Bruce, Just an FYI, the ISO for watercraft is WT 00 01. Most companies either follow the ISO because they have been tested in court for the language used, or because the ISO has already been approved by the state so they don't have to get their own policy approved.
There are many companies that do use their own policies as you said, but they are based on the ISO with some changes to the language as they try to exclude something that the base policy doesn't. Typically, that language is tested in court pretty quickly and if they lose, they tend to revert their language back to the original base policy. The mid-west company I worked for for a few years went that route. They managed to win a few court cases so some of their language became standardized among other 'write your own' carriers. There is one other policy standard that exists that I forgot about until now. Lloyd's of London. They write a policy that uses some of the language that I have seen other's mention in this string that you don't find in ISO forms. Progressive, Heritage and others resell Lloyd's whenever they get a policy that doesn't fall into their normal book of business (types of policies they specialize in). I've not dealt with a lot of Lloyd's policies, but they are definitely different. If anyone on this list has a Lloyd's policy, I highly recommend the coverage review I mentioned earlier. Very highly. James On Monday, November 11, 2019, 07:10:08 PM CST, cnc-list-requ...@cnc-list.com <cnc-list-requ...@cnc-list.com> wrote: Send CnC-List mailing list submissions to cnc-list@cnc-list.com To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to cnc-list-requ...@cnc-list.com You can reach the person managing the list at cnc-list-ow...@cnc-list.com When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of CnC-List digest..." Today's Topics: 1. Re: Boat insurance...reimbursement vs. depreciated coverage... (Bruce Whitmore) 2. Re: Boat insurance...reimbursement vs. depreciated coverage (kasel...@q.com) 3. Marco Pumps UP3E (Bill Coleman) 4. Re: Boat insurance...reimbursement vs. depreciated (James Nichols) 5. Re: Boat insurance...reimbursement vs. depreciated (Bruce Whitmore) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Message: 1 Date: Mon, 11 Nov 2019 21:46:04 +0000 (UTC) From: Bruce Whitmore <bwhitm...@sbcglobal.net> To: Allen Miles via CnC-List <cnc-list@cnc-list.com> Subject: Re: Stus-List Boat insurance...reimbursement vs. depreciated coverage... Message-ID: <1561640048.2547048.1573508764...@mail.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" You'll want to look very closely for issues related to depreciation.? If you have a policy in PDF format, you can do a search on words like "depreciate" "depreciation" and 20%" and you should find it.? Bruce Whitmore (847) 404-5092 (mobile) bwhitm...@sbcglobal.net On Monday, November 11, 2019, 4:18:10 PM EST, Allen Miles via CnC-List <cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote: I have agreed hull value with BoatUS.? I don't remember seeing a change in coverage. Allen MilesS/v SeptimaC&C 30-2 Hampton, VA On Sun, Nov 10, 2019 at 4:39 PM David Risch via CnC-List <cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote: I may be repeating myself here, but it bears repeating.? Check your boat coverage.? BoatIUS had reimbursement coverage before they switched to GEICO as their carrier last year.? Now it is depreciated value coverage.? Reimbursement coverage pays for replacing damages up to the agreed value.? Depreciated coverage drops to 20% over time to where most of our boats would only receive 20% of fixing damages!?? I switched coverage when I learned of this and I still pay the same premium. ? I bring this up because one of our brethren has been caught by this issue after a recent incident.? If your broker cannot find a reimbursement carrier, let me know.? I will provide the contact info of my guy.? _______________________________________________ Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.? Each and every one is greatly appreciated.? If you want to support the list - use PayPal to send contribution --? ?https://www.paypal.me/stumurray _______________________________________________ Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.? Each and every one is greatly appreciated.? If you want to support the list - use PayPal to send contribution --? https://www.paypal.me/stumurray -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: <http://cnc-list.com/pipermail/cnc-list_cnc-list.com/attachments/20191111/dc796de7/attachment-0001.html> ------------------------------ Message: 2 Date: Mon, 11 Nov 2019 15:15:07 -0800 From: kasel...@q.com To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com Subject: Re: Stus-List Boat insurance...reimbursement vs. depreciated coverage Message-ID: <50816d90-5499-41d8-9876-dee613e56...@q.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Be careful to understand your insurance policy. Lots of terms like ?replacement value? or ?agreed value? or ?new for old? have different definitions. See the definitions section of your policy. Sometimes the ?agreed value? provision applies only in the case of a total loss while a ?depreciated value? provision is applied in case of a partial loss. If you purchase your insurance from a ?marine? broker or even a ?marine? agent you should be able to get straight answers about how claims will be handled but if you are buying your insurance from the same person you are buying your home owners or auto coverage you may find the broker/agent less knowledgeable about your yacht/boat policy because it?s a very different product. And remember that a ?broker? works for you while an ?agent? works for the insurance company. Property/casualty insurances are regulated by your state?s insurance commissioner while a true ? marine? policy falls under federal jurisdiction. A lower price often equates to less coverage. I suggest you be very careful here. Just my opinion. Dave. Kaseler SLY 1975 C&C 33 Sent from my iPad > On Nov 11, 2019, at 12:29 PM, Francois Rivard via CnC-List > <cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote: > > I have agreed upon value with Allstate. Straight-up agreed-upon value > coverage, 35-40% cheaper than Boat US and Geico. (Geico's been insuring my > cars since the 90's but they wouldn't / couldn't compete with Allstate.) > > I'm on an inland lake / that most likely makes a difference. > Your actual mileage may vary. > > -Francois Rivard > 1990 34+ "Take Five" > Lake Lanier, GA > _______________________________________________ > > Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions. Each and > every one is greatly appreciated. If you want to support the list - use > PayPal to send contribution -- https://www.paypal.me/stumurray > ------------------------------ Message: 3 Date: Mon, 11 Nov 2019 18:20:45 -0500 From: "Bill Coleman" <colt...@gmail.com> To: <cnc-list@cnc-list.com> Subject: Stus-List Marco Pumps UP3E Message-ID: <142101d598e6$a5a52020$f0ef6060$@com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Has anyone had any experience with these water pumps? Just got an Email from Jamestown Distributors on them, I had never heard of them Before. They are gear pumps, rather than the multi-chamber diaphragm pumps that everyone else has. I would like to try something different. Bill Coleman Erie PA -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: <http://cnc-list.com/pipermail/cnc-list_cnc-list.com/attachments/20191111/4e804c93/attachment-0001.html> ------------------------------ Message: 4 Date: Tue, 12 Nov 2019 00:00:45 +0000 (UTC) From: James Nichols <jfn...@yahoo.com> To: "cnc-list@cnc-list.com" <cnc-list@cnc-list.com> Subject: Re: Stus-List Boat insurance...reimbursement vs. depreciated Message-ID: <246170457.1835183.1573516845...@mail.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Some terms to know if you are dealing with a claim.? Replacement Cost Value (RCV) - this is the cost of buying a new boat or part in today's dollars.? You probably have your boat insured for this amount.? Actual Cash Value (ACV) - the amount that a boat or part is worth after depreciation is applied.? Depreciation - everything has an average expected lifespan. Similar to how cars lose value (depreciate) the minute you drive off the lot, so do boats.? Boats depreciate as a whole, similar to the way cars do. But parts, like winches, also depreciate individually.? Most parts are estimated to last less than 20 years.? For example cushions may have an average life of 5 years. The wood table 15 years, the engine 20 years.? Etc. The hull, mast and stainless tubing will probably have longer lifespans estimated.? 35-50 years. Depreciation is calculated by dividing the age of the item by the expected lifespan.? So 3 year old cushions will be depreciated by 60%. Recoverable vs. non-recoverable depreciation - your policy may be a RCV policy or it may be an ACV policy.? ?If you have an ACV policy,? all you ever get is the ACV of the part being replaced. So you can not recover the depreciation.? If you have a RCV policy,? they hold the depreciation until you do the repairs or replace the item meaning you recover (are reimbursed for) the full cost to repair or replace the items.? Once you do the repairs,? you submit your invoice and they reimburse you.? I have a lot of experience with home owners claims,? and not as much with automotive or boats,? but from my understanding some policies for boats and autos always depreciate materials and materials are always ACV and only the labor is recoverable.?? Check with your agent to find out the exact details of your policy.? You can also nearly always add endorsements to your policy to make it pay for 'everything' but that drives up the cost of the policy.? >From what I have seen in my 10+ years in the industry,? most people aren't >insured the way they think they are which is the reason why some of you left >your previous providers and went with new providers.? Nearly every policy provided by all carriers is identical,? because they all pretty much just use a standard ISO form.? But the agent at your new insurance policy listened to the issues you had and added endorsements to provide coverage to make sure you spent have the same issue again.?? If you get coverage review requests from your agent,? you should probably take them up on it.? They probably send you a request about once a year.? I know this was long,? but I hope it cleared up some questions about what and why things happen in a claim.? James -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: <http://cnc-list.com/pipermail/cnc-list_cnc-list.com/attachments/20191112/6614d4eb/attachment-0001.html> ------------------------------ Message: 5 Date: Tue, 12 Nov 2019 01:09:21 +0000 (UTC) From: Bruce Whitmore <bwhitm...@sbcglobal.net> To: James Nichols via CnC-List <cnc-list@cnc-list.com> Subject: Re: Stus-List Boat insurance...reimbursement vs. depreciated Message-ID: <1596562352.2655200.1573520961...@mail.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" I agree with everything James said except for the bit about ISO forms.? Yes, ISO forms are pretty standard for Homeowners, Renters, and even Commercial General Liability.? For boats, however, I have not seen the standard ISO forms, meaning that each carrier's policy may differ, even substantially.? That means that one should not rely on having standard policy language that is only altered by endorsements.? Just my $.02 worth, Bruce Whitmore (847) 404-5092 (mobile) bwhitm...@sbcglobal.net On Monday, November 11, 2019, 7:01:38 PM EST, James Nichols via CnC-List <cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote: Some terms to know if you are dealing with a claim.? Replacement Cost Value (RCV) - this is the cost of buying a new boat or part in today's dollars.? You probably have your boat insured for this amount.? Actual Cash Value (ACV) - the amount that a boat or part is worth after depreciation is applied.? Depreciation - everything has an average expected lifespan. Similar to how cars lose value (depreciate) the minute you drive off the lot, so do boats.? Boats depreciate as a whole, similar to the way cars do. But parts, like winches, also depreciate individually.? Most parts are estimated to last less than 20 years.? For example cushions may have an average life of 5 years. The wood table 15 years, the engine 20 years.? Etc. The hull, mast and stainless tubing will probably have longer lifespans estimated.? 35-50 years. Depreciation is calculated by dividing the age of the item by the expected lifespan.? So 3 year old cushions will be depreciated by 60%. Recoverable vs. non-recoverable depreciation - your policy may be a RCV policy or it may be an ACV policy.? ?If you have an ACV policy,? all you ever get is the ACV of the part being replaced. So you can not recover the depreciation.? If you have a RCV policy,? they hold the depreciation until you do the repairs or replace the item meaning you recover (are reimbursed for) the full cost to repair or replace the items.? Once you do the repairs,? you submit your invoice and they reimburse you.? I have a lot of experience with home owners claims,? and not as much with automotive or boats,? but from my understanding some policies for boats and autos always depreciate materials and materials are always ACV and only the labor is recoverable.?? Check with your agent to find out the exact details of your policy.? You can also nearly always add endorsements to your policy to make it pay for 'everything' but that drives up the cost of the policy.? >From what I have seen in my 10+ years in the industry,? most people aren't >insured the way they think they are which is the reason why some of you left >your previous providers and went with new providers.? Nearly every policy provided by all carriers is identical,? because they all pretty much just use a standard ISO form.? But the agent at your new insurance policy listened to the issues you had and added endorsements to provide coverage to make sure you spent have the same issue again.?? If you get coverage review requests from your agent,? you should probably take them up on it.? They probably send you a request about once a year.? I know this was long,? but I hope it cleared up some questions about what and why things happen in a claim.? James_______________________________________________ Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.? Each and every one is greatly appreciated.? If you want to support the list - use PayPal to send contribution --? https://www.paypal.me/stumurray -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... 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