For the PSTN Router, I used a 3750 with an NM-4T, NM-32A/S, a >> >> > VWIC-2MFT-T1 and VWIC-2MFT-E1 and an AIM-VOICE-30, the PSTN phone was >> >> > a 7960. >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > I then got the IPExpert stuff, watched the videos, and read thru the >> >> > labs. >> >> > >> >> > I used the audio bootcamp to write a book for the lab (this was for >> >> > V2), it was 390 pages long with screen shots on how to do everything >> >> > in CallManager 4.1, Unity 4.0 and IPCC 4.0, with detailed step by >> >> > step >> >> > guides to do everything on a Cisco router for voice. >> >> > >> >> > I then updated it for v3 by adding a section for CUPS, CUC and >> >> > updating every page for the v3 test. There are sceeenshots for the >> >> > CUE, for CCME, for everything... I even walk you through script >> >> > creation... >> >> > >> >> > I then read the book over and over, used it as a reference guide for >> >> > my labs, configured everything I could think of, if it wasn't in the >> >> > book, it got added... I had the thing at work with me everywhere I >> >> > went, if I ran into something scary at work, it went in the book.... >> >> > I >> >> > re-read it over and over, checking for errors, proofing it, fact >> >> > checking every word... adding jokes... >> >> > >> >> > It is now 760 pages and two volumes (it was crashing Word)... >> >> > >> >> > Just to preempt this... It is not for sale, it is not for sharing... >> >> > it contains craploads of copyrighted info from IPexpert, Internetwork >> >> > Expert, CCBootcamp and Cisco (stolen info from Networkers slides) >> >> > basically just a tome of data. >> >> > >> >> > Here is why it is not for sale or for sharing. >> >> > >> >> > To get the effect I got, you need to write this book yourself, I >> >> > recommend that everyone do so.... use something to start, I recommend >> >> > NOT using a written source (you will just copy and paste)... the >> >> > audio >> >> > bootcamps are perfect for this... you can use it as a framework for >> >> > notes and then flesh out your sections.... >> >> > >> >> > The CCIE is considered the doctorate in internetworking... I wrote my >> >> > thesis and defended it yesterday. >> >> > >> >> > Good luck. >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > Jonathan >> >> > >> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> For more information regarding industry leading CCIE Lab training, >> >> please >> >> visit www.ipexpert.com >> > >> > >> _______________________________________________ >> For more information regarding industry leading CCIE Lab training, please >> visit www.ipexpert.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> For more information regarding industry leading CCIE Lab training, please >> visit www.ipexpert.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> For more information regarding industry leading CCIE Lab training, please >> visit www.ipexpert.com >> > > > > -- > -Shikamaru > > _______________________________________________ > For more information regarding industry leading CCIE Lab training, please > visit www.ipexpert.com > > _______________________________________________ For more information regarding industry leading CCIE Lab training, please visit www.ipexpert.com
