----- Original Message ----- From: "David Kilpatrick" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Saturday, December 10, 2005 2:41 PM Subject: [CITTERN] Re: guitar?
> Roger E. Blumberg wrote: > > > > >Bottom line is that the leap from a Signorelli body-style vihuela to a viol, > >a bowed guitar, would justifiably seem great, but there were other players > >on the field, pluckers, with a very different kind of appearance and > >body-shape, yet still being true and actual vihuela and viola, plucked and > >bowed, in Spain and Italy alike (and not only there, quite a few very early > >French examples exist as well, and still others). > > > >I could single-out individual instruments, and point to them in a particular > >sequence, if anyone wants. Let me know. > I thought the sheer size and depth of body of the Signorelli instrument > made it something other than a viola de mano or vihuela. Where the viola > has survived, in Portugal and the Azores, there's nothing remotely as > big as that. The tendency has been to get smaller, not larger, however. > The instrument second left to the 'vihuela' is, unless Signorelli's > studio induced a variation in painting technique, intended to be seen as > very distinct from the large and small lutes on either side of the > vihuela - entirely different body shape, apparently a flat back. And the > viola de mano being tuned is of a completely different size and depth, > and has a different type of headstock. Signorelli would appear to have > used perspective extremely well and his apparent shapes and details of > instruments are likely to be more than commonly accurate. > there was so much variation, and so little standardization, that it's hard to pin things down to one visual sound-bite if you will. The Signorelli fresco is c.1500, so the instrument at top dead center is definately a vihuela-viola. Big instruments apear to have been common, one of many common sizes and shapes present from let's say 1490 to 1550. here's some examples of big ones: http://tinyurl.com/7hmla http://www.thecipher.com/viol-guitar_GonesseOrgan_1508_France_det1.jpg http://tinyurl.com/bvbh7 http://www.thecipher.com/braccio_AngelConsort1503cntrarco_deta1.jpg http://tinyurl.com/9vuzl http://www.thecipher.com/vihuela_Luis_Milan_El_Maestro_1536sm.jpg http://www.thecipher.com/vihuela_16th_monasteryGuadalupe_deta.jpg http://tinyurl.com/9dmp8 http://tinyurl.com/8a75f here's a blow up the one you're wondering about http://www.thecipher.com/Signorelli_2down-left_deta.jpg The peg-stock looks typical bent-back lute to me, and vihuela-viola can be found with many different types of peg-boxes including the right-angle lute style. It's very hard to tell from a dead-on frontal shot if there's a deep bowl or not. It could be flat-backed, as could many others. I'd buy it, but it's just too hard to tell. One could imagine that both of these instruments too, seen from the front, are flat-back. http://www.thecipher.com/lutes_BartolomeoMontagna_1498_det.jpg Maybe they're flat-backed chittara? Maybe the vihuela line included a tear-drop contoured instrument the whole time and no-one is seeing it because they're fixated on bowl-backed lutes and projecting something that isn't actually there, i.e. a beep bowl. I had to use this same kind of argument re thin-ribbed viols in general, i.e. that they existed, and in fairly large quantity. Here's a monster bass vihuela from Catalan, with no apearent waist indents of any kind, flat back, slab constructed, late 15th century, lower left http://tinyurl.com/75jvf This lute-shaped or tear-drop bowed instrument may be flat-backed too, 1510 http://tinyurl.com/b4esk So you could be right, who knows. It's worth investigating, maybe someone already has, I don't know. I have seen a few others that I also thought or know were flat backed and tear-dropped shaped, smaller ones usually. I don't think you can gauge much about 16th century instruments by pointing to current viola seen in Portugal in any event (just to grab that loose end). Roger To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
