Loathe wrote:
> If we don't stay and get it stable now we will just have to keep going 
> back as the years progress.

Unfortunately that is what I see now as well.  Pulling out is a short 
term gain with serious long term risk, to try and use the same language 
leading up to this statement.  We will very likely be back in the future 
and it will be magnitudes more costly at that time if we do not stay and 
clean up the mess we created.

Thoughts of discussion in no particular order or grouping:

*  Many of use saw this outcome from day one and is why we objected from 
day one.  We where all dismissed at the time, but here we are exactly 
where we where afraid we would end up.

*  Unfortunately that does not make it right to pull out now and let the 
chips fall where they may.  That can also be very serious and costly .

*  The US public was sold this war based on erroneous information.  If 
these where deliberate errors of omission, or just errors of incomplete 
information is very much up to debate but there there where serious 
errors.  And nobody seems concerned with determining why or how the 
errors came to be and what that means for the future.

*  The this war  was sold and continues to be executed as not affecting 
the average Joe US public unless she is a member of or has a close 
interpersonal connection to military personal.  I.E.  The administration 
is doing there best to create the illusion that this does not, is not 
going to deeply affect every US citizen.

* The cost of this is to protract the war by not putting ALL the effort 
and sacrifice required to get the job done and get it done as soon as 
possible.

I find these thoughts do be very disturbing.


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