Thanks Gary Yes that is the same sheet arrangement as we had on Koobalibra. It resulted in very large loads on the traveler car and when was sheeted hard would not slide easily. Using sheet sometimes was easier if windy esp. That being the negative the main on that boat is beautiful. It is so adjustable that it feels like it is talking to you ....
Mike From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Gary Nylander via CnC-List Sent: Thursday, July 13, 2017 5:28 PM To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com Cc: Gary Nylander Subject: Re: Stus-List traveller track/cars Harken vs others I am not enamored with the 115 windward sheeting arrangement. The main sheet goes from a line lock on the lower part of the pedestal to the boom and back. Each end has a lock and a dedicated winch. Seems to me like a waste of winches. The car is mounted low in front of the pedestal and has a continuous line for adjustment, but the trimmer has to get down almost at deck level to do the adjustment. Our trimmer seems to use the winches and the sheet more than the traveler and I think that is counter productive. Plus he is in my way when I want to trim the jib. And.... About four grand of self tailing winches I would rather use for the chute, but I am just a newbie on the boat. Gary From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Hoyt, Mike via CnC-List Sent: Thursday, July 13, 2017 12:37 PM To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com<mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com> Cc: Hoyt, Mike <mike.h...@impgroup.com<mailto:mike.h...@impgroup.com>> Subject: Re: Stus-List traveller track/cars Harken vs others Hi Gary The loads on the main sheet and traveler on the 115 are normally pretty high. When it was windy and gusty we would often have one person on traveler and another on the sheet. I believe Koobalibra did have a windward sheeting car but am not certain as it has been nearly two years since we raced on that boat. However I think it would have been nice to have even if expensive on the 115. Does the 115 you race on have the 2:1 purchase on the main sheet? Do you find leeward roundings a LOT of work for the main trimmer? Mike Persistence Halifax From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Gary Nylander via CnC-List Sent: Thursday, July 13, 2017 12:48 PM To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com<mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com> Cc: Gary Nylander Subject: Re: Stus-List traveller track/cars Harken vs others I agree about it being overrated, unless you have a real tender boat where the crew has to be on the rail at all times. I put one on my 30-1 and it was almost useless in our light air conditions. The wind was often too light to allow the windward sheeting capability to work. I am racing on a C&C 115 and it is pretty much the same. I blocked my car off and put blocks and cam cleats at the ends of the traveler. As the main trimmer is in the middle of the boat most times, it works better. My traveler is on the companionway area shelf and spans the full width of the cockpit. Gary #593 From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Matthew L. Wolford via CnC-List Sent: Thursday, July 13, 2017 9:29 AM To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com<mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com> Cc: Matthew L. Wolford <wolf...@erie.net<mailto:wolf...@erie.net>> Subject: Re: Stus-List traveller track/cars Harken vs others I had a windward sheeting car on my 34 and believe they're overrated. Just my two cents. From: Marek Dziedzic via CnC-List<mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com> Sent: Wednesday, July 12, 2017 10:32 PM To: Dennis C. via CnC-List<mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com> Cc: Marek Dziedzic<mailto:dziedzi...@hotmail.com> Subject: Re: Stus-List traveller track/cars Harken vs others If you decide on Harken, go for the "windward sheeting" traveler car. As they say in their ads, once you raced with one, you would never go back. If you are cost conscious, go for Garhauer; there is hardly better value (not to mention that they usually bend over backwards to accommodate your needs). Marek Sent from Mail<https://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkId=550986> for Windows 10 From: Dennis C. via CnC-List<mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com> Sent: Wednesday, July 12, 2017 18:55 To: CnClist<mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com> Cc: Dennis C.<mailto:capt...@gmail.com> Subject: Re: Stus-List traveller track/cars Harken vs others When looking at "ball bearing" traveler and genoa car systems (as opposed to pin stop or slide track), design is a factor. While some use T-track, others use X-track. Some use recirculating ball bearings, others use wheels. The design has a LOT to do with how the system handles loads. I think that's why Harken is so well regarded. While other brands may be good, my opinion is Harken's design handles the loads better, and therefore moves easier than others. Just my opinion. Whether the ease of movement is worth the price premium, well, that's your choice. All I'm saying is look closely at the design. Find and ask owners of different systems. Hopefully, one can find owners who have or have had different brands and systems so you get an apples to apples comparison. For instance, Touche's Harken traveler seems to move easier than Touche's Lewmar genoa cars. Just saying. Dennis C. Touche' 35-1 #83 Mandeville, LA On Wed, Jul 12, 2017 at 7:27 AM, Hoyt, Mike via CnC-List <cnc-list@cnc-list.com<mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> wrote: It is good to remember when discussing this that Harken track is measured in millimeters rather than inches (usually 22mm, 27mm, 32mm). Other cars do not fit on Harken track properly and likely vice versa. I did contact Garhaur about new genoa lead cars for Persistence on the existing track (22mm small boat track 3.6m in length). They said they could not do it (would not?). Would have had to be custom. In the end I came across a good deal on the mid range genoa cars and track ends (27mm) and had to purchase separately the aft track ends and new tracks (the ones that came with my new gear were only 1m long and I needed 3.6m). Replaced tracks (PITA) and cars with the new Harken gear and is more suited to the size and loads on Persistence. Sold the old tracks and cars to a friend who is using on his C&C 30. This brings to mind that I have two 1 meter Harken low beam non captive ball tracks 27mm midrange and matching backing plates. These are new and have never been installed on a boat but are circa 2009. Mike Persistence Halifax, NS http://users.eastlink.ca/~mhoyt From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com<mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com>] On Behalf Of Dennis C. via CnC-List Sent: Tuesday, July 11, 2017 6:00 PM To: CnClist Cc: Dennis C. Subject: Re: Stus-List Traveler for C&C 35 Mk II Sean, I have Lewmar Ocean 1 ball bearing genoa cars and a Harken traveler. In my opinion, the Harken is superior. Harken does make a high beam variable spacing traveler track (Harken R32HB) which may fit your application. Harken tends to be a "bit" more pricey, however. Here's a link to Touche's traveler setup: https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B_sb5TfIENvsX0dGcEV2Mm1QNUE It has a 4:1 endless traveler sheet which passes through bulkhead mounted swivel cam cleats. It can be operated easily from forward or aft of the traveler. While I don't have experience with Garhauer travelers, many on the list speak highly of them. I have other Garhauer items on my boat and am positively impressed with them. I have also had Garhauer make custom items for both my boat and clients boats. Good stuff. A traveler that operates well is, in my opinion, a safety item. Many port/starboard collisions are partially to blame because a traveler would not drop quickly or a mainsheet would not release easily. The port boat was not able to turn down due to being extremely powered up. Dennis C. Touche' 35-1 #83 Mandeville, LA _______________________________________________ This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to: https://www.paypal.me/stumurray All Contributions are greatly appreciated! ________________________________ _______________________________________________ This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to: https://www.paypal.me/stumurray All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
_______________________________________________ This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to: https://www.paypal.me/stumurray All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
