-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On Tuesday 30 November 2004 2:07 pm, Shawn wrote: > > Opinion: > > people an idea of what they should or shouldn't do. Only in extreme cases > > has the Executive gotten involved. > > Such as this one? <grins>. I think you've just made my point here - trying > to impose control does not equal self moderating.... (admittedly, there > probably needs to be a balance in there somewhere... I don't think we have > that balance yet though...)
I am entitled to my own opinion regardless of whether I am the President of the group or not. I tried to indicate in my previous mail what were _my_ opinions and what were the _official_ positions of the Board. I am neither trying to impose control of this thread or this mailing list. Like it or not however, I am a moderator. I did not feel that I was moderating and I hope that I did not give anyone this impression. > people coming and going as their interests change is expected. To have > people leave because they feel excluded, and/or don't care about the > community type discussions isn't. If I were starting Linux all over, I'd > be looking for a mailing list that can offer the input I need to learn how > to get my systems up and running, and configured. I don't think the > clug-talk list fits this role anymore - the knowledge and skill is there, > but someone new may not think these questions are appropriate given the > community nature of most of the messages. This is a huge leap Shawn. You are making assumptions for which you have no proof. Michael Petch explaining that he is leaving and why is a rare case. We don't get notes from most of the people who unsubscribe from this list. I believe that is because some of them may entertain the idea of rejoining the list later. As has been pointed out, some dialogue may be entertaining. I tend to err on the side of caution and try to tone things down when they get heated. Email that appears downright hostile just tends to make the lurkers dig in deeper. > Perhaps I misunderstood the purpose of the clug-talk list back when I first > signed up.... I think you may have. However, being a general list does not exclude technical questions. That is the beauty. I would take your idea further and suggest _maybe_ creating a list specifically for technical questions or clug-howto. > Sorry Jarrod, but I think the "official" stance on this topic may skew > public opinion... too late now though... I'll discuss this one with you in > person though (over beer) to avoid any mis-interpretation via email. :D > (not to mention my thoughts on this haven't fully gelled yet...) That is one of the many things that are unfortunate about the job of an Executive, you aren't allowed to have opinions, people think that everything you say is meant as law. I am not about that. I am actually really perceptive and can see both sides of an argument. I have voiced a lot of my personal opinions lately and I seem to get a lot of flak for it. Who'da thunk I was so controversial. I guess I am. I am also passionate and I am still very much dedicated to seeing this group succeed. I think we are expereincing more than our fair share of growing pains of late and that is making it very hard to be a CLUG Executive. > I have always thought the word "propose" was roughly equivalent to > "suggest" - not "demand". I'm but one voice in the group, and I don't > expect people to agree with me all the time (well, not usually LOL). Hence > a proposal for discussion. As am I. Propose away. We have been asking for any and all suggestions. I never once said, "No, we aren't going to do that" > In the end, I feel that we are starting to stray from our roots and > becoming more of a bureaucratic organization, and less of a knowledge > resource. This has much less appeal to me than the loose, free form > technical discussions, meetings, and presentations. (don't take that as a > slight in any way - I think the executive is doing a great job in > organizing things and trying to listen to the members.) And the Executive is especially sensitive to this of late. The meeting tomorrow will be a lot less structured. We are not handing out a formal agenda. I think the bulk of the time will be for socializing, at least that is how we are trying to set it up. Part of what you said has struck me, "I think the executive is doing a great job in organizing things..." it seems that there are some very loud shouts that maybe we are trying to be too organized. Too much structure may be a bad thing. Maybe we should have less rules. Less bureaucracy. I am compelled to defend this with a statement. We have tried to create a self-sustaining group within the guidelines of a Society. A corporate identity. As such we do have to follow rules. The thing we may have lost sight of is that the people involved in the group may not subscribe to the idea of any kind of rule or rulership. If we don't work this out I fear that this group will suffer for it. I would hate to see the hard work laid to waste. I am not confident that it would survive if the Executive stepped down or stopped doing their jobs. I could be so entrenched in this that I have lost sight in what this group is about. Perhaps this _is_ what everyone wants... they want the group to be a small cluster of Linux enthusiasts sitting around in a cafe somewhere talking about Linux. And maybe that is okay. I honestly don't know anymore. I am trying to keep a stiff upper lip and stay the course that I perceive to be laid in front of me. It keeps getting harder and harder to do so. - -- Jarrod Major GPG Fingerprint: FA4A 1EA3 A0EE A842 07BB 804C 0090 14F6 BE6E DE3D CLUG President Registered Linux User: #224211 -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.2.2 (GNU/Linux) iQCVAwUBQazu+wCQFPa+bt49AQIDMgQAt5ZdNnd8rQqGTqsj+lu0YnNECHKsGrPE mOup/Vxnk3sfE1wXuv6kQcdFU+SRN0K1TMVJvXYgAzzL93veRYtBZD14WVCbP3P0 zGQDTSOrXOMq6RO6HU6jbE3RZTHhvkS46wVATSFmvWR2BqTkJ6HH7DCTIbISEiFI +ri7PR934Ik= =pgs5 -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- _______________________________________________ clug-talk mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://clug.ca/mailman/listinfo/clug-talk_clug.ca Mailing List Guidelines (http://clug.ca/ml_guidelines.php) **Please remove these lines when replying
