Well, if it ever evolves to "Do whatever you want to yourself, but leave others alone" then the problem will really be fixed ;-)
> -----Original Message----- > From: Jerry Johnson [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] > Sent: Monday, March 04, 2002 2:04 PM > To: CF-Community > Subject: RE: Israel vs. Palestinian escalation > > > I didn't mean there is enforcement of the "isn't allowed > anymore" rule. > > But even those groups transgressing the rule for the most > part acknowledge > it. And they scream the moment they are transgressed against. > > But looking back a century, I think we have changed. > > (Not truly changed, but a thin coating of civilization that > overrides most > of our less social instincts.) > > Here in the US, our outlook used to be: "Do whatever you > want, but leave > us alone." > Then it became "Do whatever you want, but leave our friends alone." > Then "Do whatever you want inside your own borders, but leave your > neighbors alone." > Now it is becoming "Do whatever you want to your own people, > but leave > your minorities alone." > > We are not good at it yet, or even consistant in our > application of the > rule, and still let those with big bucks get away with too > much, and those > with no bucks too little, but I think we do learn. > > Maybe I'm deceiving myself, but I really do have hope for the next > generation. > Jerry Johnson > > > > >>> [EMAIL PROTECTED] 03/04/02 04:11PM >>> > Jerry- > > nope, list's not broken > (so where is everybody?) > > gotta disagree with your "isn't allowed anymore" premise when > so much of > it > is going on. > think it's more quickly publicized after the fact and that's good - > can't just happen in the darkness, but it IS happening. > > we (humanity) haven't really changed when we keep perpetrating these > atrocities. > is there an answer? > I sure don't have one... > > -Ben > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Jerry Johnson [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] > > Sent: Monday, March 04, 2002 12:35 PM > > To: CF-Community > > Subject: RE: Israel vs. Palestinian escalation > > > > > > Geez, > > > > Did I break the list? > > > > Jerry Johnson > > > > >>> [EMAIL PROTECTED] 03/04/02 02:27PM >>> > > To interject a brief note of optimism, > > > > I think it is great that we care! > > > > It is a new development in the world that we (we meaning this list > > which > > is represented by many cultures around the globe) hear about > > these kind > > of > > problems around the world, and that it disturbs us enough to > > spend/waste > > > > our time talking about it. > > > > I think it is a fairly short step until this kind of > > sectarian violence > > just isn't tolerated in the world community. > > > > For example, I think a massacre like Srebrenica or Rowanda or Iraqi > > Kurds > > are less likely today than 10 years ago, and will be less likely to > > occur > > 20 years from now. > > > > Some people here in the U.S. think this is a sign of a "World > > Government", > > > > I think it is more of a sign of the world declaring some stuff just > > isn't > > allowed any more. > > > > As another example, I can not see the kind of secrecy > existing today > > for > > what the Japanese did in WWII with the testing of the plague > > on Chinese > > civilian population (The CDC and WHO would uncover it pretty > > quickly.) > > Or > > the US government covering it up to get a jump on the Russians. > > > > It does not help those on the front lines, but the world > can see and > > feel > > the tragedy in the loss of 10 people in Israel. And the loss > > of 10 dead > > to > > Ebola in Gabon. And the loss of dozens to flash flooding in Bolivia. > > > > And here in the U.S., we feel the tragedy of the loss of each > > individual > > > > America casualty in the "War on Terror". > > > > (A luxury to be sure) > > > > We no longer have to lose hundreds in a ferry accident in > > Indonesia or > > thousands in a week to civil war to rate top line front page news. > > > > I think we really are getting better at this "caring for > > others" thing. > > > > It just takes a while to grow into something better, and all growth > > comes > > in fits and starts. > > > > But I can see a marked difference during each decade of my lifetime. > > > > Jerry Johnson > > > > > > >>> [EMAIL PROTECTED] 03/04/02 12:48PM >>> > > Ben > > > > Yes, its a big problem. Unfortunately it looks like it doesn't get > > solved, > > it just continues... > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Braver, Ben [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] > > Sent: 04 March 2002 17:24 > > To: CF-Community > > Subject: RE: Israel vs. Palestinian escalation > > > > > > Thanks Mark > > > > but a big problem - when you are sure God(s) is/are on your > > side, and have > > been indoctrinated this way since childhood, how does the > > conflict ever > > get > > resolved? All the cease-fires, treaties, "peace-keeping" > > armies, etc. you > > can imagine cannot make someone stop hating someone else, > > when that's what > > they have been taught all their life. > > > > -Ben > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: Mark Smyth [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] > > > Sent: Monday, March 04, 2002 9:20 AM > > > To: CF-Community > > > Subject: RE: Israel vs. Palestinian escalation > > > > > > > > > i'm 100% with you Ben, religion is a convienient way for > > > politicians to hide > > > their real motives for conflict. > > > > > > but it would probably be more depressing if religion was the > > > real reason > > > > > > m > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: Braver, Ben [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] > > > Sent: 04 March 2002 16:57 > > > To: CF-Community > > > Subject: RE: Israel vs. Palestinian escalation > > > > > > > > > Todd- > > > yes, also tragic > > > > > > saw a photo of Muslim woman sitting outside her burned-out > > > home praying > > > (house was torched by Hindu mob) > > > > > > the things like this humans can do to each other disgust me... > > > > > > Israelis (Jews) vs. Palestinians (Muslims) > > > India (Hindu vs. Muslim) > > > Iraq (Sunni Muslim vs. Shiite Muslim) > > > Serbs (Orthodox) vs. Croats (Catholic) vs. Bosnians (Muslims) > > > Northern Ireland (Protestants vs. Catholics) > > > Southern Phillipines (Muslim vs. Catholic) > > > > > > common thread: all of these are painted as *religious* conflicts, > > > but in reality they seem to be about > > > gaining/keeping/increasing political > > > and economic POWER. > > > > > > depressing is an understatement... > > > > > > -Ben > > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > > From: Todd [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] > > > > Sent: Monday, March 04, 2002 8:47 AM > > > > To: CF-Community > > > > Subject: Re: Israel vs. Palestinian escalation > > > > > > > > > > > > How about all of that stuff going on in India? *shakes head* > > > > > > > > Todd > > > > > > > > > So the Palestinians increase the violence of their attacks > > > > on Israeli > > > > > civilian and military targets, thinking Israel will "give" > > > > and end the > > > > > "occupation". > > > > > Rather, the Israelis increase the violence of their > > > > "retaliatory" attacks, > > > > > thinking the Palestinians will "give". > > > > > Each side appears to think more violence will break the > > > > other side's will. > > > > > Instead, it makes each side's resolve even greater. > > > > > > > > > > And neither side is apparently willing to take any of > the blame. > > > > > > > > > > Is there an answer to this other than more and more death? > > > > > Much sadness... > > > > > > > > > > -Ben > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ______________________________________________________________________ Your ad could be here. 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