[CITTERN] Re: Moravian Choralbuch [rights]

Mon, 17 Aug 2009 12:25:16 -0700

In the Storm Ms. you will see the "11" or "||" (two vertical strokes) in some of the pieces. The #2 Menuet, for example, uses that symbol in the second section. 

-- R


On Aug 17, 2009, at 1:59 PM, Stuart Walsh wrote:


Martyn Hodgson wrote:

   Dear Andrew and Stuart,
Having just now looked at the tablature, I wonder if the the instrument intended was in fact the mandora rather than the cittern. Altho' most mid-18thC mandora tunings are similar to the 'spanish' guitar intervals (except mostly for only a tone between 5th and 6th courses) there are a number of sources which require odd tunings - this may be one such. And, of course, Moravia and Bohemia was the birthplace and heartland of the mandora/gallichon - as also witnessed by the quantity of surviving 
   mandora tablatures in monasteries there.
Certainly the tablature looks exactly as other contemporary mandora tablatures but I'm not particularly knowledgable about the cittern of the same date in Moravia/central Europe: was it a common instrument? - 
   more so than the popular mandora?

   Martyn
I haven't seen many mandora tablatures but I agree that this Moravian tablature looks very similar. Couldn't that be just the tablature style of the time and place - whatever the instrument? Does mandora tablature use the little ornament thing that looks like a tiny '11'?
I think evidence for the popularity of the cittern in central Europe is sparse. Some instruments (including arch-citterns) survive and a few tablatures. The 'waldzithern' in Germany and Switzerland didn't take off until after 1800.
I can't remember why the Moravian tablature is attributed to the cittern. Andrew will remind us. But the tuning (or the intervals) for the Moravian tablature is for a known tuning for the cithrinchen/bell cittern.
It's probably not relevant but Rocky Mjos produced an edition of Norwegian cittern pieces for this tuning from the 1790s. And there is a facsimile of one page of the tablature on page 6. 

*http://tinyurl.com/mbf5ex




*
--- On Sun, 16/8/09, Andrew Hartig <cittern2...@theaterofmusic.com> 
   wrote:

     From: Andrew Hartig <cittern2...@theaterofmusic.com>
     Subject: [CITTERN] Re: Moravian Choralbuch [rights]
     To: cittern@cs.dartmouth.edu
     Date: Sunday, 16 August, 2009, 7:51 PM

      I will need to check with Lanie Graf about the rights for
   performance.
I think it may be a semantic issue of what qualifies as "music". I believe the permission should be sought only for the reproduction of the tablature (music) of physical manuscript (e.g. you would need to 
      seek permission if you were to create an edition or include a
      photograph as part of a book).
Let me find out, and sorry for the confusion. Thanks also to all of 
      those who have taken an interest in this music!
      Andrew
      At 01:57 AM 8/16/2009, you wrote:
        Hello Stuart,
That is strange nobody can play a music which is almost 300 years old. In France, at this age, music is public with no more rights". 
        I am probably wrong, but I don't see well the problem.
        Damien
        ----- Original Message ----- From: "Stuart Walsh"
        <[1]s.wa...@ntlworld.com>
        To: "Andrew Hartig" <[2]cittern2...@theaterofmusic.com>
        Cc: <[3]citt...@cs.dartmouth.edu>
        Sent: Saturday, August 15, 2009 11:42 PM
        Subject: [CITTERN] Re: Moravian Choralbuch
        Stuart Walsh wrote:
        Andrew Hartig wrote:
        Dear all,
Some time back Andy Rutherford had told us about a manuscript book 
        (BMB4) in the Moravian Archives of Bethlehem, PA (USA) for
   6-course
cittern, tuned GCEgbe. Andy managed to get over there to take some 
        photos, and after quite a few emails with the folks at the
   Moravian
Archives, I am pleased to announce that Andy's photographs of the 
        book are now available for public download from my web site.
I have compiled all of his photos into a single PDF (25 MB). You 
   can
get to it from the "Music Files" page of the Renaissance Cittern Site, [1][4]http://cittern.theaterofmusic.com/musicfiles/ (scroll 
   down
to the "box" for 18th century music), where perhaps you may also 
        find something else of interest.
Special thanks again to Lanie Graf and all the other fine people 
   of
the Moravian Archives and Andy Rutherford for working together to 
        make this possible!
        -Andrew
Very interesting and a great resource. Thanks Andrew. There's 
   lots
to ponder. For example the funny little 11 sign, which is perhaps 
   an
        ornament.  And these settings include the tune, as sung?
The chorale settings seem (after a quick look) quite full, with voice leading etc. No 40 sounds vaguely familiar. Here's a quick 
        recording on a factory-made Russian guitar, but in the GCEgbe
tuning. A lot of the pieces are in C major, even though the tuning 
        isn't fully chordal.
[2][5]http://www.pluckedturkeys.co.uk/No40.mp3 (deleted - just 
   read
"The manuscript and its music may not be reproduced or published 
        without the consent of the Moravian Archives." Sorry!)
And here's one of the little dance tunes at the end (with a rather 
        glaring mistake in the repeat of the second strain!):
        [3][6]http://www.pluckedturkeys.co.uk/Men3.mp3 (deleted)
        I think it was Rob who said that James Tyler claimed that the
English guitar (guittar) has its origins in Germany. I haven't 
   seen
his (Tyler's) Evora paper. I looked at a link to the Evora papers but it was dead. Anyway, I think Germany is a likely contender for what got makers in Britain going in the 1750s. But the cittern in Germany itself seems not to have got involved in the 'guittar' 
        fashion. And the music that exists (as far as I know) is in
        'old-fashioned' tablature. Boetticher (if I've spelt his name
correctly) mentions some four-course music c.1750s and there's the 
        Bunsold tablature and now this.
        Stuart
        To get on or off this list see list information at
        [4][7]http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
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   References
      1. [8]http://cittern.theaterofmusic.com/musicfiles/
      2. [9]http://www.pluckedturkeys.co.uk/No40.mp3
      3. [10]http://www.pluckedturkeys.co.uk/Men3.mp3
      4. [11]http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
      5. [12]http://www.avg.com/

   --

References
1. http://uk.mc263.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose? to=s.wa...@ntlworld.com 2. http://uk.mc263.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose? to=cittern2...@theaterofmusic.com 3. http://uk.mc263.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose? to=citt...@cs.dartmouth.edu 
   4. http://cittern.theaterofmusic.com/musicfiles/
   5. http://www.pluckedturkeys.co.uk/No40.mp3
   6. http://www.pluckedturkeys.co.uk/Men3.mp3
   7. http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
   8. http://cittern.theaterofmusic.com/musicfiles/
   9. http://www.pluckedturkeys.co.uk/No40.mp3
  10. http://www.pluckedturkeys.co.uk/Men3.mp3
  11. http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
  12. http://www.avg.com/
--------------------------------------------------------------------- --- 


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