------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~-->
Make a clean sweep of pop-up ads. Yahoo! Companion Toolbar.
Now with Pop-Up Blocker. Get it for free!
http://us.click.yahoo.com/L5YrjA/eSIIAA/yQLSAA/GSaulB/TM
--------------------------------------------------------------------~->
There are 25 messages in this issue.
Topics in this digest:
1. Re: (Mis)Naming a Language
From: "B. Garcia" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
2. Re: (Mis)Naming a Language
From: Andreas Johansson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
3. Re: Possible base-20 numeric system
From: Rodlox <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
4. Re: (Mis)Naming a Language
From: John Cowan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
5. Bhutan's language(s) ?
From: Rodlox <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
6. USAGE: name pronunciation
From: "Mark J. Reed" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
7. Re: (Mis)Naming a Language
From: Carsten Becker <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
8. Re: USAGE: name pronunciation
From: Joe <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
9. Re: USAGE: name pronunciation
From: "Mark J. Reed" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
10. Re: USAGE: name pronunciation
From: John Cowan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
11. Re: (Mis)Naming a Language
From: Simon Richard Clarkstone <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
12. Re: USAGE: name pronunciation
From: "Mark J. Reed" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
13. Re: (Mis)Naming a Language
From: "B. Garcia" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
14. Re: USAGE: name pronunciation
From: caeruleancentaur <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
15. Re: Bhutan's language(s) ?
From: John Cowan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
16. Re: USAGE: name pronunciation
From: "B. Garcia" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
17. Re: (Mis)Naming a Language
From: caeruleancentaur <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
18. Re: (Mis)Naming a Language
From: Muke Tever <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
19. Hobbits spoke Indonesian!
From: Rodlox <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
20. Re: (Mis)Naming a Language
From: John Cowan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
21. Re: (Mis)Naming a Language
From: J�rg Rhiemeier <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
22. Re: (Mis)Naming a Language
From: Rodlox <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
23. Re: (Mis)Naming a Language
From: Muke Tever <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
24. Japanese Long Consonants
From: Chris Bates <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
25. OT: Exposure to Hormones in the Womb & Ability at Mathematics
From: Chris Bates <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________
Message: 1
Date: Thu, 28 Oct 2004 03:49:28 -0700
From: "B. Garcia" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: (Mis)Naming a Language
You also have Bisaya, which is spoken in Borneo, and then you have the
Bisayan group of languages in the Visayas of the Philippines.
--
You can turn away from me
but there's nothing that'll keep me here you know
And you'll never be the city guy
Any more than I'll be hosting The Scooby Show
Scooby Show - Belle and Sebastian
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________
Message: 2
Date: Thu, 28 Oct 2004 12:54:28 +0200
From: Andreas Johansson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: (Mis)Naming a Language
Quoting Jan van Steenbergen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
> --- Herman Miller skrzypszy:
>
> > Besides the obvious pages, googling for Lindiga brings up quite a
> > few pages in Estonian. [...]
>
> Apart from a certain Mr. Wieslaw Wenedyk Dam, who apparently ran in
> Polish municipal elections a few years ago but was not elected, all
> occurrences of Wenedyk refer to my language (most of which are
> numerous different copies of Wiki pages and of the Google directory).
Lemme see ...
Tairezazh: Only hits related to my lang.
Steienzh/Steianzh: Dito.
Altaii: My language, a Dr. Karim Altaii, and some professor. Plus a Russian page
about a tractor called 'Altai' - could it have an inflected form 'Altaii'?
Yargish: My language, a planet in some SF world, the screen-name of someone on
Tolkien Online, an RPG character, someone's account on Yahoo (these three might
very well be the same person, of course), a word appearing in a single Yiddish
text.
Meghean: My language, someone's RPG character, someone who invented a "honey
mint conditioner", whatever that is, and a plentitude of other people called
it.
Larethian: A D&D god(!), some people called it, a miniatures company.
Unsurprisingly, nothing on the lang. I should perhaps rename it 'Larethic' or
'Larethish', since these yield no hits.
Andreas
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________
Message: 3
Date: Thu, 28 Oct 2004 13:40:31 +0200
From: Rodlox <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Possible base-20 numeric system
----- Original Message -----
From: Jeffrey Jones <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Thursday, October 28, 2004 5:59 AM
Subject: Re: Possible base-20 numeric system
> On Wed, 27 Oct 2004 02:33:11 -0500, Danny Wier <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> wrote:
>
> > From: "Jeffrey Jones"
> >
> > > Didn't know that about Hindi. I suppose Sanskrit is no worse than
> > > Polish?
> >
> > I know little Sanskrit, but I think its number system is probably pretty
> > complicated. A lot of it is probably due to those sandhi rules.
>
> Ah yes. Sandhi would make even a perfectly regular system complicated.
why's that?
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________
Message: 4
Date: Thu, 28 Oct 2004 07:53:41 -0400
From: John Cowan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: (Mis)Naming a Language
Herman Miller scripsit:
> Later I
> found out that Rissa is the scientific name of a kind of gull called a
> kittiwake (two species: black-legged, R. tridactyla, and red-legged, R.
> brevirostris).
It turns out that even Linnaean names aren't absolutely unique: the
same name can be shared by an animal taxon and a plant taxon.
See http://home.earthlink.net/~misaak/taxonomy.html for such examples
as _Cannabis_, which is a genus of birds as well as of the well-known
and widely cultivated plants. In principle, I suppose, there could
even be a plant called _Boa constrictor_.
--
John Cowan [EMAIL PROTECTED] www.ccil.org/~cowan www.reutershealth.com
Linguistics is arguably the most hotly contested property in the academic
realm. It is soaked with the blood of poets, theologians, philosophers,
philologists, psychologists, biologists and neurologists, along with
whatever blood can be got out of grammarians. - Russ Rymer
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________
Message: 5
Date: Thu, 28 Oct 2004 16:00:17 +0200
From: Rodlox <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Bhutan's language(s) ?
out of curiosity, what is the language(s) of Bhutan? and to which languages(s) are
it/they related? *curious*
links, if possible, please.
[This message contained attachments]
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________
Message: 6
Date: Thu, 28 Oct 2004 08:45:42 -0400
From: "Mark J. Reed" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: USAGE: name pronunciation
Attn Rightpondians . . .
How do you pronounce the name "Gerry" - with a /g/ or with a /dZ/? I
assume it is an alternate spelling of either "Gar[r]y" or "Jerry"; I
would guess that it is the latter and is a shortened form of "Gerald" -
under which hypothesis it would be pronounced with a /dZ/, of course.
But I seek confirmation from someone who actually knows. :)
Thanks -
-Marcos
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________
Message: 7
Date: Thu, 28 Oct 2004 14:46:01 +0200
From: Carsten Becker <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: (Mis)Naming a Language
On Thursday 28 October 2004 05:54, Sally Caves wrote:
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Mark J. Reed" <[EMAIL PROTECTED] <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>>
>
> > On Wed, Oct 27, 2004 at 06:27:40PM -0400, Doug Dee
wrote:
> >> Notice: I have conlangs under construction called
> >> Revonian, Katevan, Lorian,
> >> and Frankish. Now no one else on earth can use those
> >> names, since I was here
> >> first. ;-)
> >
> > Think a natlang might have dibs on that last one. :)
>
> I think Doug was kidding with that last one. :) And I
> think I'm going to copy him on that name Katevan. :)
lol! If they spoke an own language in LotR's Lothl�rien,
it'd be surely known as L�rian. "Revonian" reminds me of
Star Trek for some reason :P
Now, as for my conlangs, two out of four do not yield
G-hits. Last time I checked, (all in quotation marks) "Ve
Segelm A Laigh�dh�t" and "Dal�ian" only gives conlang
related pages as results.
"Ayeri" seems to be an Arab (?) word. IIRC, I found pages
with transliterated Arab or something like that. I haven't
checked for "Ambrian" yet, but I wouldn't be that surprised
if there was really another language with that name.
Actually, my version of this name comes from the region
known to the Ayeri as the "Ambrian mountains" (Tay Rivanie
Nuambriye) [1]. "nu...ye" only means that the head noun of
the adjective is agentive (inanimate) plural, as rock is a
dead material (which is not shown in agentive) and there's
loads of this. <RANT> I don't know how to justify that the
adjective must be inflected for the agent, though ... maybe
I could say because "tay" is always in proper names mostly
when they stand on their own, and things with proper
names ... Or it is simply habit to assume that in such
constructions, the head word is *always* the doer of a
quality ... Whatever this phenomenom is called, it sucks if
you haven't got a water-proof definition! Are the mountains
_doing_ "being Ambrian" or are they _affected_ by being
Ambrian? Is this called "volitionality" at all? That's what
I called it when someone e.g. uninentionally is struck by a
tree and dies e.g. The person would then be a patient
because the person <episcene.3sg>self is not responsible
for dying.</RANT>
Carsten
(1) I've just made up the etymology completely from scratch,
and |ambri-| is indeed valid in Ayeri, which only allows
CVC in most cases -- but C+fluid, C+nasal and both vice
versa are allowed. [4] is also counted as fluid for yet
unknown reasons. "Ambrian" is the anglicized version of
"ambri".
--
Eri silvev�ng aibannama padangin.
Nivaie evaenain eri ming silvoiev�ng caparei.
- Antoine de Saint-Exup�ry, Le Petit Prince
-> http://www.beckerscarsten.de/?conlang=ayeri
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________
Message: 8
Date: Thu, 28 Oct 2004 13:56:27 +0100
From: Joe <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: USAGE: name pronunciation
Mark J. Reed wrote:
>Attn Rightpondians . . .
>
>How do you pronounce the name "Gerry" - with a /g/ or with a /dZ/? I
>assume it is an alternate spelling of either "Gar[r]y" or "Jerry"; I
>would guess that it is the latter and is a shortened form of "Gerald" -
>under which hypothesis it would be pronounced with a /dZ/, of course.
>But I seek confirmation from someone who actually knows. :)
>
>
[dZ]. It's a shortened from of 'Gerald', indeed, as opposed to 'Jerry',
which is short for 'Jeremy'.
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________
Message: 9
Date: Thu, 28 Oct 2004 09:34:24 -0400
From: "Mark J. Reed" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: USAGE: name pronunciation
On Thu, Oct 28, 2004 at 01:56:27PM +0100, Joe wrote:
> [dZ]. It's a shortened from of 'Gerald', indeed, as opposed to 'Jerry',
> which is short for 'Jeremy'.
Not always. "Jerry" is sometimes short for "Jerome" (e.g. Seinfeld) and
sometimes, despite the spelling, short for "Gerald" (e.g. my father).
And for those on the list who are old enough and American enough to
recognize the name: no, my father is not *that* Jerry Reed. :)
-Marcos
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________
Message: 10
Date: Thu, 28 Oct 2004 09:42:48 -0400
From: John Cowan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: USAGE: name pronunciation
Joe scripsit:
> >How do you pronounce the name "Gerry" - with a /g/ or with a /dZ/?
>
> [dZ]. It's a shortened from of 'Gerald', indeed, as opposed to 'Jerry',
> which is short for 'Jeremy'.
Not always: Jerrys in both Left- and Rightpondia are sometimes Gerald.
A notable British example would be the 17th Duke of Denver, Gerald
("Jerry", "Pickled Gherkins") Wimsey. It's essentially the same story
as Jeff for Geoffrey, which latter is sometimes Jeffrey or Jeffry.
Even the surname "Gerry", historically pronounced with a [g], is now
often made [dZ] even by those who bear it*, and the American political
verb "gerrymander", meaning "to divide an area into districts in such
a way as to advantage one group over another" is most often pronounced
[dZ], although the first part of it memorializes Eldridge Gerry [g],
the governor of Massachusetts, who redrew the boundaries of election
districts in 1812 so as to benefit his party. One of them looked
something like a salamander, and was christened the "Gerry-mander"
by a newspaper editor in captioning an editorial cartoon (see
http://memory.loc.gov/rbc/rbpe/rbpe00/rbpe000/00000100/001dq.gif).
===
[*] But the Enroughtys [da:biz] and the Taliaferros [EMAIL PROTECTED] will
*never* submit to mere spelling pronunciations!
--
"Clear? Huh! Why a four-year-old child John Cowan
could understand this report. Run out [EMAIL PROTECTED]
and find me a four-year-old child. I http://www.ccil.org/~cowan
can't make head or tail out of it." http://www.reutershealth.com
--Rufus T. Firefly on government reports
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________
Message: 11
Date: Thu, 28 Oct 2004 14:44:50 +0100
From: Simon Richard Clarkstone <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: (Mis)Naming a Language
David Peterson wrote:
> So, my question: Has something similar happened to anyone
> else? And, do you think I should change the name of the
> language? Would you, in this situation? Also, what if someone
> created a language with a name like Teonaht, not knowing
> that one already existed, and (with no disrespect to this
> imaginary person) was far better?
There is a simple method to avoid this in _many_ cases: use Google. To
search, it must build an index containing almost every word on the web,
and it even has a spelling checker (for those close matches). If you
are subscribed to a lingustic journal, you may be able to access their
index of articles/papers on their website, though the text of the papers
will not be available to the general public.
Specialised language indexes exist also, though the only one I know is
at LangMaker.com, and only searches their site.
--
Simon Richard Clarkstone
[EMAIL PROTECTED] / [EMAIL PROTECTED]
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________
Message: 12
Date: Thu, 28 Oct 2004 09:35:16 -0400
From: "Mark J. Reed" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: USAGE: name pronunciation
On Thu, Oct 28, 2004 at 09:34:24AM -0400, Mark J. Reed wrote:
> On Thu, Oct 28, 2004 at 01:56:27PM +0100, Joe wrote:
> > [dZ]. It's a shortened from of 'Gerald', indeed, as opposed to 'Jerry',
> > which is short for 'Jeremy'.
And I got so caught up in correcting him that I forgot to say thanks.
Thanks, Joe! Sorry. Joe.
-Marcos
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________
Message: 13
Date: Thu, 28 Oct 2004 06:41:19 -0700
From: "B. Garcia" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: (Mis)Naming a Language
On Thu, 28 Oct 2004 07:53:41 -0400, John Cowan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
In principle, I suppose, there could
> even be a plant called _Boa constrictor_.
It is not uncommon for botanists who discover new plants to make of
silly or humorous names (especially if the genus is a new genus). So
"Boa constrictor" could EASILY be a new genus and species of a plant.
For instance, the genus "Muilla" is a reversal of "Allium" (Muilla is
native to California and is in the Liliaceae with Allium). Linnaeus
even named the genus "Clitoria" after the female genetals (and
Clitoria ternatea really DOES look like the vulva and clitoris)
--
You can turn away from me
but there's nothing that'll keep me here you know
And you'll never be the city guy
Any more than I'll be hosting The Scooby Show
Scooby Show - Belle and Sebastian
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________
Message: 14
Date: Thu, 28 Oct 2004 13:52:37 -0000
From: caeruleancentaur <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: USAGE: name pronunciation
--- In [EMAIL PROTECTED], "Mark J. Reed" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
Attn Rightpondians . . .
>How do you pronounce the name "Gerry" - with a /g/ or with a /dZ/? I
>assume it is an alternate spelling of either "Gar[r]y" or "Jerry"; I
>would guess that it is the latter and is a shortened form
of "Gerald" - under which hypothesis it would be pronounced with
>a /dZ/, of course. But I seek confirmation from someone who
actually knows. :)
Thanks -
-Marcos
--- End forwarded message ---
I've never heard it pronounced with a /g/, which doesn't mean, of
course, that no one ever does. I've always used the /dZ/. I have a
friend whose name is Gerard & we call him Gerry.
Charlie
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________
Message: 15
Date: Thu, 28 Oct 2004 09:57:44 -0400
From: John Cowan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Bhutan's language(s) ?
Rodlox scripsit:
> out of curiosity, what is the language(s) of Bhutan? and to which
> languages(s) are it/they related? *curious*
Such questions as these are best answered at the Ethnologue
(http://www.ethnologue.com), which gives information on about 6500
languages, including where they are spoken and by approximately how
many speakers, and gives a fairly conservative family tree.
The relevant page for Bhutan is
http://www.ethnologue.com/show_country.asp?name=Bhutan , which shows that
Dzhongkha, a Tibetan language, is the dominant and indeed the official
language of the Kingdom. It is not closely related to (standard) Tibetan,
since it belongs to the Southern Tibetan rather than the Central Tibetan
group. ("Tibetan" is unfortunately the name of both a language and a
language family.)
A quick look shows that the other languages of Bhutan also belong to
the Tibetan family, except for a few outliers from other branches of
the Tibeto-Kanauri superfamily, and for Nepali, which is Indo-European.
Nepali has almost as many speakers as Dzongkha, being the dominant
language at lower elevations, particularly in the southern part of
the country.
--
A mosquito cried out in his pain, John Cowan
"A chemist has poisoned my brain!" http://www.ccil.org/~cowan
The cause of his sorrow http://www.reutershealth.com
Was para-dichloro- [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Diphenyltrichloroethane. (aka DDT)
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________
Message: 16
Date: Thu, 28 Oct 2004 07:03:28 -0700
From: "B. Garcia" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: USAGE: name pronunciation
On Thu, 28 Oct 2004 09:34:24 -0400, Mark J. Reed <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Not always. "Jerry" is sometimes short for "Jerome" (e.g. Seinfeld) and
> sometimes, despite the spelling, short for "Gerald" (e.g. my father).
>
> And for those on the list who are old enough and American enough to
> recognize the name: no, my father is not *that* Jerry Reed. :)
>
> -Marcos
>
The most interesting derviation of a "Jerry" i've known is a friend of
mine whose name is "Girolamo" but goes by "Jerry" since very few
pronounce Girolamo right. Often "Geronimo" or "/[EMAIL PROTECTED]/"
--
You can turn away from me
but there's nothing that'll keep me here you know
And you'll never be the city guy
Any more than I'll be hosting The Scooby Show
Scooby Show - Belle and Sebastian
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________
Message: 17
Date: Thu, 28 Oct 2004 14:05:02 -0000
From: caeruleancentaur <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: (Mis)Naming a Language
--- In [EMAIL PROTECTED], Simon Richard Clarkstone
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
David Peterson wrote:
> So, my question: Has something similar happened to anyone
> else? And, do you think I should change the name of the
> language? Would you, in this situation? Also, what if someone
> created a language with a name like Teonaht, not knowing
> that one already existed, and (with no disrespect to this
> imaginary person) was far better?
>>There is a simple method to avoid this in _many_ cases: use
>>Google. To search, it must build an index containing almost every
>>word on the web, and it even has a spelling checker (for those
>>close matches). If you are subscribed to a lingustic journal, you
>>may be able to access their index of articles/papers on their
>>website, though the text of the papers will not be available to the
>>general public. Specialised language indexes exist also, though the
>>only one I know is at LangMaker.com, and only searches their site.
--
Simon Richard Clarkstone
[EMAIL PROTECTED] / [EMAIL PROTECTED]
--- End forwarded message ---
Hot dang! I've finally been published. I googled for "senyecan" and
there it was: 4 hits! All having to do with these conlang group.
Can international acclaim be far behind!
Charlie
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________
Message: 18
Date: Thu, 28 Oct 2004 08:20:55 -0600
From: Muke Tever <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: (Mis)Naming a Language
On Thu, 28 Oct 2004 12:54:28 +0200, Andreas Johansson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>> > Besides the obvious pages, googling for Lindiga brings up quite a
>> > few pages in Estonian. [...]
>>
>> Apart from a certain Mr. Wieslaw Wenedyk Dam, who apparently ran in
>> Polish municipal elections a few years ago but was not elected, all
>> occurrences of Wenedyk refer to my language (most of which are
>> numerous different copies of Wiki pages and of the Google directory).
>
> Lemme see ...
>
> Tairezazh: Only hits related to my lang.
Whee..
�dlantki - my lang only
Atlantic - not even gonna try :p
Dunamy - my lang first; a Dunamys in .nz that sells computer hardware;
something in Korean and a few transliterated pages in .ee and .ru
(instrumental plural of something?)
Ibran - [Google: Did you mean _brian_?] my lang first; Ind�stria
Brasileira de Alimentos Naturais; Ibran Mustafic (a Bosnian); some
program in FORTRAN.
Kirumb - [Google: Did you mean _krumb_?] my lang first; a Luganda
glossary of some kind -- "kirumb" apparently means "stern" (of a boat);
someone's surname
Rami - too common a word [537,000 hits]
Sirius - no point trying ;p
Skeskatai - my lang only
Trentish - my lang first; a gamer's username; reasonably common adjective
meaning "of Trent" (the place, but sometimes a person's name);
*Muke!
--
website: http://frath.net/
LiveJournal: http://kohath.livejournal.com/
deviantArt: http://kohath.deviantart.com/
FrathWiki, a conlang and conculture wiki:
http://wiki.frath.net/
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________
Message: 19
Date: Thu, 28 Oct 2004 16:14:32 +0200
From: Rodlox <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Hobbits spoke Indonesian!
according to recent archeological discoveries, it is now known that Hobbits existed
in Indonesia...so, which language do you think they'd have known? :)
[This message contained attachments]
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________
Message: 20
Date: Thu, 28 Oct 2004 10:57:51 -0400
From: John Cowan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: (Mis)Naming a Language
Muke Tever scripsit:
> Ibran - [Google: Did you mean _brian_?] my lang first; Ind�stria
> Brasileira de Alimentos Naturais; Ibran Mustafic (a Bosnian); some
> program in FORTRAN.
Also the language spoken in the countries of Chalion and Ibra in
Lois McMaster Bujold's *other* universe, the one used as background
to _The Curse of Chalion_ and _Paladin of Souls_ (both recommended).
"Ibra" is clearly a variant of Iberia; Bujold is riffing on the
history of 15th-century Spain in a fantasy world with magic and five gods
(the heretics believe that the fifth god is a devil).
Bujold's comments are at http://www.dendarii.com/wtbbl.html .
Unfortunately for us conlangers, we don't get much (if anything)
of Bujold's Ibran except for a lot of proper names.
--
"They tried to pierce your heart John Cowan
with a Morgul-knife that remains in the http://www.ccil.org/~cowan
wound. If they had succeeded, you would http://www.reutershealth.com
become a wraith under the domination of the Dark Lord." --Gandalf
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________
Message: 21
Date: Thu, 28 Oct 2004 17:35:42 +0200
From: J�rg Rhiemeier <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: (Mis)Naming a Language
Hallo!
On Wed, 27 Oct 2004 22:50:04 -0500,
Herman Miller <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Hmmm.....
>
> Besides the obvious pages, googling for Lindiga brings up quite a few
> pages in Estonian. [...]
Let me see what Google retrieves when fed with my conlang names...
Albic: someone with that name; something in Albanian;
lots of stuff about soils; but #2 is the Relay 10
entry in Old Albic.
Old Albic: with one exception (about soils) my conlang and
conculture only.
Germanech: mostly my conlang, but also some stuff in Czech.
Greetings,
J�rg.
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________
Message: 22
Date: Thu, 28 Oct 2004 18:15:28 +0200
From: Rodlox <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: (Mis)Naming a Language
..watching the reply-to... :)
----- Original Message -----
From: B. Garcia <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <>
Sent: Thursday, October 28, 2004 3:41 PM
Subject: Re: (Mis)Naming a Language
> On Thu, 28 Oct 2004 07:53:41 -0400, John Cowan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:
> In principle, I suppose, there could
> > even be a plant called _Boa constrictor_.
>
> It is not uncommon for botanists who discover new plants to make of
> silly or humorous names (especially if the genus is a new genus). So
> "Boa constrictor" could EASILY be a new genus and species of a plant
Charles Darwin (yes, the famous one) once took revenge on a fellow
scientist(?) by naming a noxiously-smelly swamp plant after the guy.
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________
Message: 23
Date: Thu, 28 Oct 2004 09:34:35 -0600
From: Muke Tever <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: (Mis)Naming a Language
On Thu, 28 Oct 2004 10:57:51 -0400, John Cowan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> "Ibra" is clearly a variant of Iberia;
Which indeed is also the case for "Ibran" itself.
Which reminds me; even in Europe alone there are at least two different
Romance languages called "Ladino"; the one also called "Judeo-Spanish"
and a Rhaeto-Romance language more commonly in English called "Ladin".
*Muke!
--
website: http://frath.net/
LiveJournal: http://kohath.livejournal.com/
deviantArt: http://kohath.deviantart.com/
FrathWiki, a conlang and conculture wiki:
http://wiki.frath.net/
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________
Message: 24
Date: Thu, 28 Oct 2004 16:45:52 +0100
From: Chris Bates <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Japanese Long Consonants
I've read that Japanese Long consonants are actually a glottal stop and
another consonant together, which I guess is why I find it easier to
hear the difference in Japanese than in a language like Hungarian (where
the long consonants aren't formed by adding glottal stops). I was
thinking of introducing into a language a system of three accents:
unaccented eg i short
acute accent eg � long
grave accent eg � short, terminated by glottal stop.
So for instance I guess nippon written using this system would be n�pon.
But I'm not sure about this... I'm not sure if I should have long vowels
that can terminate with a glottal stop as well. I was thinking that this
system could let me do some interesting sound changes... like for
instance, d -> D inside words, like in spanish, but the change is
blocked by a glottal stop (which later gets dropped), so I could have:
d after any vowel without a grave accent: D
d word initially or after a vowel with a grave accent: d
Since these might be contrasted in some pairs, it wouldn't just be a
phonetic rule. I was thinking of a whole raft of similar changes I could
do that the glottal stops would influence, so the accents would alter
the pronounciation of the following consonant as well as the length of
the vowel. Although... Japanese doesn't allow "long" voiced stops I
don't think, although if I'm doing them right I don't have any problem
pronouncing them.
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________
Message: 25
Date: Thu, 28 Oct 2004 16:46:27 +0100
From: Chris Bates <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: OT: Exposure to Hormones in the Womb & Ability at Mathematics
In the New Scientist this week there was a short article in one the side
panels saying that someone had done a study of people studying
mathematics, chemistry or physics at university, or specifically the
ratio of the length of their index and ring fingers (apparently there is
evidence that this is determined by the levels of sex hormones babies
are exposed to while they're in the womb). Anyway, the mathematicians',
physicists' and chemists' ratios were higher than the male average,
between the male and female averages, which seems surprising since
mathematics etc are stereotypical "male" disciplines. So I can blame my
being a mathematician on my mother lol.
They also did the social sciences and discovered that the average ratio
was even lower than the male average, despite the fact that there is a
higher proportion of women in the social sciences than there is in
mathematics, physics or chemistry. *shrugs* Of course, this all depends
on their assumption that the ratio of ring and index fingers is strongly
related to exposure to sex hormones in the womb. But I thought someone
on the list might be interested... even though it doesn't explicitly
state results for the languages (Are languages social sciences?)
GGRRR.... whenever I try to address a message to the conlang list I
accidentally double click on the email address of my ex counsellor by
accident... I don't think she'd be interested in this kind of thing lol.
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Yahoo! Groups Links
<*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/conlang/
<*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
<*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
------------------------------------------------------------------------
