Chris: I sincerely hope you are right. I am sticking to my previous "wait and see" position, regardless. So far, yes the words ( mostly ) sound good. And, yes, this is less than 1/2 year of the new admin. But all, is not well , therefore I can't be as optimistic as I'd like to be So far, while the jury hasn't even gone to its chambers let alone anything else, nonetheless the adage applies, the "jury is still out."
Billy ------------------------------------------------------- In a message dated 6/7/2009 7:03:29 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time, [email protected] writes: Billy, I agree with your analysis and insight but I am more optimistic. I think that there is a good chance that the sins of omission you addressed will eventually appear as action issues, and I am still hopeful. And thanks for the tidbit about the shores of Tripoli. Chris ____________________________________ From: [email protected] [mailto:centr [email protected]] On Behalf Of [email protected] Sent: Sunday, June 07, 2009 7:55 PM To: [email protected] Subject: Re: [RC] Obama in Egypt David: So far, government by poetry. It all sounds good, but where's the substance ? Then there are all those sins of omission. Christians in the Mid East don't merit even a mention, let alone serious consideration for their ( besieged ) position. Hindus don't count, which is pointed out since, except for Iraq in 2004-2007, there have been more Muslim terrorist attacks against Hindus in India / Kashmir than all other terrorist incidents combined, year after year, since the late 1940s. Lebanon doesn't seem to count, either, nor Sudan. Lotsa talk about democracy but who does Hussein visit FIRST ? Why the Saudis, of course, a fascistic monarchy. Etc, etc, plus playing games with history. OK. sure, Jefferson did what he could to establish normal relations with some Muslim states, but much of that was in reaction to the Barbary pirates who were capturing US ships and imprisoning American citizens, hence the need to go to war, albeit small scale, but not so small that it didn't require the founding of the Marine Corps ( form the halls of Montezuma to the shores of Tripoli ). The poetry does sound nice, but , for one, I am getting rather impatient about lack of realistic policy. I think you nailed it. Realism ? What's that ? What, me worry ? Well, its still too soon to have a decent feeling of certainty about the new admin, but to date I am less and less hopeful. Billy =========================================== In a message dated 6/7/2009 2:26:39 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time, [email protected] writes: Actually, the lack of religious tolerance by Muslims makes me feel the opposite of hopeful. In the Koran, Jews and infidels basically deserve death for existing. Makes one wonder why Allah bothered to create them. It is OK for an Islamic believer to lie to Jews and Infidels according to the Koran; therefore, who says that we can trust anyone in the religion? So, good speech, hopeful speech. Realistic? Not quite as much. David “There is no difference between communism and socialism, except in the means of achieving the same ultimate end: communism proposes to enslave men by force, socialism - by vote. It is merely the difference between murder and suicide.”--Ayn Rand Chris Hahn wrote: Thanks Billy. I appreciate your analysis. It makes me feel somewhat hopeful. I agree, we will wait and see what happens. Chris ____________________________________ From: [email protected]_ (mailto:[email protected]) [_mailto:[email protected]_ (mailto:[email protected]) ] On Behalf Of [email protected]_ (mailto:[email protected]) Sent: Friday, June 05, 2009 8:13 PM To: [email protected]_ (mailto:[email protected]) Subject: [RC] Obama in Egypt Chris : Sorry not to reply sooner but I was in the midst of preparing a lecture for the U of O. Nothing to do with Islam, it was about the pathology of homosexuality, etc. Just concluded a couple of hours ago. Went well despite some disagreements from homosexuals in attendance. I was thinking, though, as I worked on the lecture, that this would have been a better week to have given a talk about Islam. I studied parts of the speech especially. But not in the kind of depth that is possible for me, since I simply didn't have the time. But two things stood out and deserve at least some comment. Obama insisted on freedom of choice in religion. Well, OK, an excellent thing to say. But does he understand the implications ? For is he actually means what he said, then can we look forward to churches in Saudi Arabia and new synagogues in Yemen ? That is, I completely agree with the sentiment but allow me to be skeptical about the reality of this anytime soon. Why ? Simply because there has never been a majority Muslim state that allowed freedom of religion -EVER. The other issue to comment on ( several merit discussion but maybe later ) is women's rights . Again, I could not agree more with the sentiment, but as for realism, uhhhh, doesn't Obama understand the obvious ? He is asking for major revision to the Qur'an. With the dust settling I expect any number of Muslim high mucky-mucks to criticize the speech on this point, strongly, since it is so contrary to all traditional schools of Qur'an interpretation. Lastly, what did he say of substance about Israel and the Palestinians ? Substance. His remarks were a sort of gesture, good cop, bad cop in style, but utterly devoid of any kind of concrete program of action. The long and short of it, I agreed with , say, 5 points out of seven, but must ( must ) take a wait-and-see approach since, so far, it is rhetoric and nothing else. Hopefully the 5 good points will prove to be more than well intentioned sentiments, but I can only guess if Obama desires to actually do anything real. Billy ____________________________________ _______________________________________________ Centroids mailing list: [email protected]_ (mailto:[email protected]) _http://radicalcentrism.com/mailman/listinfo/centroids_radicalcentrism.com_ (http://radicalcentrism.com/mailman/listinfo/centroids_radicalcentrism.com) Archives at _http://radicalcentrism.org/pipermail/centroids_radicalcentrism.com/_ (http://radicalcentrism.org/pipermail/centroids_radicalcentrism.com/) _______________________________________________ Centroids mailing list: [email protected] http://radicalcentrism.com/mailman/listinfo/centroids_radicalcentrism.com Archives at http://radicalcentrism.org/pipermail/centroids_radicalcentrism.com/ _______________________________________________ Centroids mailing list: [email protected] http://radicalcentrism.com/mailman/listinfo/centroids_radicalcentrism.com Archives at http://radicalcentrism.org/pipermail/centroids_radicalcentrism.com/
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