> BTW who's seen > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Criticism_of_the_APL_programming_language? > It would be better called "The Case Against APL" because like a good > counsel for the prosecution, the author carefully avoids saying > anything which could be construed in its favour. But it covers the > ground.
I have (and I had). Judging by its revision history and its originator, and the Wikipedia contributions of its originator, it was written by someone with a long association to APL, SHARP APL in particular. I have a pretty good idea who it was. ----- Original Message ----- From: Ian Clark <[email protected]> Date: Monday, May 25, 2009 14:26 Subject: [Jchat] No More APL To: Chat forum <[email protected]> > On Mon, May 25, 2009 at 6:51 PM, Joey K Tuttle <[email protected]> > wrote:> ... I am curious what you mean when you say, "[I] > > probably will never write another original APL application. J's > > portability between Windows, Mac and PDA alone sees to that > for me." > > Can you explain to me what you mean by that?? > > I'll try to explain, Joey, without taking too long I hope... > > Ive written a lot of APL in my life. It started in 1973 with > APLSV in > collaboration with IBM ASDD Mohansic (remember it?) and in recent > years has entailed originating and maintaining code in major > commercial products written in Dyalog APL and latterly in > APL+Win -- > and a lot of experience in porting code between the two. Code written > by people who didn't appreciate []ML<-3, or that the []AV's are > devastatingly different, and that the two sets don't overlap. Code > that needs frequent execution of B[a;b;c;d;e...]<-1, where B > is a > massive Boolean and you have (a b c d e ...) as a vector, and don't > want to blow up the ws because the engine converts Boolean to 32-bit > under the cover to implement an indexed assignment... I could go on > and on. > > This was back in the last century, and things may have gotten better > with APL since... but I doubt it's that better. > > You could say I'm heavily invested in APL, from two of its leading > vendors, and not initially inclined to try new-fangled dialects. At > first J gave me the queazy feeling I had when, as an Algol programmer, > I first saw APL back in 1973. > > Well, after less than 10 hours flying time with J, I was able to see > where an awful lot of nasty code could have been avoided. Code which > mopped up most of my work hours, not to mention the weekends preceding > each version release of my product. > > Now I'm retired, but I still haven't given up developing products. > There's TABULA (Vector 20.4) I'm tarting up for the eco market. I'm > prototyping it in APL and was delighted when Dyalog shipped a version > running under Windows Mobile, because that I see as its main platform. > For the customer, I hasten to add -- not for me as developer, because > I don't do ships in bottles. I plan to develop on the Mac from > now on > -- but Dyalog hasn't got a Mac version. Windows had made me my living > for the last 15 years, because it sure makes work for the > working man > to do. But now that I'm working for myself, not on someone else's > time, I don't have to be bothered with its sheer nonsense. > > Also I don't have a spare couple of grand to keep up with the latest > releases of Dyalog APL and APL+Win -- but that's not the key issue > because I could always find a customer to buy me the products I need. > No, the key issue for me is that I've written J code in Windows, > including GUI code, transferred the files to the Mac, also to my HP > iPAQ, an easy matter because they're ASCII txt files and it's > just a > case of moving the dongle... and the app works First Time. > > Now I have a lot of nostalgia for APL. It's a rare expertise -- > not an > easy thing to walk away from. I still have APL code out there to > maintain for clients, so I won't say I'll never write another > line of > APL. But for an original (ie not a heritage) application, J is going > to be my tool of choice. > > Why? For 100 good reasons... > 1. code portability, especially with GUI. > ...The other 99 don't matter. > > On the downside, I have to set-to and learn J in my grey hairs, which > I'm finding truly mind-bending. But on balance, life's too short > to go > on battling with APL, under Windows. > > Ian Clark, aka J Rabbit. > > > BTW who's seen > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Criticism_of_the_APL_programming_language? > It would be better called "The Case Against APL" because like a good > counsel for the prosecution, the author carefully avoids saying > anything which could be construed in its favour. But it covers the > ground. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm
