On Thu, Oct 13, 2005 at 11:53:48AM +0100, Matthew Toseland wrote: > Yodel is to a large degree pseudonymous. We can hold pseudonymous people > accountable to a degree. But as I have explained in my other email, the > traditional model of banking is _not the only way to do it_. A > distributed model can work well enough - even without coinage, virtual > or otherwise.
Sorry, you missed the implication. The only way to do it over I2P is with an actual bank and cyber coinage, and your analysis may well be correct. But even if we can rely on Yodel (on the grounds he gave in an interview, that it is more profitable for him to continue to run the bank than to run off with the cash), it will *always* be vulnerable at the point of exchanging it for real money. On the other hand, you can use a web of trust to do a distributed exchange system. This has been done, probably many times, in the Real World. If this is electronically mediated and has routing, you can make it anonymous. Obviously it will be most difficult to do Real Money over this; it always is. But it would be very easy to exchange LETS hours over it, and it would then be a smallish step to exchange money; it would make the system rather obvious and vulnerable though. Now, whether this is a good idea, I don't know! > > On Thu, Oct 13, 2005 at 07:01:21AM +0000, Polecat wrote: > > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- > > Hash: SHA1 > > > > Both parties can't be simultaneously anonymous. > > > > Consider that Yodel bank has an IP address, founders, maintainers, > > administrators, controllers. All of these people can be found with > > minimal effort from the state, even in our current governments. Yodel, > > and other "anonymous" banks, have the weakness that the bank itself is > > not anonymous. It can't be anonymous. If it were anonymous, you would > > send your money to it, and then it would evaporate and you'd never see > > your money again. > > > > Accountability, anonymity, they don't mix. > > > > Now, that doesn't rule out an anonymous bank. It is technically > > possible to have an anonymous bank. In fact to a degree, most paper > > currency is an anonymous bank. But even bills have serial numbers, and > > the problem with Yodel and such is, once they started succeeding, to > > protect their interests the corporates would require under pain of law > > that the bank, and all banks, keep track of their money. > > > > So, what if someone uses a Yodel account /as/ a bank? Well that doesn't > > work either, because if Yodel gets wind that Yodel2 is not keeping > > records, serial numbers, etc, then Yodel2's account will be frozen under > > pain of law, because the original Yodel will be forced to do so by the > > authorities. > > > > It's a chicken and egg problem. Supposing two anonymous people want to > > transact. One has a transmittable product. The other has anonymous > > e-cash. Who sends their end of the bargain first? That's why we cannot > > hold anonymous people accountable, and therefore cannot participate in > > transactions of money. > > - -- > > polecat - get in touch with your primal ferret > > pgp key at http://polecat.i2p/polecat.asc > > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- > > Version: GnuPG v1.4.1 (GNU/Linux) > > > > iD8DBQFDTf7T9lD1iiB3dSsRAimbAKCheFD/GyPnsSmzIfEEHgP7voY20QCeJzOi > > 9i8Ycjc+lQbVTFW8diVqF2s= > > =OVY9 > > -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- > > _______________________________________________ > > i2p mailing list > > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > http://dev.i2p.net/mailman/listinfo/i2p > > -- > Matthew J Toseland - [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Freenet Project Official Codemonkey - http://freenetproject.org/ > ICTHUS - Nothing is impossible. Our Boss says so. > _______________________________________________ > i2p mailing list > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > http://dev.i2p.net/mailman/listinfo/i2p -- Matthew J Toseland - [EMAIL PROTECTED] Freenet Project Official Codemonkey - http://freenetproject.org/ ICTHUS - Nothing is impossible. Our Boss says so.
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