I don't care so much about dependencies but whether my code is easy to write and maintain. For me that's about knowing where all the bodies are buried, and by that I mean keeping the number of moving parts to a minimum and not having a lot of scaffolding. That said, CGI::Application trumps most other frameworks because at its heart it's CGI and it's about using subs instead of epic if/else nests. I don't even care if CGI::Application could be smaller in terms of lines of code, because for me it's about being smaller conceptually, and nothing to do with lines of code or memory/disk footprint. Anyway, there's my in-depth analysis -- if anyone likes I can provide a really nice looking chart or something to back up my "data" :D
2009/9/19 P Kishor <[email protected]>: > Very good points Michael. My response to some of them below -- > > On Fri, Sep 18, 2009 at 8:47 AM, Michael Peters <[email protected]> wrote: >> On 09/18/2009 09:33 AM, P Kishor wrote: >>> >>> But, now that we are done >>> comparing our overweight weight to a morbidly obese weight, how about >>> CGI::App on its own? To my completely uninformed mind, loading 40,000+ >>> lines to create a small web page sounds like a lot... and, that >>> doesn't even include the web server and the Perl interpreter! >> >> But that's not what you tested. You tested Titanium which is not CGI::App. >> It's an opinionated framework based on CGI::App and it's plugins. If you >> just want to create something that makes "small web pages" then just load >> CGI::App and it's dependencies. > > Actually, I did not test Titanium (I only invoked it as an example). I > tested my own application that is cobbled together with the various > bits and bobs of CGI::App and various plugins. > > >> >> Also, let's look at those numbers: >> >> DBI - 7824 >> CGI::Simple - 3900 >> >> That's 1/4 of all those lines just right there. And if you're going to use a >> database you need DBI. And if you're going to make a web app you need a CGI >> interface module (like CGI.pm or CGI::Simple) so I don't see a way to remove >> those. >> > > I guess that is what I was trying to get at... one of the things that > many Perl modules (and CGI::App as well) make a big deal about is how > simple scripts are once you use those modules... for example, the oft > quoted example of WebApp.pm and instance script being only a couple of > lines. Well, in reality, all the plumbing is still there, just under a > carpet. > > >> Also, you're counting just raw lines which means you're counting comments >> and whitespace (which penalizes modules which are well commented). I'm not >> saying your criticism isn't valid, I'm just saying that your data is too >> flawed to support that criticism :) > > > Yes, my data are too flawed, but the criticism is still valid. But, > instead of kvetching in the wind, I will actually try an experiment. I > will remove all the comments from the modules that I am using (call > them the "production versions," analogous to the packed/minified > Javascript packages floating around), and even try to squish them into > one file. I am curious as to what I end up with. > > Nevertheless, thanks for indulging with me in this argument. Your > points are very valid. > > >> >> -- >> Michael Peters >> Plus Three, LP >> >> ##### CGI::Application community mailing list ################ >> ## ## >> ## To unsubscribe, or change your message delivery options, ## >> ## visit: http://www.erlbaum.net/mailman/listinfo/cgiapp ## >> ## ## >> ## Web archive: http://www.erlbaum.net/pipermail/cgiapp/ ## >> ## Wiki: http://cgiapp.erlbaum.net/ ## >> ## ## >> ################################################################ >> >> > > > > -- > Puneet Kishor http://www.punkish.org > Carbon Model http://carbonmodel.org > Charter Member, Open Source Geospatial Foundation http://www.osgeo.org > Science Commons Fellow, http://sciencecommons.org/about/whoweare/kishor > Nelson Institute, UW-Madison http://www.nelson.wisc.edu > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- > Assertions are politics; backing up assertions with evidence is science > ======================================================================= > Sent from Madison, WI, United States > > ##### CGI::Application community mailing list ################ > ## ## > ## To unsubscribe, or change your message delivery options, ## > ## visit: http://www.erlbaum.net/mailman/listinfo/cgiapp ## > ## ## > ## Web archive: http://www.erlbaum.net/pipermail/cgiapp/ ## > ## Wiki: http://cgiapp.erlbaum.net/ ## > ## ## > ################################################################ > > ##### CGI::Application community mailing list ################ ## ## ## To unsubscribe, or change your message delivery options, ## ## visit: http://www.erlbaum.net/mailman/listinfo/cgiapp ## ## ## ## Web archive: http://www.erlbaum.net/pipermail/cgiapp/ ## ## Wiki: http://cgiapp.erlbaum.net/ ## ## ## ################################################################
